Would you vote to re-join the EU in another referendum?

[GorgeousSpringtime]

Simple question. If there is another referendum to re-join the EU, will you be voting to re-join?

This isn't to have a go at anyone who supported Brexit, or who supported Remain, it's just a quick straw poll. Thank you.

If anyone is wondering, (or cares!) I think I will vote to re-join. (I won't say at this point what I voted for last time...)

No I would not vote to re-join. We can't keep chopping and changing - is the plan to have a referendum every time a new Government is in power with perhaps a resultant in, out, in, out scenario? I also do not want to join the Euro which I am pretty sure they would insist on.

I used to be a staunch EC supporter when it did what it was set up to do - i.e. be a large trading bloc, but the way it has developed into a monster, wielding power over so many countries, is all wrong. We would end up subsidising all the Eastern European countries and be out of pocket. I'm also not interested in free movement.

Only if they rescind the rule on 'caps being tethered to plastic bottles'.

On the basis Andy Burnham's speech was setting out his election manifesto rather than a plan for actual government now, it's clear he is using the promise of a vote to get the Remainers to vote Labour in the hope of another referendum. I suppose some people will be fooled and he may win an election on the back of those votes. Despite again not knowing what they are voting for. And once again the country will be swept into the hell and division of black and white arguments about an issue that is very much shades of grey.

However my worry is that if he promises another referendum in his manifesto he must also agree to another Scottish referendum. How can he not? The same principle applies if you agree with the argument that if people may or may not have changed their minds then we need to hold another referendum to find out. N Ireland may want a vote. Wales is run by separatists. And the results if they go against the UK won't be cleansing and cathartic it will lead to decades of wrangling and upheaval. And everyone will be poorer as politicians focus on getting the foundations right and the split fair and what relationship we have...Brexit a million times worse. Do we have the sort of politicians with the ability and brains to do this? Clearly we do not.

What?

Is it really hard to understand why people who have lives in the UK, jobs in the UK, families in the UK and friends in the UK would choose to stay in the UK despite being disappointed with the outcome of the referendum?

Some did indeed move but there would have been a large degree of risk involved in moving to Europe after the vote, trying to build a new life there and then finding out that under a Brexit deal you might not be eligible to stay there. I personally know of more Brits that were already living in Europe deciding to stay longer after the Brexit vote in order to qualify for citizenship, rather than returning to the UK.
And lastly there are a much larger number of Brits that applied for second passports such as Irish passports if they were eligible for them.

I do have a theory though on rejoining the EU.
One of the arguments for leaving the EU was that the UK as a relatively wealthy nation paid in more to the EU than it got back in order to subsidise the poorer eastern and southern European countries.

When the UK originally joined the EEC in the 1970s it was because the UK was effectively bankrupt after successive Labour Governments trashed the economy.

Now if the current Labour government can successfully trash the UK economy again( and to be fair they seem to be doing an impressive job of it) then if the UK did rejoin the EU it would be as a relatively poorer country and in which case the UK would get more out of the EU than it contributed! Da dah - genius logic...

Another 10 million migrants to UK? No, thanks.

Why should people have to move just because they love Europe?

Can they not love the UK too?

Brexit took away British people’s freedom of movement. So it became a lot harder.

What an utterly bizarre nonsensical rationale. From a Brexshitter no doubt.

We have been getting on with it.

Except we are still free to make other decisions based upon learning about the impact of previous decisons.

whether you like it or not.

I have no issue with immigration to the UK it's just a question of are they net tax contributors to the economy or net recipients, do they wish to integrate into the existing UK culture or create their own enclaves and the number of immigrants and how many can the the existing public services and infrastructure can cope with each year.

in 25 years the UK population has increased by 10 million or nearly 20 %. Services and infrastructure has not been able to keep pace with this. So if you want to know why you can't get a doctor's appointment or buy a house or why stuff doesn't seem to work then it's because of the population increase.

Immigrants are often cited as net tax contributors but this looks at the individual working and ignores the cost of the family unit which is absolutely a net cost.

As for integration clearly not all cultures are equally compatible with existing UK culture.

This. I was a strong Remainer and gutted at the time. But I would never vote in favour of rejoining if it meant adopting the EURO.

Also, the European political landscape has changed a lot in ten years. The AfD wins the next German election, and Brussels is talking appeasement if they get really nasty? What then? Not sure we would all have had the same approach to COVID and there are other foreign policy issues (relationship with the US/approach to Russia/China/Israel) that we'd have to get behind. Not even onto migration. So - free market and freedom of movement - absolutely! Some of the other stuff I don't know. Never thought I'd say that.

I would still vote No as I do not feel the relationship ship was balanced and fair in terms of whst we put in vs what we got out of it. Its morphed into another nightmare where we are pouring in money and the benefits didn't stack up. I am all for helping others but we have problems at home to sort out and I would rather the money was spent at home first.

The Scottish independence is a strange one, because Scotland wants to split from the UK to gain independence, only to join the EU to give it up again. Work that one out.

I think it is clear Burnham has decided to take a stance on membership of the EU. So leading on from that I think there is a chance that at some point Labour are going to try to alter the voting base further.

They already have the plan of allowing 16 year olds the vote. Soon they might(!) be arguing that people with leave to remain should also be allowed to vote to shore up their support base.

They've already decided to start policy changes that affect the older cohort and are talking about removing the triple lock. Rejoining the EU is another policy that plays to the younger and not older cohort.

I think their strategy is hoping the older cohort vote will be split between the Tories and Reform, and they are hoping to gather the Liberal and maybe some of the Green vote, while at the same time shoring up the voter base to get more support. Electoral "reform" may also feed into this.

I suppose the question will be whether enough of the traditional "red wall" Labour votes defect to reform, or whether either the Tories or Reform collapse will determine whether their strategy is successful. I don't see a pact between the Tories and Reform being likely.

Well lets see...he'd be a fool to open that Pandora's box.

It seems he already has.

What an idiot. The most contentious issue in decades and he decides to go there to get votes. Unbelievable. But unsurprising. This is Labour.

Lol. All those who were banging on about "the will of the people" after the Brexit referendum really don't like the fact that "the will of the people" might have changed as a result of realising that Brexit wasn't such a good idea after all.

The country made a terrible decision in 2016. That doesn't mean that we should expect future generations to live with the impact of that bad decision for years to come. If Burnham sees that there is significant public support for revisiting the issue, why on earth should he avoid doing so simply to spare the feelings of the die-hard Brexiteers who won't ever acknowledge what a monumental fuck-up it has been because they don't want to admit that they were wrong?

Exactly this.

Brexshitters know the vote was won on lies.

The British people can see what nonsense and utterly stupid idea it was and have felt the impact.

Leave voters hate the thought of democracy enabling a choice once more and their being declared wrong.

Whether it works in his favour we’ll see. I don’t think the EU is doing that well, plenty of issues there, and the Euro is not worth taking to re-join.

At least it’ll be decided if it’s a no thanks.

@MrsBennetsPoorNervesAreBack ,

‘The country made a terrible decision in 2016. That doesn't mean that we should expect future generations to live with the impact of that bad decision for years to come. If Burnham sees that there is significant public support for revisiting the issue, why on earth should he avoid doing so simply to spare the feelings of the die-hard Brexiteers who won't ever acknowledge what a monumental fuck-up it has been because they don't want to admit that they were wrong?’

Basically I agree with the above. In addition, it is estimated that just joining the single market will add around $50 billion to our GDP over time. That’s 1.7% of GDP. It would make a massive difference to spending plans at a very critical time.

Whether we could have made Brexit work is debatable, and whether making it work would have been popular is even more debatable. We didn’t even really try, though, so we need to eat some humble pie and rejoin the single market.

Again if people loved free movement and the ability to move so much then there was a whole period they could have moved and gotten EU residency. But they didn't.

Read my previous messages. Your last sentence isn't really an argument.

@GasPanic I don't see a pact between the Tories and Reform being likely.

No, neither do I. Kemi Badenoch has been consistently clear that she doesn't want a pact with Reform.

She last ruled it out in August I believe, when she dismissed Reform UK as “people fighting all the time” and insisted voters would not back a “monstrous Reform-Conservative hybrid”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/kemi-badenoch-reform-uk-tory-pact-b3037714.html

But just because you love Europe doesn’t mean you have to want to live there. Temporarily or permanently or even at all. That’s the whole point of freedom of movement. You can choose. You can have a preference today that might change tomorrow.

Besides there’s an awful lot more to EU membership than FoM.

It strikes me that there are some people who hate others having choices. Or being able to change their minds. Which is frightening.

@Twiglets1 and @GasPanic ,

‘’No, neither do I. Kemi Badenoch has been consistently clear that she doesn't want a pact with Reform.

https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/uk-opinion-polls

We aren’t a two party system any more. The Tories have to make some kind of pact with reform at some point or they become an irrelevance.

I thought they had a good chance to make a case for the single market and it might have got them back into play, but Burnham has now taken that.

Why do you have to resort to name calling on those who voted for it. Why can't you make a reasonable mature comment. Its attitudes like this from those who are pro Eu fmthat is so off putting. 🙄