Is it worth trying to prove cheating in a divorce?

[IRememberWhenThisWasAllFieldsAndCakePunching]

It’s a long one, so buckle up…

80 year old FIL disappeared overnight this year, leaving 75 year old MIL, their son and grandson very distressed. It became apparent over the following month of limited communication that he was leaving her. All sorts of lies started coming out of the woodwork, and I mean ALL sorts.

we have discovered that he is living with MIL’s best friend around three hours away. They have been spotted holding hands etc. he has been on holiday with her twice. He will not tell us where he is living or who with, but we know he is with her.

he wishes to sell their house, divorce and move on. MIL is frantic because, once various things have been taken in to account, a 50/50 split will leave her with less than £100k, meaning she will not be able to buy somewhere and renting is very difficult with the three big dogs they bought together but he has left her with.

We know adultery isn’t a thing for divorces anymore, but her solicitor has told her it isn’t worth trying to prove it at all. She can’t afford a solicitor really, and has taken advice from a couple over the last few months with their free consultations and has found that their advice on the same topic can vary.

What I am asking is - is it worth gathering evidence that he is living in a relationship? Will it affect the financial split if it goes before a judge? MIL needs 60/40 really, or 70/30, but it would involved regular travel on a six hour round trip.

I would happily do it, he’s repulsed me, damaged my son and my partner and really disrupted our lives because MIL relies heavily on us now. I would love to wreak havoc and see him lose out financially, but if it isn’t going to make a material difference, I can’t really warrant the diesel expense!

This.

He will have to go to court to force a sale. By this time they will probably be living together and your Mil will have grounds for more (possibly) on a single income as opposed to their joint one.

There are also pensions and savings to consider, not just the house.

In theory its 50/50 but in reality if he is going to be more comfortable because he's living with his new 'lady', and your mil will be destitute then a judge could well award in her favour.

Court is a long road tho...

I'd sit tight and let him sweat. What a pig. Your poor Mil.

With this no fault divorce there is no proving anything. I think she needs to sit tight in the house. I can't see a judge evicting her at her age. If his pension is better than hers she can make a claim on that I think.

I understand that your DH is very upset with his Dad, but would there be any mileage in him going to talk with him, and suggesting that in the interests of family harmony and keeping damage to the minimum would his Dad consider not claiming the house and effectively throwing his mother out because while he has a home, his mother will lose her home, has lost her best friend and (lay this on thick) will have to have the dogs PTS because she will be unable to house them in a small rented flat.

OR is there any possibility of her family clubbing together to buy FIL out and own his half of the house between them?

This 💯

Her divorce will be needs-based. If you can prove he's moved in with this other woman, then yes, it could make a difference to the final settlement. Because his living costs are shared with a partner, whereas hers are not.
However, and here's the rub, it would have to be a Judge that decides that. And it costs ££££££ to take it through court.
If it's going to be agreed via mediation or just between themselves, the best she can do is to argue her case, based on what a court might rule.
I think she might be best stringing it out as long as possible.
80 years old! God, men are just unbelievable aren't they. And her friend?!! Your poor MIL.

What happens if you decline mediation

You don’t let people walk all over you.

Delay
Delay
Delay

Then throw what ever you can at them

How much does fil have in his pension, savings accounts.

How much has he been spending on this other woman because I would argue deprivation of assets.

If he has spent £5000 on going on holiday with this woman then that could be considered,
For me it’s about £5000 less he should receive
Does he gamble, drink?

Its about clawing as much money/valuations into the pot as possible so on dividing it there is a possibility of keeping the house or having enough to buy something else.

You don’t just say it’s too difficult to bother.

FIL refuses communication with all of us, he stopped talking to his son the day he left MIL, on any real level, anyway. When FIL came back in April to collect more of his things (read - came on holiday with his mistress five miles down the road from his wife) DP spotted him in a shop car park and tried to speak to him, asked him where he was living and FIL said ‘it’s got nothing to do with you.’

i cornered him on the same day and read him the riot act about how despicably he’d treated his son and grandson, which resulted in a birthday card for my son a week later and that’s almost been it since.

he’s definitely living with her already. Ex best friend sent a message to MIL by mistake ten days or so ago with a picture of a pergola in her garden, saying, ‘the pergola (FIL) made me, isn’t he clever? I’ve been to your house and watered your plants, hope you’ve had a lovely holiday!’ And family friends who were in the area a few months ago took a picture of his car on her drive. Prior to that, on their first holiday here, they were spotted on a beach holding hands, and walking into a pub (owned by friends of the family) also holding hands. Neither of them has any shame.

I'd keep out of it now. Is he your fil or your partners dad? If he won't communicate then play him at his own game. He can employ a solicitor for any future communication. Is there legal cover on her home insurance.

He does only communicate through his solicitor. He’s infuriating and such a dick.

Sorry, he is my partner’s dad, but, for ease, I refer to DP’s parents as my in laws!

The affair is neither here nor there as far as any divorce settlement is concerned. Will make no difference to who is due what. But worth checking with solicitor what she entitled to in terms of pensions etc.

They each have state and private pensions, both totalling around £1500 a month each. Or hers total £1100 and his maybe £1500, so not much in it.

Well yes of course he’s a dickhead. But legally that doesn’t mean he’s entitled to less of the joint assets. Moral and legal are completely different things.

I sympathise with your MIL but she’ll only lose more money trying to fight it. Unfortunately she will need to rent, like many other people.

No how a relationship ended makes no difference legally. Could she look into shared ownership providing there is no upper age limit. Uc may help with rent if/when her money dwindles.

I agree with delay, delay, obstruct, delay....

If it comes to the worst look at properties available to O-55s - not 'retirement complexes' though.

Usually much cheaper

YES YES YES IT MAY MAKE A DIFFERENCE TO THE DIVORCE SETTLEMENT

OP don’t listen to people on here who don’t know what they’re talking about, repost this on the Legal Matters board where there are real solicitors who can hopefully advise you.

Everyone is right that the cheating is neither here nor there in terms of divorce HOWEVER if you can prove he’s been living with his partner for at least 6 months (MIL needs to delay until this point is reached) then yes it absolutely can make a difference to the divorce settlement as he will be seen as suitably housed; he will also have to disclose a summary of his partner's income, assets, and liabilities to the best of his knowledge on Form E. If you have proof he’s been living with her for 6 months then he can’t lie about it and it will at least be considered as his housing needs will be met.

Where does his post go yo. Is he still on the electoral roll and council tax.

He had his post redirected but chose not to disclose on the form, so he is constantly doing his best to hide his whereabouts from us. He thinks he is so clever.

I would post this in legal matters.
The pension difference is important- he shouldn't just get extra 400 pcm and that could be used in a house calculation.
The mediator's goal is to get the two parties to an agreement. They will not represent your mum's interests or whether things are 'fair' for either oar
ty. Make sure your MIL has her limits clear in mind before she goes in. The delay tactic is fine logically but psychologically it can be very difficult to have this all hanging over you. Court does not have to cost £££ if you self represent. Solicitors letters cost and he can keep sending them, she doesn't have to respond!

Any idea what medication he takes or if he has any ailments?

At 80 years of age he isn't in the first flush of youth and nature could well take it course faster than the divorce...

It makes no difference whatsoever why a person wants a divorce.

MiL shouldn't be filling in any more paperwork. As the Respondent she can just ignore the letters and refuse to engage. Let the deadlines lapse. Sod him.

I agree about posting on the legal matters board. I think you can report your post and ask Mumsnet to move the whole thread.

I also agree with delaying things, as I believe if he's been living with the other woman for 6 months or more then he is considered adequately housed (but check with a solicitor!)

I agree with a PP that he's 80, with enough delaying on your MIL's part, nature may take its course ...

Not worth trying to prove it as there is nothing legally to gain and divorce is increasingly becoming a no fault paper process.

As far as I can recall the living together question isn’t relevant to the divorce itself but to any possible impact on a financial settlement.

Speak to a lawyer