Having to pay for work team building day

[Notanawayday]

Name changed for this.

I work part time for the NHS band 3 with colleagues who are band 6/7 so obviously better paid.

Every year we have no choice but to go on an afternoons team building day. Patient diaries are blocked out so my colleagues can go and admin have to attend too.

Last year it was bowling, year before pottery painting so not too expensive.

We have raised before about the trust we work for paying for us to go as it is on work time and we have no choice but to attend. Last year a couple of colleagues couldn’t afford the bowling had to sit there and watch.

There is no way our trust will pay for this forced team building day so there is no point even raising it again.

I was on annual leave last week when it was decided by our clinicians team lead that we will all be getting the train then a tube to Canary Wharf where we will be going to some sort of quiz event involving completing puzzles. Entry fee is £25 and then have to pay for food and drinks and of course train and fare tube which we can’t claim back. Whole cost will be around£60 and we will be there longer than our work finish time.

Im so fed up. I don’t want to spend money to attend a work team building day. A lot of the clinicians I work with are looking forward to it because it means half a day of not having to see patients and of course they earn way more than us lowly admin.

I think I will have to say I can’t afford to attend and will stay at work and actually do my job. I know already how it will pan out, constantly being pressurised to attend, being told I will have a good time and how I have to go to be part of the team etc etc

I’ve worked in further education and the civil service and never had to pay to attend a work team building day and yet the NHS managers think this is ok?!!!

Get everything in an email trail. Email your manager:

I am emailing regarding the work away day on xx.xx.26. My understanding is that any costs involved in getting to y venue and taking part in z event will not be reimbursed. I am not happy to pay these costs myself, but am of course available for work on the above date. I will not be attending the away day but will be present at 'AN Other NHS Trust site' to work my usual shift.

Kind regards etc.

Absolutely

Appalling @NotanawaydayI certainly wouldn’t want to pay to attend an away day either!

Our comm rehab team had a team building day but it was held in a room near the offices and consisted of some speakers and also useful clinical sessions (eg new equipment or resources demonstrated by suppliers) as well as a few fun “team building” type things and the inevitable “get into groups to ….”

We all appreciated this annual day where we actually learnt something useful and had an opportunity to get together as a team as we tended to be like ships passing in the night.

No cost to us and I think a light lunch was provided.

Given the loss of clinical hours it needs to have some benefit to both staff and patients!

According to Google AI, this could constitute "Unlawful Deduction from Wages" and could breach minimum wage laws if having to pay this out of your own pocket would bring your effective wage under NMW.

The previous trips were also dodgy, because your car insurance does not usually cover you travelling to somewhere that isn't your normal place of work if you are going for work purposes.

Please, speak up!

What was the point of someone coming along to watch someone else bowl??

This is crazy. Just call in sick. Or say I can't afford it and go to work. No one can make you go to this.

I work for the NHS and we have to do this and I think it’s appalling too. They give us the afternoon off for free and we can do something as a team, but we have to pay for all ourselves. I’d rather just have the afternoon off and go home, and have a team cup of coffee every now and then. I’ve only worked for the NHS for five years and everything else has been private practice. I can’t believe they can’t stump up 20 quid for a Christmas lunch or something. Before people have suggested things like ax throwing and then a Christmas lunch but I honestly don’t want to spend 50 or £60 doing forced fun with a team that I don’t hardly see cause I work at home. For the past two years I pretended to be sick or needed to do childcare. I’m more than happy to go in the office and talk to my team, but I’m not paying 60 quid to do something with them on my free afternoon off. This is a one thing that I think is really poor about working for the NHS. Forced fun and you have to pay for your own team building activities.

I am a retired clinician and clinical manager. I would NEVER have expected staff to pay for any compulsory activity and we didn't do "team building days" We did do service planning days and half days which were fun as well as productive but we ran them on base or close by. If they were off base and incurred extra travel costs, we covered them plus lunch.....and we were a stony broke service operating in a really old worn out shoe string. Check with HR on policies first to see if there is anything written down about staff paying for compulsory activities in work time. There might also be a policy about non clinical activity in work time.

No employer can force you to spend money you don’t have. You say I’m not attending but be present and available for work. Stick to your guns politely. If they are not reimbursing, you cannot be forced to do not let your better paid colleagues guilt you into it.

Also, the poor patients.

if its an afternoon off, how can they force you to do something? Again I'd be checking this out with HR.

Bit pissed off if our tax dollar is paying for this..
Absolutely you (OP) shouldn't have to pay.. not a chance would I be going.

I am within the MoD, so still public sector

The bottom line would be that if it cannot be justified to pay for the absolute minimum of travel and entry to the main event then the event cannot be justified

I have not run anything like this for many years so could be long out of date but we have two definitions that fall within this area:

Team building - this must have a clear “training objective” and any individual can undertake one team building event per year
That doesn’t mean bowling etc cannot take place but “tasks” must be integrated or the primary event has the “fun/enforced fun” added on.
This is a training event, and should be fully funded (which may be event funding or claimable expenses) There can be personal expenses (and very likely would be) such as a meal will cost more than policy limits

Team cohesion - this can be as often as justifiable, and is more of a “getting to know” people. The purpose of this is that the team has a need, therefore you can attend any number.

As this is “getting to know each other/relationship building” it has less rules on what is allowed.
I can’t remember if the funding rules differ, but would still include the travel and entry

If the organisers cannot justify expense then they cannot justify the event (to the degree of the Daily Mail test if it became known)

Side activity’s on top are / should be an option
The main problem here is the management team/ organisers coming up with things that they want to do and cannot justify (or are too lazy to work out how to justify)

kindness awful isn’t it?

We have to pay for our own Christmas meals too. Every time a colleague leaves which is often we have to pay into a collection and then pay towards a leaving lunch. There is no choice.

Recently a manager left and we were told to transfer £5 to our line manager towards a cream tea, no choice given to not partake as diaries were closed for 3 hours while we all travellled to said managers work site to sit around eating a forced lunch!!

I would rather work but no choice given.

I work in the private sector, but whenever I've done a team thing like this and there hasn't been a budget to pay for it, all the senior staff have agreed to cover the costs.

Any manager with half a brain would know that people on significantly lower salaries might have different spending priorities.

I don't see how they can force you to pay for food and drink. Just don't order any? Or bring your own.

I don't really see how they can actually penalise or discipline you in any meaningful way if you tell them you're not available that day. Or you genuinely cannot afford to pay. What do HR say?

They cannot compel this, just ignore

or you could whistleblow to HR or the governors or even HMRC if the cost of a compulsory activity would take you below min wage that month

Admin can belong to a Union - maybe look into this. ACAS maybe worth contacting in the meantime for advice.
Could be worth looking at the Trusts policies about team building days. What you are describing sounds appalling and akin to bullying due to humiliation. (You cannot afford the day but you have to sit there whilst others do the activities.) How is that team building?
If they are going to be that aggressive and pushy about it I would be calling in sick on the day! (And I'm not one to suggest that lightly).

Stop sending the money across. Pretend you forgot or something. I'd call in sick that day if you get sick pay.

How about not saying anything & then just not turn up on the day -send a sick note?!
apologies, just seen some1 else said this

Just say no, ideally several of you because it’s easier that way, if there’s repercussions take it higher

What would happen if you didn’t go?

I can’t believe you are being bullied into spending money at work. It’s insane!

Clearly you don't have to pay for this so just say you're not doing so.

Speak to your union rep.

Agreed on all counts.

She isn't a union member.