Views on androgen insensitivity and women’s sport participation

superficial means at a surface level. If externally they resemble women but internally are male then they are men who superficially resemble women.

Yes it is. Not part of the women league.

I do think CAIS should be treated an exception on many fronts but if female sport is to be one of those exceptions it has to be closely monitored with the understanding that if the result of that monitoring is an over representation that it's means there is some degree on advantage and therefore the exception can no longer apply.

It is sad that talented athletes have to drop their dream if they suffer injury or become ill in a way that impacts their performance.

It is sad that people of a certain physical type will never excell at certain sports e.g. an average height man won't become a basketball star.

But either sport is fair or we do away with any ranking and give everyone a medal for turning up.

The person in the Instagram reel has said three important things - they have internal testes, they produce male levels of testosterone, they have XY chromosomes.
If they play sports, then they should be playing in the male category.

They also lack that ability to process the testosterone. Having a male testosterone level means nothing if you cannot utilise that testosterone.

Men with medical conditions are still men.

Why do you disagree with the medical consensus that people with CAIS are female?

They are not female. There is no such medical consensus let alone scientific one. At most doctors may agree to ‘treat as though they are female’ but you only need to look at the various maternity scandals to see what the medical profession think of women.

Do you have a link for that NHS quote please?

I did search for it but I couldn't find it.

Thank you

Unfortunately for your argument, it remains a fact only males can have CAIS or PAIS. So this person is not female. Apart from being female, how can one be a woman?

Because CAIS is only found in males. As has been explained often.

Here's the link.

You may also want to look up how Prof Robert Winston says sex should be determined. He says that SRY gene plus functional testosterone receptors is male and everyone else is female. Hes an expert in human sex and reproduction as well as being a sex realist

.https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/differences-in-sex-development/

Not according to the NHS

Ummm…..

Genes usually seen in males with genitals that look the same as most girls' and some internal male structures
So males then….

Explain to me why I should accept your definition of the sex of people with CAIS rather than that of the NHS or Prof Robert Winston

Um… that’s literally the heading from the link you just quoted….

Complete insensitivity to androgens makes a person with XY chromosomes female

This is what i originally quoted

But it is a section on male VSD. Mind you, the NHS also believes a male can be a woman so….

Sex is about the production of gametes not body type. Where there are errors in development that prevent gametes then it is the gametes the body type is organised to produced. CAIS = testes = male.

Saying ‘but their external genitalia looks female’ is just and extension of saying women are simply men without a penis or that all embryos start as female because they don’t have a penis. Or that chopping off your penis makes you a woman.

Again, why should I accept your definition over that of Prof Robert Winston. Are you an expert in human sex and reproduction?

In sports it's not clear whether CAIS provides an advantage as the studies did not properly distinguish between CAIS and PAIS.

If CAIS is shown to give an advantage in the female category then I would be happy for CAIS athletes to be barred from the female category for sports.

I think this sounds like a reasonable accommodation regarding sport as long, as you say, it is closely monitored.

How many places should these men be allowed to steal from women before you decide it isn’t acceptable?

The thread has demonstrated in several places that there is not necessarily a consensus about whether these people are men. As I said, it sounds reasonable, but it would need more research, and there would need to be more general agreement about whether competitors are men or women. It’s not going to happen tomorrow, if it happens at all.

A quicker and easier solution would be a Female category, that excludes anyone with a DSD, and an Open category, for everyone else.

Again though, as raised previously, the question is why so much energy is being devoted to a very few edge cases. We know why, which is that they are useful for gender ideologues who want to muddy the waters around sex classifications to allow transwomen access to female spaces, services and sports.

You don't fool anyone with a brain.

You know full well is about trans issues and the trans lobby using people with DSD to prise open doors to defining femininity to include men who think they are women.