What do you do when 2 of you have busy and unpredicatable jobs?

[CountessDracula]

Had a bit of a row with my dh last night because I am working away 3 days this week which means leaving the house before 7am each day. Our nanny doesn't start until 8am and he has suddenly got really busy at work and needs to get in early to deal with stuff (he knew before I was working away and suddenly got all shirty about it last night with no warning!)

I can completely see his point of view, he is a Lawyer, stuff comes up that is unpredictable and he has to react appropriately. However, I am an Business Analyst/Project Mgr and my work takes me all over the place - I can't just say to a client (who is paying £1500 a day for my services!) "oh sorry, my husband has to get in early so I won't be with you until 11am, then I have to leave at 4.30pm as I have to get back for my nanny!"

Just wondered how the rest of you deal with this.

I am dreading it when dd goes to nursery when she is 2.5. Then there will be no room for flexibility at all. I think we will have to get an au pair which I really didn't want as I hate the idea of someone else living in our house :(

Short of moving to be near my parents for more support, I am not really sure what to do. The other option of course is for one of us to give up our job, but that would then entail moving house as we couldn't afford to stay where we are on one salary.

You've probably thought of this already but could you ask the nanny to come in earlier? Pay her a bonus or give her extra time off in lieu?

Delgirl, the nanny already has to work late often (for which we pay her extra) and she has a dd of her own who is 13, she has to get her off to school etc and we don't feel it's fair to her to make her work extra hours both ends of the day.

Umm, we row, have a spreadsheet on which we fill in all our early and late hours, row, beg nanny to come earlier and then give her extra 'toil' short days, or money, row, sometimes have had friend to babysit and stay over til childcare starts in morning, row, I woke up this a.m to find DP sitting up in bed working on laptop since 5.30 a.m....

cd, this week isn't typical is it? maybe you need to get a nanny/childminder who's got more flexibility both ends of the day, if this is going to happen a lot. otherwise it's big stress for all of you, i'm sure.

Fair enough but it may be worth asking her anyway and say no pressure but she may be grateful of some extra cash perhaps? If I was the nanny and it wasn't expected of me every single week then i'd be happy to do it but as she has her own dd I can see it's difficult. It may be worth advertising for someone to come in early. I was nanny years ago then changed jobs completely but to make some cash I went and babysat in the mornings for a nurse who did a nightshiift and who's husband had to leave early. May suit an older person maybe?

we alternate who's dropping off/picking up at nursery and when dh is away i obviously do it all (no family nearby) and office v understanding. this is why my job has taken a bit of a backseat over the last few years, felt it was the only way to accommodate the changes caused by having a young family. i really don't mind it though.

CD - we used to have this problem - and I'm afraid my solution was to take redundancy as I was the one who had all the stress of making arrangements.
Sorry if that's not much help

I'm afraid this is going to be the norm - I haven't had the problem for a while as I have been off sick with glandular fever for a while, then working from home for 8 weeks.

I have to stay away overnight occasionally (quite a lot lately) and dh is so good, never complains and is fantastic with dd. I think the row last night was because he had forgotten that I was leaving so early and his work had suddenly got busy. I don't blame him I would be the same.

From October I am working a lot about 1hr drive each way away so that should be easier.

What do you do when they go to school ffs?

CD - we juggle like hell - same as you I guess! Try to be organised as to who has which committments when but invariably something comes along which upsets the plan.

At the moment DH has moved to a job which has little travel which is bliss after the last one where he was away a lot. However, next move from him will almost definately be one whihc involves travel and I do think that when that one comes I may just give it all up. Fed up with all the hassle and sometimes I would love it to be me that they see at the school gate

As for the nursery thing, don't worry too much we did and have now found a lovely nanny/housekeeper who just works afternoons. She does an hour or so of cleaning/tidying/cooking then goes and picks them up from school and then takes them to tennis/horseriding whatever. We get home about 6.30 - 7.00. It has worked out really well for us after being driven nearly insane worrying about how we were going to cope!

(oh and on the upside I do work on average 2 days a week from home, which means that he can go in as early as he likes those days. They change each week though and a lot of my stuff is quite last minute arrangements, nature of the job I'm afraid).

Thanks soapbox - I am actually interview someone for that very role this week as our cleaner has left, so I figured I could try and combine the 2 roles. Will let you know how I get on!

I travel about the same as you and I try to give pre-warning. He has a week on call every month and I am not allowed to travel that week at all!!! Basically, he leaves earlier in the morning and I do the school run, then get to work about 9.30am. We then have a massive ding dong on the phone about 5pm to 'negotiate' who is going home first. I normally win and get home about 7.15pm!!! But I only work three days a week, so he can work really hard on those other two days or go out or whatever.... I am afraid that as the major breadwinner I do pull rank every so often, but try not to as its not nice to do. If all else fails, we ask the nanny for an extra hour then try to be super nice to her and give extra time off to make up. We are probably going to do a live in arrangement soon, really just to cope with all this toooing and froing.

CD - I work fulltime and DH works away 3 days per week. I get fed up as I have just as challenging a job yet still have to manage the kids/childcare/housework/bills/everything. My only saving is that I work from home so do alot of thiswhile on conference calls - managed to clean all the windows on a 2 hr call last week. I do sometimes end up working when the kids are in bed or at weekends to make up time. Can you get a live-in nanny? If not you will just have to be firm and schedule all your meetings so you can work a normal day - I have started to refuse meetings early or late afternoon and so far have had no advserse feedback

I'm afraid, like iota, we gave up in the end and I stopped working. We sold our lovely, convenient flat and moved further out to a place that wasn't much bigger (in an attempt to manage the mortgage on one salary). Unless we had someone who lived in, there was absolutely no way we could cope when both of us were busy or one of us had to travel and the other was busy. As we could never predict when those times were going to happen, it was virtually impossible to plan live-out childcare.

I do sympathise. I'm in the process now of looking for work for next year and my eldest will be at school and that makes it even more complicated!

The other option is to use 2 different people. I know a few people round here use other people's live-in aupairs to look after their kids from early in the morning (i.e. they get dropped off at the aupair's place) and then use a childminder/nanny to pick them up from there (at say 9ish) or school and then they do the rest of the day (till bedtime). That way, at least you don't have to feel guilty if the nanny has to stay late.

The more people involved, the more hassle though I guess and it means you don't get to see your little ones much either! I always found one of the biggest problems was the travel - a right pain!

Hi,

My dd1 has just started school and I have a nanny. Both dh and I have agreed to share the responsibility and we have both applied to have our working hours changed. The nanny comes at 07.00 am Mondays and Tuesdays. I'm changing my hours to allow me to take dd1 to school on Wednesdays and Thursdays and dh is doing it on Friday. In terms of going away we try were possible to give each other as much notice as possible - but that could be as much as weeks or as little as hours. If we have a clash then we try to discuss priority but basically it comes down to a first come first served basis. If I already know that dh is going to be away then I will already be trying to shift things so as not to clash. Unfortunately both of us have been in the horrible situation of telling work that basically the kids come first and my partner can't cover etc.

In terms of illness, this is why we've gone the nanny route. We have a younger daughter who is not at school so having the nanny sit around all day is not yet an issue. However we share our nanny with another family where the children are all at school. This means that in the morning and in the evening she has all four kids but during the day its just my dd2. You might want to look for a share nanny like this. It will halve the costs for you whilst giving you someone else to share the problem. Like others have said - as long as you don't do it too often I'm sure my nanny at least wouldn't hestitate to help out.

Good luck cd

we switched from a daily live out nanny to a live in au pair/nanny when our youngest started school last January and the impact has been incredible. We no longer have the "my commitments are less moveable than yours" arguments as we have much more flexibility at both ends of the day. We worry about exploiting her but she seems happy and we are scrupulous about respecting her arrangements - if she's going out we aren't late back. The secret seems to be loads of communication and advance planning but given your job that should be easy for you. Our household operates on lists and critical path analysisLike you, I wasn't keen on someone else living in our house but it's been absolutely no problem - we have a really nice girl with us and have all just agreed to extend for a second year. .

Thanks all of you - it's nice to hear that we aren't the only ones with these issues.

I think I will be looking at the housekeeper/occasional picker up of dd and the au pair options much more closely.

We do the whole alternate dropping off/picking up thing too! It is a nightmare - but we try to plan things well in advance so that all trips and meetings get planned around whether you'll be in later or have to leave early. I also work in Project Management so I know what pressures you must be under.

Things do move too - I had to go to San Francisco recently for work for a whole week and dh had to do everything - but we knew in advance and he sorted it out with his work. He has to go to the US next year for a week and then I'll have to do everything so it swings both ways and it's going to be tough for me to deliver to the client and be around for dd the whole week.

We still have arguements about swapping days when either of us has a late meeting. Next week for example, I have a late Steering Committee so have asked Dh to pick dd up. He's supposed to be at a company off-site involving an overnight stay. Like Beachyhead - I'm the main breadwinner so I've pulled rank on this one and so he's attending the off-site during the day - coming back to pick up dd and then going back at 9:30 pm when I've got home. Bit of a nightmare - but nowhere else to turn.

Somehow I think it would be easier if one of us was the main breadwinner. We earn virtually identical amounts so the impact of one of us giving up would be quite major :(

We did discuss it last night, but figured that we would just end up with another set of problems which revolved around too little money instead of too little time. Which we decided would probably be worse.

cd is it possible for one of you to get a job with better hours or less travel if you don't want to stop working altogether.
I was sad in a way to leave my job, but now have so much more time and dh and I enjoy our weekends instead of catching up on stuff.
I had 2 children in nursery plus a cleaner and an ironing service, now have one child in nursery part-time , no cleaner, but kept the ironing service
I do sometimes think about working part-time again but am not in any hurry. Have to admit that the nice redundancy pay-off took care of money worries for a while

The problem is that travel is inherent in the nature of my work. I suppose I could try and get some kind of internal Proj Mgt job (yawn) or do some contracting.

The thing is, we both earn really good money and I bet we could live on one salary quite easily. At the moment we have massive expenses ie nanny, cleaner, dogwalker etc plus a fairly hefty mortgage. If we downsized a bit it may be ok, but it's scary the thought of taking that leap.

Plus I like working.

CD,you may not like this, but surely it is less radical than giving up work - it is to come out of the closet professionally and admit that you are a mother. Usually I am able to sort out with my parents (who live 250 miles away and have their own lives and work) after giving plenty of notice, or Nursery, when I have to catch an early train/ late train home, but now ds is starting school, I have warned my parents that I may need to be quite demanding over the next few weeks perhaps on short notice, but that I will try to sort out a pool of babysitters for such occasions over the next few months. As you know, I am on my own with ds, and my clients pay a lot for my services, however, very occasionally, I just have to admit to a childcare issue. I don't feel bad about this because when they agree my fees, they agree a set number of hours/ times, and it does not follow that I should feel guilty about leaving at the "right" time. I just don't know if this has made some clients reject me (as no one has ever told me) but I don't really care, as I have plenty of other clients who like me. Is it really not possible for you to come out about childcare issues now and then (and this goes for your dh too)? I have very rarely had to do it, and never had a negative response to my face. When arranging the meeting, it is made clear to my clients what times and locations I can and can't do. So, the problem typically happens when something overruns and everyone else is sort of agreeing to stay late, and I have to say that actually I really need to catch a particular train. At that point, the client inevitably apologises for expecting me to stay later than originally planned, and sometimes other people of both sexes in the meeting admit they also have children and would prefer to meet again during business hours, and I make suggestions for how else we can conclude the issues, eg they can call me on my mobile later if it is truly urgent, or we can do a telephone conference next day, or we can all discuss by email, or meet again later in the week. Why can't your dh work very late on those days instead so that he can be at home in the early morning?

I think you live in London, don't you CD? If I am correct, would it be a possibility to move out of London, in the hopes that your DH can find a suitable provincial firm where he won't have to work silly hours (will of course require careful research tho as to the sort of hours solicitors in that department really do) and/or where it is acceptable to clients to have meetings at sensible times of day? (i am making the glaring assumption here that he is a solicitor!) Do you need to be in London for your work?

HI TAC - Oh believe me I am well and truly out of the closet - the problem is that it happens quite a lot at the momement. DH is usually at home early for dh. Also don't forget that you are self-employed which makes a huge difference!

I frequently leave meetings before others would to get home on time. It's really the biggest problem when for eg I am working somewhere a 2 hr drive away. I have to leave home by 7am or I get stuck in the rush hour. Then I try and leave the client by 4.30 and often get stuck in traffic or something so that I get home late.

It's a mare

Mts, my dh is up for partnership in the next couple of years so can't really leave at the mo.