"Darlington Nurses" vs County Durham and Darlington NHS Trust Tribunal Thread

[ThreeWordHarpy]

Five nurses working at Darlington Memorial Hospital have filed a legal case suing their employer, an NHS trust, for sexual harassment and sex discrimination. The nurses object to sharing the women’s changing facilities with a male colleague, “Rose”, who:

• identifies as female
• has not undergone any physical or hormonal transition and has full male genitalia
• has cited inclusivity policies
• is backed by the trust’s HR department
• has been granted access to a single-sex changing room for women.

The NHS trust’s HR department dismissed the nurses’ concerns, stating they should “broaden their mindset” and “be educated”. More details can be found at Sex Matters

The hearing is due to start on October 20th and is scheduled to last 3 weeks. To view the hearing online email: [email protected] [[email protected]] requesting remote access to the case of 2501192/2024 Hutchinson and others Vs County Durham and Darlington NHS Trust, starting 20th October. Also include your full name and your role in the hearing (eg member of the public or observer). Note, it is likely you will need the same full name and email address to log into the hearing, and the name will be visible to other observers.

The hearing will be live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets. An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets. Tribunal Tweets have more background to this case on their substack, including links to their coverage of the earlier hearings.

In earlier hearings reported at http://archive.today/nh5v9, the claimants were supported by the Christian Legal Centre and represented by Pavel Stroilov (solicitor) and Bruno Quentaville (barrister). The respondents were represented by Simon Cheetham KC. We do not know yet if the same representation will be in place for the October hearing

Background information from Christian Concern who are supporting the nurses via the CLC.

From TT

were afraid to speak.
SC - but nothing happened
BH - nothing happened, no one came to speak us, no one did anything
SC - but no bad consequences for you
BH - this inclusivity stuff is rammed down our throats, we had to go to kindness training because of this, people are afraid

SC - but nothing bad has happened to you
BH - threats of disc, meeting of 15 April
SC - we will come on to that, so how did you confirm this info
BH - when theatre staff come down with patients we talk,
SC - so did you ask them 'is this true about RH'

She is on fire

Thanks.

Dang...

Do you need to apply to attend in person or can you just turn up?

Terfing of the highest order!

The point I made yesterday - its exactly the evidence given

"it is difficult to trust what Rose says - as he is a man pretending to be a woman. Bingo."

At the root of it all is a lie and as they assimilate the lie - lies become something they are familiar with.

When the lie is challenged the rage comes out.

My goodness BH is impressive.

From TT

BH - yes, I did
SC - you won't name them
BH - no
SC - what if RH says none of that was true
BH - I would doubt what RH said
SC - so you wouldn't believe anything they said
BH - He's a man, pretending to be a woman, he's upset that he's no longer allowed to use the female CR

There was a deadline for requests, Betty, which no one was aware of, by the sounds of it.

I requested access before the deadline, and received an email saying that the information would be emailed to me the day before it started.
But, i didn’t receive it. I have emailed them to ask, but i don’t fancy my chances now.

Exactly. If he lies about something so fundamental, why would you believe anything he says?

She is such a great witness, she wants everyone to hear the treatment she and her colleagues received from the trust.

I loved the bit where SC said we will get to that and she replied, we certainly will. 😍

The main things that stood out for me is counsel for the Respondent saying, effectively, that anyone going against gender ideology in the NHS has no reason to be worried about repercussions, and that we know, but the court perhaps doesn't, that a trans activist will not always tell the truth if that would have an adverse impact on their activism.

Wowee! She’s amazing.

From TT

and that we raised concerns about that and the actions that followed.
SC - that may be a good place for a break.
J - admonition to witness, 10 minute break.
End of morning session part 1.

Transcript missed her quiet Aye, we will, when he said we will come on to that.
Shame cause it was delicious!

TT's 1st Morning tweets

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1981297361809748448.html

Edited to say, the first part is missing as @MyrtleLion said, it was not posted correctly to allow the thread reader app to unroll. See the wonderful Myrtle posts earlier in this thread.

For completeness re comment above - I posted in the break. It is powerful evidence from a woman who is a TERF of the highest order - from Tribunal tweets - key points

No men in womens space
Doesn't matter if they 'present as women' - no biological men means no biological men
Anything we said would not be heard or taken seriously
People who are living a lie (men thinking they are women) - are familiar with lies and their evidence is weaker
And saying to the barrister it is absolutley outrageous to suggest we embellished evidence - no child sexual abuse survivor would make it up and give evidence in court to strengthen their case

I salute you Mrs Hutchinson - you are an incredible advocate for women.

I don't think he did, I think he put it as concerns around "someone's" presence and what "they" might or might not have done.

I actually really don't like that argument. People deceive themselves and others on all sorts of issues, and may also hold strong beliefs that I don't (eg religion) but I don't think it follows that they are inherently untrustworthy, unless there is also a pattern of untrustworthy behaviour.

The final thing BH said seems the most pertinent. The nurses' complaint led to his removal from the CR (and led to his public exposure), and that certainly gives him strong motivation to act against them now.

I got an acceptance email, tried every browser etc, only have black screen no sound, read all instructions but after trying for a hour gave up.

Did you try the Pexip Infinity Connect app?

I am really enjoying the way she is challenging what SC asks, and neither he nor the J have come back to her with the "the way this works is that I ask the questions" line that Naomi Cunningham uses often in cross exam.

I think she's really good at not asking questions back at him, but using his questions as an opportunity to expose how outrageous the whole situation is.

People can decieve themselves to a certain extent. But this is difference. This is a fully presented lie as truth all the time - and anyone not engaging in the lie is then sought out and punished.

I may believe in fairies - but I am not insisting that everyone at work believe in fairies and sit in a room with me and I say see the fairie and make them affirm they see the fairie.

Personal belief re getting other people to join you in lie are two seperate things.

It is the public demonstration of 2 + 2 = 5 from Orwell.

“In the end the Party would announce that two and two made five, and you would have to believe it. It was inevitable that they should make that claim sooner or later: the logic of their position demanded it. Not merely the validity of experience, but the very existence of external reality, was tacitly denied by their philosophy. The heresy of heresies was common sense. And what was terrifying was not that they would kill you for thinking otherwise, but that they might be right. For, after all, how do we know that two and two make four? Or that the force of gravity works? Or that the past is unchangeable? If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable—what then?”
― George Orwell, 1984

You have to challenge the lie and it took these women saying against all evidence and at risk to myself - 2+2 = 4.

I wonder what the admonition to the witness was.