NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #14

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks although once it was in to the second week it was looking like this would not happen. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

However, as a result of problems with the livestreaming, apparently, as a result of a very large number of observers, remote public access to the hearing was suspended on Tuesday 11 February. It was suggested that it might be reinstated at some point but don't count on it.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11
Thread 12: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272276-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-12
Thread 13: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272398-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-13

DU: C started the convo re this is women's CR

JR: Where were you?

DU: Still by sink then. Had to walk past C to dispose of paper towel.

JR: And when you got to where the pink bag is, where had the convo got to?

I notice that in the discussion of "literal women" transmen (as bloody always) get completely forgotten about...

I'm confused why the specific locale within the CR is important?

Is it just that they're trying to gauge his consistency still?

DU: That was about when she said to me, I understand you're going through some process. B4 that she'd said re intimidated etc.

JR: So this is just before mention of chromosomes

DU: Yes

Goes to how heated it may have been as then i would not remember if i was scared /upset

SP was very specific about who was where when in the CR, this guy, not so much.

JR's trying to make it plausible that SP did actually say something about chromosomes, by getting Upton to give details, maybe?

https://www.timeanddate.com/weather/@2649470/historic?month=12&year=2023

I think J is testing DU's selective amnesia - how he can recall minutiae about "slights" against him but becomes vague on stuff that is less convenient to his case.

JR: p736. This is your email to BMA 26/12. 2 pages in you were taken to p beginning "v upset with recent escalation", it was suggested you were trying to have C sacked (even tho word not used).

It's his own lawyer questioning him now though isn't it?

How the fuck does he know how a woman dealing with menstrual flooding would or would not behave?

I'd like to make a comment about big girl pants here but I won't. I'm thinking it though.

JR: You refer just here to a concern you had, what was that?

DU: That she would rally colleagues to her cause, that untrue allegations would be made about me

JR: [reads] concern she would oust you from dept?

Same

So it is, hadn't noticed the switch

DU: that she would use my refusal to agree with her harassment as a challenge, to organise moves to get me moved from that ward, the department.

Someone pass this guy a mirror

This is not true at all. The line manager is the clinical director for the department (consualtant in EM) . Doesn't change per shift. Honestly he knows nothing.

JR: you were asked re Mr Ronald, about p924. Or rather, cd you explain the extent of your work with Esther D about her investigation.

What the hell are they alleging now? This is disgraceful.

DARVO

But it also begs the question of what sort of person is attracted to the ideology in the first place, doesn't it, given that opportunities for coercive control are one of the perks.

I don't see how this line of questioning and responses helps his case.

It plays right into the compelled speech and that sandie had to be ousted for breaking the spell argument that NC was making!

Fuck me! That's what he's done!

Pure DARVO

DU: I heard that Dr Curran had been given the datix, was told C had been suspended which surprised me but they explained it was a neutral act to allow the ix. Then discussions with KS and ED getting statement done.

JR: Anything else?

DU: Not that I recall