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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

For Women Scotland heading for Supreme Court

1000 replies

Imnobody4 · 07/10/2024 23:19

You can read the reasons etc in For Women Scotlands crowdfunder. They are launching this review
UK Supreme Court: The Definition of Sex in the Equality Act

The Inner House of the Court of Session Judgment

We believe the Equality Act was drafted on the basis of the ordinary, common law understanding of the biological differences between the two sexes. The protected characteristic of “sex” in the Equality Act is defined as a reference to a man or a woman, where man means “a male of any age” and woman means “a female of any age”. We think it is quite clear that these are distinct and separate groups and that “woman” is not a mixed-sex category.

However, in our recent judicial review, For Women Scotland v The Scottish Ministers [2023] CSIH 37, the Inner House took the opposite view and decided there is a relationship between the Gender Recognition Act 2004 (GRA) and Equality Act 2010 and held that the meaning of sex in the Equality Act incorporated the GRA framework.

The court decision stated that a person with a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC) in their acquired gender has the protected characteristic of gender reassignment. Separately, they also possess the protected characteristic of sex according to the terms of their GRC and have a presumptive right to access the single-sex services of their acquired gender.

The Supreme Court will consider a request brought by For Women Scotland (FWS) who argue there are “strong grounds” for its challenge, which will almost certainly overturn contentious Scottish government legislation if successful.Campaigners for women’s “sex-based” rights reacted with delight to the news, including Magi Gibson, the poet, who posted on X/Twitter, that it was “game on” on in the “fight for the protection of women’s rights within the UK legal system”.Dennis Noel Kavanagh, a lawyer and the director of Gay Men’s Network, said: “Getting permission to go to the Supreme Court is really hard and very rare but FWS have it. The question ‘what is a woman’ in law will now be heard by our highest court. Massive news.”

www.thetimes.com/article/088ae0ce-fba9-4b97-8331-01a32195bef5?shareToken=3ada340957f5d2af2e20b01a7c15da3b

OP posts:
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35
Appalonia · 26/11/2024 15:31

They're trying to make sense of something that just doesnt, no wonder they're confused! It must be hard to realise that a law is actually in really bad faith.

TWETMIRF · 26/11/2024 15:31

Our water bill is in both my and my husband's name, am I non binary or do I have multiple personalities?

Harassedevictee · 26/11/2024 15:31

highame · 26/11/2024 15:27

But tomorrow the other side and will the judges get their arguments too!

Yes, but it’s hard to go back from peak trans. Once you get it you can’t not get it.
basically they realise the emperor has no clothes and they can no longer see the clothes they were told were there.

HarpQuartet · 26/11/2024 15:32

Don't think I will leave the house tomorrow!

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:33

TWETMIRF · 26/11/2024 15:31

Our water bill is in both my and my husband's name, am I non binary or do I have multiple personalities?

Genderfluid.

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:33

Harassedevictee · 26/11/2024 15:31

Yes, but it’s hard to go back from peak trans. Once you get it you can’t not get it.
basically they realise the emperor has no clothes and they can no longer see the clothes they were told were there.

It'll be great for them to hear the counter arguments laid out in as much detail as possible.

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 15:34

I wish they'd stop bringing in sexual orientation, it's a red herring!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 26/11/2024 15:34

Yes definitely @ArabellaScott

larklane17 · 26/11/2024 15:34

Judge asking about sexual orientation now. Ben doing well answering with ease.

OneOfLittleConsequence · 26/11/2024 15:35

highame · 26/11/2024 15:27

But tomorrow the other side and will the judges get their arguments too!

Can they ask what living as a woman means again tomorrow? I’d love someone from that side to explain it legally speaking

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:35

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 15:34

I wish they'd stop bringing in sexual orientation, it's a red herring!

All part of the Denton's strategy.

Shortshriftandlethal · 26/11/2024 15:36

larklane17 · 26/11/2024 15:34

Judge asking about sexual orientation now. Ben doing well answering with ease.

What did he say?

CriticalCondition · 26/11/2024 15:36

In the interests of fairness to her the noisy typing is not Naomi Cunningham who is leaning back in the row behind Ben. I think it must be Ben's junior who is just out of shot but next to his microphone.

Boiledbeetle · 26/11/2024 15:37

Deadhouseplant · 26/11/2024 15:26

Are these judges peaking in real time???

It certainly felt like it during the living as a woman bit!

dunBle · 26/11/2024 15:38

Curse the little circle of dots.

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:39

Boiledbeetle · 26/11/2024 15:37

It certainly felt like it during the living as a woman bit!

I wonder if they are or were still under the impression a GRC entails surgery. So many people seem to think that's essential.

RoyalCorgi · 26/11/2024 15:39

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:33

It'll be great for them to hear the counter arguments laid out in as much detail as possible.

I think you're right. All part of operation "let them speak". Tomorrow is going to be fun.

ickky · 26/11/2024 15:39

@CriticalCondition I know, I was joking. 😀

larklane17 · 26/11/2024 15:40

Shortshriftandlethal · 26/11/2024 15:36

What did he say?

Expained why it was still a protected characteristic even though you can't see sexual orientation.
Sorry for short answer, I'm looking after a sick child at same time.

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:40

RoyalCorgi · 26/11/2024 15:39

I think you're right. All part of operation "let them speak". Tomorrow is going to be fun.

Dorothy Bain is a perfectly respectable KC. But she's going to go up there and argue that any male can pay a fiver and become a woman.

Boiledbeetle · 26/11/2024 15:40

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:39

I wonder if they are or were still under the impression a GRC entails surgery. So many people seem to think that's essential.

I think the are!

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:41

'You can't change biological sex' - one of the judges.

Yes, you're getting it!

TWETMIRF · 26/11/2024 15:43

Living as a woman can mean a shave and a hair cut, or tits.

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 15:43

I think it must be so difficult to understand that any man can just say he's a woman and therefore he is. It's so far fetched when you see it that you must think there's more to it. But there isnt!

larklane17 · 26/11/2024 15:44

"in some circumstances they will retain features that make them readily identified in their birth sex."
Ben expands on this...

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