Question Time. Two (at least) GC panellists, is this unprecedented.

[Mochudubh]

I missed the beginning but came back in to hear Lionel Shriver say Nicola Sturgeon had to go because the GRR bill was deeply unpopular. Ruth Wishart explicitly agreed with Lionel's stance, just taking issue with Lionel's use of the word "girly" to describe NS excuse of "tired".

I remember the Robert Winston QT from a few months ago when he stated that humans can't change sex and Fiona Bruce said something like "many experts would disagree". To the man who probably knows more about women's bodies than any other man on the planet! We seem to have moved on a fair bit since then.

I really hope the momentum keeps up on this and the tide really had turned.

Title should have ended in a ? Obvs!

I saw that bit too - great to see!

Fiona is a disappointment as an interviewer and as a very accommodating chairindividual

I only saw the last 20 mins, but heard Lionel say that the police should spend less time on Twitter policing pronouns and more time on the streets.

And there was a woman in the audience pictured wearing a pro-women t-shirt!

There is a fightback at the BBC. Last night on the programme Unsafe Space on Radio 4, Simon Evans interviewed Jane Fae and wasn't in the mood to be gaslit:

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001j4c7

From 17.30 he primes the audience with the "baby fascist" incident in Brighton and after that Jane Fae appears. It is a bracing interview.

“Fiona Bruce said something like "many experts would disagree"

IIRC it was more along the lines of “let me jump in and say many people would disagree” but that’s not much better. The sense of agitation and panic she gave off was quite something. Very, very unedifying.

Just listened and you're right, it's good. Fae still pushing the TWAW line, I see, and saying that if we want single-sex spaces we'll have to have genital inspections of everyone in loos and that TW's vaginas are indistinguishable from women's vaginas — conveniently leaving out the fact that 95% of TWs have penises. They still have no better arguments, do they?

@pattihews I didn't spot that. Brave that woman.

@noraclavicle Yes, I couldn't remember the exact words but I knew it was along those lines.

There didn't appear to be any captured yoof in the audience doing sad head shaking like there was in Glasgow. I wonder if the fact that it was in Rugby School attracted a more conservative demographic.

@pattihews TW's vaginas are indistinguishable from women's vaginas.

Yeugh! I can't imagine any women applying for that job. Well, maybe a certain,special kind of "woman".

I thought I heard Ian Hislop say right at the end as they were winding up, something along the lines of “the opposite of effective policing of knife crime is not ‘let’s not be woke’. I can’t work out what he meant. I think it’s the 2 nots! Can anyone enlighten me?

Or "chairthem"?

I think your average person is just sick of the focus on this shit. We have war raging in Europe, massive spike in bills and goods and they want to focus on fucking gender religion. We’ve had enough. Actually do some politics.

Stop appeasing the Twitterati and do some politics. I’m sick of online opinion overriding actual working people keeping the country running. People putting in 12 hour shifts and 60 hour weeks. Yet the privileged keyboard warriors are the voices that are heard. They are NOT the majority opinion in this country. As they are starting to learn.

I agree. In some ways the gender stuff is a gift to the lazy politician. They have been primed with many pre-approved-by-LGBT+-Twitterfolk non-answers to all the obvious questions, and the non-debate can go on forever as long as people use words such as "woman" in inconsistent, differing ways with the goalposts constantly moving.

It's a huge distraction from the fact that everything else is going to shit and people would be looking to them to actually act.

Ooh thanks for the heads up, and the JF one Naut

But the fundamental threat this represents to women’s hard won rights can’t be shelved or kicked along the road…

Rape victims are actually being forced to say ‘her penis’ in courts of law today. Just because other shit is going on, society can’t just ignore this.

Im
not disagreeing but I don’t think your average Joe really cares about hard fought women’s rights. They are just sick
of this subject and voting against it.

I think that's fine until it literally hits home. In my local area we recently had an old man loitering around schools wearing girl's school uniform and the police refused to do anything about him for fear of being seen as transphobic.

It's when this stuff hits reality and actually affects people that it becomes more than just a Twitter culture war.

The people that then actually take to the street to protest about this scenario then end up being the far-right contingent as they are the only ones prepared to put their heads above the parapet. And then round the Mulberry Bush we go again.

This idiotic line incenses me. The onus is not on women and girls to identify and challenge male people trying to get into our spaces and services. The onus is on the male people to accept that these spaces and services are not for them and not to try to get into them.

I don't understand why so many find it so difficult to see that a transwoman's desire for validation does not trump the wishes of the great majority of women and girls to have certain spaces and services entirely free of males.

To state the blindingly obvious, it's not a sign of privilege that we have these sex-segregated spaces and services. They were hard-won for our safety, dignity and privacy, and in the case of sport so we could have a fair chance of winning. Many activists have utterly lost sight of this, if they ever knew it, and either can't see that women (the biological kind) are oppressed all over the world on the basis of sex - or in the case of the MRAs they delight in arguing that it's actually men who are oppressed by women.

This follows from the amazing trick the gender ideologists have pulled off by getting so many to accept that males who self-identify as women are every bit as much women as those of us who are biologically female. This leads them on to the offensive and nonsensical comparison with white women refusing to share washrooms with Black women in the US.

@watcherintherye (love that name) I think Ian's meaning: is 'Let's be woke' is the opposite of effective knife policing.

Just listened to this now. Blimey.

JF is director of Trans Actual and then mumbles “and Trans Media Watch”…. When is someone going to hall JF up to answer questions about ipso? Being a leading architect of the ‘movement’ it is disingenuous and gaslighting to deny that a movement exists. I need to listen again, it got a bit confusing, but it is utter madness that JF seems to think that ‘you don’t think trans women are women’ is a persuasive argument or a gotcha.

No JF I don’t think TWAW, the people who say they do are only saying it to #bekind. Furthermore I can’t be ‘transphobic’ for, like everyone else, thinking that TWANW, since I don’t believe that ‘trans’ even makes any sense. How can I fear something someone else made up that I don’t believe in?

Haul

The whole ‘what are you going to do, inspect everyone’s genitals’ argument is so laughable (a) because the assumption is being made that there really is no other way to tell that a transwoman is trans other than by carrying out a genital inspection and (b) so many womens’ experience is that a lot of men very much do want to have their genitals inspected, especially when it involves making women feel at best uncomfortable and at worst frightened.