If Starmer stated what a woman is...

[Lykia]

Would you vote for him? If he categorically stated a woman is a woman/born with female sexual organs ( ie biological woman) or whatever the correct definition is.

Surely he must know that if he said this then a lot more women would vote for him.

Moreover there are more women out there than trans women so why doesn't he just come out and say this? Is this his hill to die on?

He's an intelligent man surely the next election would be much easier to win if he just came out and said what a woman is.

Does it need saying? Did he say differently?

Yes. As long as he also said transwomen should stay out of women's prisons, hospital wards, changing rooms, toilets, rape crisis places etc etc. Spend money on tbird spaces (not money allocated for single sex spaces).

Um. I’d still be concerned about the other Labour MPs. Angela Rayner & Lisa Nandy are both TWAW for a start.

No. He would be lying about what he actually thinks.

He’s lying now and he knows it. What a weak character to parrot a lie to stay in with the gang. Pathetic.

Did he actually make any statements on this? You’re just piling in waffling.

@MsTSwift

People can think whatever ridiculous things they want. I don’t expect him to agree with me. I just don’t want to vote for a liar, or an idiot.

@LadyWithLapdog

Yes.

Agree!

Why don't you have a quick google.

He needs to say a lot more than that. Otherwise it will be as meaningless a phrase as TWAW.
I'd want to hear his comments about prisons, sport, rapists on women's hospital wards and most importantly Cass & safeguarding children before I believe he's more than a lily livered sop, easily captured by extremists. (and an apology to Rosie Duffield and all the woman hounded out of the labour party on his watch would be good).

I haven’t seen any and whenever I ask on here - nowhere else in the universe is this such an obsession than the MN Feminist board - it’s just waffle.

No because the whole party is keen to change legislation to strip women of their right to single sex spaces. It’s sitting there ready to go.

Asked to define what a woman is, Sir Keir told The Times: “A woman is a female adult, and in addition to that trans women are women, and that is not just my view – that is actually the law.”
Mr Starmer added: “It has been the law through the combined effects of the 2004 [Gender Recognition] Act and the 2010 [Equality] Act. So that’s my view. It also happens to be the law in the United Kingdom.”

He's weasling out of it by using the law.

Yes

I used to think he was worried about the backlash but now I think this is what he genuinely thinks. He lives in Islington and that is his social circle/ influence. I’m pretty sure one of his cabinet has a trans niece or nephew ( can’t recall which now) and she must be an influence on him too.
Many of his MP’s are London MP’s / large cities like Bristol etc

A caller, Iris from Aberdeen, asked Nick: "Do you think it's fair that transgender women with all their physical advantages, are allowed to compete in women's sport?"
Sir Keir said: "I think it's for the sporting bodies to decide for themselves how they deal with this, it throws up all sorts of difficult questions."
He refused to answer whether or not it would be "fair" for Lia Thomas to compete in the Paris Olympics saying it is a decision that the committee must make for themselves and it "probably needs more discussion."

More weaselling

@LadyWithLapdog

So what you haven’t heard about didn’t happen?

Do some research and stop waffling at us.

Hahaha agreed

No. He would be lying about what he actually thinks.

Oh come on... like he actually believes TWAW! Hardly anyone does really, imo. I'd love to feel I could vote Labour. He'd need to not only recant on the gender stuff - he would need to admit why he said it in the first place, rather than do a waffly reverse weasel. Then he'd need to make some promises about single sex spaces, language used to describe the sexes etc. Not going to happen though. I'd still not be keen on him, but it would be enough to turn my vote.

Oh, so you can’t actually. Just the usual let’s have another bash at Labour when it’s so clear the Tories are shit. But her emails!!

It’s a Sunday morning and I’ll spend my time better than screaming the same old shit on MN Feminist threads.

I'm so sorry that your Google/preferred search engine is broken. I hope service is restored later.

Starmer, formerly the director of public prosecutions, the most senior prosecutor in England and Wales, said: “A woman is a female adult, and in addition to that trans women are women, and that is not just my view, that is actually the law. It has been the law through the combined effects of the 2004 [Gender Recognition] Act and the 2010 [Equality] Act.”

www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/mar/13/jk-rowling-keir-starmer-misrepresents-law-woman-definition-labour

You do real you are choosing to open these threads and engage? Oh yes, coming on and saying it's all screaming waffle isn't going to stop this being discussed. And remember life really isn't always labour vs tory despite that constant banging on about it.

Emily Thornberry has a trans niece/nephew. Both she and Starmer ought to be able to separate out being kind to a young person with gender issues from their professional remit. If they can't avoid bias due to personal issues which affects their ability to do their job, they should step down.

He is quoted explaining that any male that sadisfied the GRA and obtains a GRC is woman. Which is factual as a legal form but which ignores where the real life sex of the male impact on other people.

He will then talk about women.

The casual listener hears the word woman and thinks human females when he is talking about human females and males.