Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 16

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:
AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Thread 11 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555145-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-11

Thread 12 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555687-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-12

Thread 13 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556235-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-13

Thread 14 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556407-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-14

Thread 15 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556803-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-15

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, 25 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Cathryn McGahey - Bar Council Ethics Committee's VC (24 May)
Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
Colin Cook - Head clerk at GCC (24 May)
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing (25 May)
Kathryn Cronin - barrister at GCC (25 May)
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge (26 May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers (26 May)

To Come

Closing arguments for AB, GCC, and SW (20 June)

[AlisonDonut]

It does make you wonder what other 'protected' characteristics have fallen by the wayside by signing up to Stonewall 'Diversity Champions', doesn't it?

It is so frustating that we've gone back 30 years in terms of diversity. And these legal people thought they were so right, the couldn't see it from anyone else's point of view. Social Justice Warriors who are only interested in one groups' Social Justice.

[TheClitterati]

@Signalbox

Final submissions 20th June

thanks.

I feel like my brain is kind of fizzing with relief now its mostly over. Its taken up a lot of headspace following along & it has affected my work. Not that I regret it for a minute but it has been intense.

I can't imagine what it has been like for Allison & her team.

I've really enjoyed the MN thread - got me back on MN after a pretty long absense. Well done Tribunal Tweeters too - heroic efforts. I can't begin to imagine how you did what you did.

As the Maya verdict was expected in May I'm thinking we will have that in before the 20th June? 🤞🏽

GIN FOR EVERYONE!!!

[ResisterRex]

@AlisonDonut

It does make you wonder what other 'protected' characteristics have fallen by the wayside by signing up to Stonewall 'Diversity Champions', doesn't it?

It is so frustating that we've gone back 30 years in terms of diversity. And these legal people thought they were so right, the couldn't see it from anyone else's point of view. Social Justice Warriors who are only interested in one groups' Social Justice.

Disability seems to me, to have fallen right off the list. There used to be a lot of activity around it but now it's Tumbleweed Time.

[TheBiologyStupid]

@WildIris

Actually, I would like to know the answer to this as well - I don’t have Twitter either.

😀

There's a (sort of) explanation here, though you have to scroll down a bit: www.tweetbinder.com/blog/twitter-impressions/

[YesImThere]

Thanks so much to Ickky for setting up the threads and for all the contributors. I was waaaaay to slow reading and not able to post comment myself.

Biggest admiration for Allison and your bravery in bringing this case. I felt a warm glow in hearing that TM supported your position in this. I’ve worked with him many years ago and think he’s a good egg.

Ive watched every day (apologies for the washing up in the background 😊) and learned a lot in the process. This case has really opened my eyes to issues that would certainly passed me by and I’ve put myself forward for equality and diversity board at work.

I’ve not done any work for the last two weeks though. Oh, an in case anyone has a spreadsheet, I also don’t use twitter!

[Mumsnut]

It's a bit lke the end of GCSEs. I feel I should be running round and biro'ing my name on everyone's school blouse now

[awkwardoldlady]

@yourhairiswinterfire

I think they're saying that Mumsnet were 'celebrating' the fact that a gender critical barrister from GCC was attending a WPUK meeting, and GCC didn't like it, because they didn't want to be associated with anything gender critical and wanted to distance themselves from it.

yeah you wouldn't want to be associated with the hive of villany that is mumsnet

❤to you all

[CriticalCondition]

Huge thanks to @ickky for keeping this running like clockwork. And to everyone for their insight, commentary and humour.

I hope the tribunal finds for Allison, she deserves a resounding win and a stonking award of cash. But even if she doesn't get that, she's turned over the Stonewall stone under the full glare of the law. And she deserves a medal and a place in history for that. And I sincerely hope she never has to buy her own drink in a pub ever again.

[BemoreBen]

That was utterly fascinating - I'm involved in a very minor thing at work with HR that my boss was joking that if HR didn't pull their finger out I could take them to an Employment tribunal and sue them for lots of money. I laughed and changed the subject because 1) Having seen part of one now, I never want to be near a tribunal unless there is an egregious wrong that needs to be corrected and 2) I didn't want to get into a conversation on how I know it doesn't work like that.

[Bundlephobia]

Thanks everyone and especially Allison

[IdisagreeMrHochhauser]

I take credit for starting the cascade of thanks in the chat box. I felt like it was inappropriate to leave without saying anything and it does feel like the end of an era. Even AH...... r said, "have you seen the chat" in a stage whisper to stage right where JR was in the wings.

I bet she was gutted she couldn't draw the whole thing to a close with a rhetorical flourish.

It's been a blast. Fingers crossed for a favourable judgment.

[SulisMinerva]

Thank you @ickky for keeping these threads going. I’ve been reading along all the way through as I haven’t been able to watch the proceedings.

So much admiration for Allison. It must have been an awful working atmosphere - I’ve witnessed and been on the receiving end of the ‘this is persona non grata’ treatment and it’s stressful.

[IdisagreeMrHochhauser]

Also I figured with a minute to go it was too late to be in contempt.

I probably would've stood up and applauded had I been there in person.

[AngryHawkhouse]

Thanks to @ickky and all posters for these incredible threads. I came for Allison's case and stayed for the cub badges, bingo and pelvic floor exercises! Mumsnet at it's finest.
This case was extraordinary in every way. Smoke alarms, drilling, support animals, shouting at the judge...and that's before we ever start on the witness testimony.
My admiration for Allison knows no bounds. I hope she is able to rest, be surrounded with friends and decompress for the next few weeks.

[StrongOutspokenOftenIrritating]

Another one who thought AH did a good job. It’s just his witnesses happened to all want to do the job for him instead of just testifying. I’m willing to bet legal chambers are a nightmare client for a barrister

[Bundlephobia]

Out of interest, how often would there be a massive mob of barristers cross examined in a single case, including a large swathe of QCs and a judge? That must be vanishingly rare, surely?

[BarryStir]

Not fully caught up yet but my main takeaway from today was that some of the top legal minds in the country believe everything they read on the internet.

Jesus wept.

[WildIris]

Thanks for that @TheBiologyStupid !

[EmbarrassingHadrosaurus]

@Bundlephobia

Thanks everyone and especially Allison

Yes. Helen Joyce remarked in the latest Wine With Women that AB is an intensely private person: it must be an extraordinary feat of mental, emotional, moral and intellectual stamina that has sustained Allison through this lengthy ordeal.

This case has really opened my eyes to issues that would certainly passed me by and I’ve put myself forward for equality and diversity board at work.

I'm utterly delighted to read this. This is exactly one of the benefits that will flow from AB's admirable courage. Courage is calling to courage and telling us that we have to get involved: we can not trust others to care about, far less maintain, women's rights.

Between this and the feminist magistrates who are encouraging us to put ourselves forward for the training there are so many ways that we can be involved. Whether we're bluestockings who write letters, talk to our MPs, respond to consultations, or talk to our family and friends, every time one of us does something because we were inspired by AB and others like her, that's a win for AB and for us all as women.

[FannyCann]

.

[WildIris]

This tribunal could form the basis of a TV soap!

[BenCooperisaGod]

@BarryStir

Not fully caught up yet but my main takeaway from today was that some of the top legal minds in the country believe everything they read on the internet.

Jesus wept.

Unless its on Mumsnet, and then it should definitely not be believed

[SpringCalling]

Wow what a marathon! Thanks all for being on the journey. Gotta go back to thread 14 now as missed it earlier today ..

[MaudeYoung]

Is it just me or does anyone else find it utterly shocking the GCC gave credence to any report published in Pink News?

GCC did not bother to discover for itself if the "anti-trans" and "transphobic" references by Pink News had any credibility on relation to Woman's Place UK. Everything WPUK does is in the public domain. All the speeches from meetings are on You Tube. WPUK's web site clearly sets out its position with regard to women's rights.

The conclusion one can arrive at is that Garden Court Chambers is anti-women's rights.

[IdisagreeMrHochhauser]

I have a soft spot for AH too but I reserve my right to disagree with him 😉