Prince George at Eton

[squashyhat]

Can anyone explain why Prince George is boarding at Eton when the family home is just minutes away across the river?

“I'm not even the original poster, but how are you not getting it?”

some might use the word disingenuous re the above point 🤔

although they probably won’t get that either

I completely take your point that making highly privileged youngsters understand their privilege is a challenge. It's always worth doing, though, and the independent school I worked at (had always worked in state schools until then) did try hard. The boys did a lot of community stuff and were very enthusiastic about it. I remember one sixth-former in tears when he was told he couldn't do a particular activity with some disadvantaged children because of H & S concerns (valid ones, but it was a shame). But yes - if you're privileged, it's a different world.

Being realistic and not idealistic, the next best thing is to encourage awareness of the outside world and to get boys to feel a sense of responsibility and obligation to make a contribution to society.

As I've said in a post upthread, I think there are also things which state schools could do to encourage the sort of life-skills that public school kids learn. At the beginning of my teaching career there was a very nasty mindset which held that manners, courtesy all that stuff, were bourgeois (ooh - have I spelt that right?? it's not looking good..) impositions on the working class children. And then the same people moaned that public school students had the advantage because of these very attributes. I think things have changed since then, and more emphasis is put on life-skills such as these.

Or he could decide to completely reform the concept of royalty when it comes to his 'turn' and live a far more normal life, like many of the european RFs have done.
I think William has promised to modernise the royal family. That should be well on the way by the time George becomes king.

It's completely changed in state schools.

That's so good to hear, Fleur. I trained in the Marxist-Leninist-Maoist era!

Right. Such days are long gone.

But I’m still conflicted as, ultimately, it is an incredibly privileged educational establishment open only to males

@Piglet89 Do you feel the same about single sex girls schools?

I've misunderstood a few posts recently - so I wanted to be clear just what I was being asked before plunging in! 😀

This entirely. We have direct experience of (outstanding) state schools and private schools and the difference could not be more marked in the relationship between the staff and pupils, even at primary age. It frustrates me so much that so many in the education sector spend so much energy decrying the private sector instead of going to take a look and seeing what they actually do that would cost no money.

Frankly i'm pleased that our future head of state is going to have the best possible education that money can buy. The value the monarchy can bring is when they're sitting next to a psychotic US president or despotic oil-rich monarch and have the diplomatic and oratorical skills to influence them to turn the taps on/keep the intel flowing (or whatever they've been tasked to do by the government).

Who are "the many in the education sector." who spend time "decrying" the private sector?
In all honesty, we don't have the time.

I was trying to type into my awful slow old iPad yesterday on MN, and it was like pulling teeth.

Now I'm at the PC so can type reams of stuff - sorry, folks!

I know what it's like when you can't type/text what you want to, though.

I think the state sector picked up on some ideas from the private sector in recent decades, when ideology wasn't quite so dominant. One thing was the emphasis on school uniform - and while I support a basic uniform for reasons of equality (no 'labels' etc), I think some schools have gone way too far with this. For example - trying to dictate exactly what sort of shoes students should wear. Just black shoes should really be enough.

But there are other things which are free! And an emphasis on courtesy and communication and interaction with adults is really important, I feel. Some teenagers used to come to my classroom with a note from another teacher and shove it at me with either no words, or a grunt. I always used to say 'Good morning! Have you got a message for me? Oh, thank you!' I was being a bit sarcastic but I found it concerning that they weren't able to do basic human communication at that age.

They don't bring notes now anyway.
The whole culture is very different.

@squashyhat am caller number 28. W&C should pick up soon then I will update. I suspect they all love the idea and can obviously afford it.
Oh now caller number 27. They'll pick up soon

I am gobsmacked that there was ever a serious idea- an institutionally agreed idea, as opposed to the posters impression- that the British population have no embedded experience of manners / courtesy and it was therefore the education systems responsibility to install these.

and further, the idea that whilst the privately educated children embraced this enthusiastically, the 94% of the British population who are state school educated rejected it for being bourgeois, preferring to operate devoid of manners or courtesy instead.

It all sounds very “smooth out the roughians please state school teachers, they’re pure animals” with the alledged push back being “but we don’t want to teach them manners and courtesy, it’s so bourgeois” 🤔

the whole idea seems extremely unlikely and more likely to be rooted in assumptions about state educated people (which is, I remind you, 94% of the population)

Thank you! Some of the most polite, respectful and hard working students in my experience, have been migrants from Somalia and Pakistan, and white children from council estates. Yes, that includes boys as well.

“The boys at Eton think they have mastered the skills of social interaction, organisation, confidence, dealing with adults etc. by doing things like the example you gave, without realising that they weren't operating within the same parameters as 99% of the country.
If a child from a normal comp had written to the home secretary or head of coutts bank or whoever asking them to give a talk, their letter (even if it had been written exactly as well, with the same amount of research) would go straight in the bin. The fact that the invite to Eton was the one responded to and the event went ahead isn't evidence that the boys at Eton are more confident or organised or better at interacting with adults, or that the school should be lauded for installing those skills in them, it's just evidence of their massive privilege.”

I am sorry but this is actually a terrible example. An Etonian currently writing to anyone in the Labour Party to visit and do a talk? Are you joking? I reckon the worst performing comp in the country would stand more of a chance!
And then there is whining around how privileged they all are and how George potentially rubbing shoulders with the children of ex Tory Cabinet etc is a problem.

Go figure.

And in reality, DS and DD’s grammar schools have had plenty of visits from high up people in all sorts of position in the last 10 years.
People in positions of responsibility should make time to visit ALL types of schools and inspire the next generation.

As for the example given on wine - again, so close minded. British wine and sparkling wine is a growing industry for us (eg see Chapel Down). We need young people to be inspired, wherever they are from.

You’re being naive. Eton and other top public schools do run these talks on a very regular basis- I’ve attended several (held every Friday morning) including the wine.

your kids grammar school over the last decade doesn’t come close.

the speakers attend because Eton. Its is ridiculous to deny this.

I'm sure - but I was using an eg from....15 years ago?? just to explain the lack of emphasis on basic communication skills and confidence in dealing with adults - or anyone, really. The boy in this case was a nice boy - not rude or insolent. He just hadn't the confidence to say the appropriate things - rather a sad reflection of the school. There was a general attitude that it didn't matter - it was just 'teenagers being teenagers'.

@Backedoffhackedoff - OK go on then, when did a Labour MP last visit Eton College?

What does that prove or disprove? People are allowed to give examples that aren’t evidenced. It’s just an example.

You should have done a PGCE in the early 80s, and been on some of ILEA's in-service training then!

Wow - the crazy ideology that was current in those days. Amongst other gems, you were supposed to agree that spelling didn't matter at all to working class children - they didn't need it. And that 'manner's were a bourgois construct which oppressed w/c children'. I had to listen to a lot of this stuff and it nearly put me off teaching completely!

Of course manners and spelling are important to working class children. I'm not implying they don't have manners - in my experience they certainly do - but it wasn't something schools seemed to value or promote in those far-off days.

manners, not manner's!

https://www.gov.uk/government/people/kanishka-narayan

Andy Burnham’s appointment, Eton alumni. I think he might have been on a full bursary. Hopefully that meets the Labour test and that this type of person would be allowed to visit in the future.

Ok, I think state schools haven't accepted that for some time. The approach of the Michaela school, while not popular with everyone, has certainly filtered into other state schools, for example.