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The royal family

Does Carole Middleton in some way out rank Camilla as the grandma of the future king ?

215 replies

Inthesummertimewhen · 18/06/2026 22:50

Seeing them together today ,it stuck me Camilla is not blood related to the royals and now carols blood flows through our future kings veins ? Obviously Camilla is queen and currently technically outranks her but does she in some way out rank her ??

OP posts:
BemusedAmerican · 20/06/2026 19:43

I'm sure there are more recent examples. Job perhaps or business deals rather than titles.

FourCatMama · 21/06/2026 01:46

Hate that yall crowned Cowmilla

LBFseBrom · 21/06/2026 01:55

Camilla is not mother or grandmother of a future king. She is the wife of the current king and I would think that is enough for her.

It's ridiculous to make such comparisons anyway, the sort of thing that the Sun would do.

It hardly matters, Camilla has her role, the Middletons have theirs and I'm sure all are quite content with the status quo. They are not in competition.

DurinsBane · 21/06/2026 02:30

LettuceAndCarrots · 18/06/2026 23:25

No, not at present.

In a future world in which George is king, Charles is dead but Camilla and Carole are both alive I don't know the answer.

William would have to die young for Camilla to still be alive when George is king! Though Queen Elizabeth’s grandmother, Queen Mary, was still alive for a few months when Elizabeth came to the throne (because her dad died young)

TheAutumnCrow · 21/06/2026 05:02

FourCatMama · 21/06/2026 01:46

Hate that yall crowned Cowmilla

Amazing though MN is, I doubt that the then Archbishop of Canterbury is on here, moving among us.

So do try to rest easy.

deeahgwitch · 21/06/2026 10:30

FourCatMama · 21/06/2026 01:46

Hate that yall crowned Cowmilla

😂

Nanny0gg · 21/06/2026 11:31

Doodadidi · 19/06/2026 07:25

Camilla will always be an irrelevant royal mistress who was elevated above her station by a weak king to many.
Carole seems to have provided a loving stable family not just to Kate but also to William.

I'm not sure where you get 'irrelevant' from

june35 · 21/06/2026 11:41

I don’t understand all the Camilla hate. She and Charles have been in love for decades and should have been together from the start. As far as historical Royal relationships go, theirs is close to a genuine love story and it doesn’t seem like he has ever really wavered in his devotion to her.

The same people who dislike Camilla probably revere the likes of Anne Boleyn, but she was actually hated by most of the public in her day.

MissFenellaPrism · 21/06/2026 11:43

june35 · 21/06/2026 11:41

I don’t understand all the Camilla hate. She and Charles have been in love for decades and should have been together from the start. As far as historical Royal relationships go, theirs is close to a genuine love story and it doesn’t seem like he has ever really wavered in his devotion to her.

The same people who dislike Camilla probably revere the likes of Anne Boleyn, but she was actually hated by most of the public in her day.

Edited

I think it's just part of the cult of St Diana the Martyr.

june35 · 21/06/2026 12:04

Enko · 19/06/2026 09:39

The Seymours were "lower gentry" her father was a "Sir"

Elizabeth Woodville was not a noble

Technically no, but her mother was. Her mother was Jacquetta of Luxembourg and her first marriage was to John of Lancaster, Duke of Bedford - son of Henry IV and brother of Henry V. After he died she married ‘beneath’ her in secret to Richard Woodville, a lowly knight which caused a big scandal.

Because of that, Elizabeth Woodville was a ‘commoner’ but she still had ‘noble blood’ through her mother.

UserNineNine · 21/06/2026 12:05

june35 · 21/06/2026 11:41

I don’t understand all the Camilla hate. She and Charles have been in love for decades and should have been together from the start. As far as historical Royal relationships go, theirs is close to a genuine love story and it doesn’t seem like he has ever really wavered in his devotion to her.

The same people who dislike Camilla probably revere the likes of Anne Boleyn, but she was actually hated by most of the public in her day.

Edited

I don’t either, she seems great. They look so happy and she’s always doing such interesting stuff, especially for women and girls.

Specialagentblond · 21/06/2026 12:09

I guess they’re quits then. Camilla outranks her in the royal hierarchy but Carole in biology. I don’t think either of them are bothered by it and respect each other’s roles in the lives of the future king. George is very lucky to have such formidable grandmothers.

june35 · 21/06/2026 12:19

Specialagentblond · 21/06/2026 12:09

I guess they’re quits then. Camilla outranks her in the royal hierarchy but Carole in biology. I don’t think either of them are bothered by it and respect each other’s roles in the lives of the future king. George is very lucky to have such formidable grandmothers.

Camilla is Queen consort and in simple terms, Carole is a subject who would be expected to curtsey to Camilla. There is no royal position for a non- royal grandmother of a prince. The fact Carole may be closer biologically and perhaps emotionally to a 13 year old boy who is second in line to the throne, is neither here nor there.

George is not even Prince of Wales and heir to the throne yet, it could be over 40 years before he becomes king.

MissFenellaPrism · 21/06/2026 12:20

UserNineNine · 21/06/2026 12:05

I don’t either, she seems great. They look so happy and she’s always doing such interesting stuff, especially for women and girls.

Yes, a real champion against DV, going to women's refuges and supporting their work.

Desperatelyseekinglazysusan · 21/06/2026 12:31

FourCatMama · 21/06/2026 01:46

Hate that yall crowned Cowmilla

Amazed that Royal fans have no understanding of Royalty. The Kings wife is Queen. End of story. Maybe go watch some Disney films. It's the same there. No one has a choice. If you want a choice then you want a Republic, and even then you don't have a say in the First Spouse.

TheAutumnCrow · 21/06/2026 12:45

Desperatelyseekinglazysusan · 21/06/2026 12:31

Amazed that Royal fans have no understanding of Royalty. The Kings wife is Queen. End of story. Maybe go watch some Disney films. It's the same there. No one has a choice. If you want a choice then you want a Republic, and even then you don't have a say in the First Spouse.

There are a hardcore of people who just seem to hate the female spouses. Just on YouTube there's an array of stuff about Michelle Obama being a bloke, Brigitte Macron being her own brother, Melania Trump being a former hooker, and Hillary Clinton drinking the blood of babies.

Diana, though - perfect, apparently.

Bonkers.

BemusedAmerican · 21/06/2026 14:13

You've forgotten that Ivana Trump was buried on a Trump golf course allegedly with files in her coffin.

CarolinaInTheMorning · 21/06/2026 14:55

As others have pointed out, there has never been an official title of Queen Consort in Britain. Queen consort as a designation is to distinguish from a queen regnant. So Camilla is The Queen, just as her predecessor consorts were.

Several posters have essentially said that the title King outranks Queen and that is why husbands of queens regnant have the title Prince. As at least one poster has said, there have been exceptions.

It’s true that one of the reasons for husbands of queens regnant generally not being called King is the historical notion that King is a higher title than Queen. In many European countries where the Salic law prevailed, only men could inherit the throne and so queens in their own right were non-existent or very rare. And even in countries that allowed women to reign, men took precedence in the succession until very recently (and still do in some).

There is some precedent in Britain for the husband of a queen regnant to be given the title of king. Philip of Spain, the husband of Mary I of England was named co-ruler when they married and called King of England. He spent most of his time in Spain, though, and never really functioned as a ruler in England. And his title did not survive Mary, who was succeeded by her sister Elizabeth. Henry, Lord Darnley, the husband of Mary Queen of Scots, was called King Consort of Scotland as a courtesy.

William of Orange was made co-ruler with his wife Mary II and thus became King William, and his title survived his wife’s death. Mary II had a superior claim to the throne as the daughter of James II and VII (William was the son of James’s sister), and William's secondary position in the succession was recognized in the settlement which provided that if Mary died first and William remarried, any potential children with a second wife would be after Queen Mary’s sister, Anne, in the succession, thus making her, after Mary's death, the only female Heir Apparent in British history.

It's certainly possible with more egalitarian rules about succession, the notion that King is a higher title can change and male consorts can be called King in some countries. With more queens regnant on the horizon all over Europe (Sweden, Norway, Belgium, the Netherlands, and Spain) and a move to have more equality between the sexes in these matters, we might see King or King Consort used by courtesy for the husbands of some of these future queens.

june35 · 21/06/2026 15:11

To go back to the original question, until William is king, Camilla out ranks Kate AND William. When and if Kate is crowned queen consort, I believe she will then out rank Camilla, but Camilla will still be top of the royal hierarchy after the king and queen consort as queen dowager.

George will not out rank Camilla until he is crowned king and Camilla is unlikely to be around for that.

AprilMizzel · 21/06/2026 15:38

if Kate is crowned queen consort

Many wives of kings "queens consort" were never coronated. Under British law, a monarch assumes the throne immediately upon the death of the predecessor, making the coronation a symbolic ceremony rather than a legal requirement.

So as soon as William becomes King - which is immediatley his Dad dies - Katherine becomes Queen.

It's less clear with Prince of Wales and Queen Dowager because monarchs can adjust the order apparemtly - and some sites are suggesting at formal banquets Prince of Wales heir apparent would outrank a dowager queen others think not.

I think Camilla being a step mother who came along fairly late in life - may mean things get adjusted so William's kids aren't below her - but will have to wait and see how that pans out.

june35 · 21/06/2026 15:45

AprilMizzel · 21/06/2026 15:38

if Kate is crowned queen consort

Many wives of kings "queens consort" were never coronated. Under British law, a monarch assumes the throne immediately upon the death of the predecessor, making the coronation a symbolic ceremony rather than a legal requirement.

So as soon as William becomes King - which is immediatley his Dad dies - Katherine becomes Queen.

It's less clear with Prince of Wales and Queen Dowager because monarchs can adjust the order apparemtly - and some sites are suggesting at formal banquets Prince of Wales heir apparent would outrank a dowager queen others think not.

I think Camilla being a step mother who came along fairly late in life - may mean things get adjusted so William's kids aren't below her - but will have to wait and see how that pans out.

I would be surprised if William really goes to the trouble of adjusting the historic protocols of royal rankings just to spite Camilla. If she’s still around she will be quite elderly by then and it would open up a can of worms - more and more people are questioning the need for a RF so if they start changing things like that it may make people wonder if we still need this ‘tradition’ at all.

CarolinaInTheMorning · 21/06/2026 16:19

june35 · 21/06/2026 15:45

I would be surprised if William really goes to the trouble of adjusting the historic protocols of royal rankings just to spite Camilla. If she’s still around she will be quite elderly by then and it would open up a can of worms - more and more people are questioning the need for a RF so if they start changing things like that it may make people wonder if we still need this ‘tradition’ at all.

This is a good point. While it's true that William as King would have the right and the power to adjust precedence any way he chose, he would call into question the whole system and seem quite petty to boot if, for example, he put a young prince or princess ahead of an elderly queen dowager.

Cloudconfusion · 21/06/2026 16:19

There is no such thing as granny ranking op.

camilla is queen, Carole is the future kinds mother in law. She’s the future kings granny, I’m not sure she will be with us when he’s on the throne

AprilMizzel · 21/06/2026 18:55

CarolinaInTheMorning · 21/06/2026 16:19

This is a good point. While it's true that William as King would have the right and the power to adjust precedence any way he chose, he would call into question the whole system and seem quite petty to boot if, for example, he put a young prince or princess ahead of an elderly queen dowager.

I think he'll only do it if there is some sort of need - but as protocol not well know not sure anyone would notice or care if it was adjusted and came with some justifying PR.

I expect what would happen in practice is Camilla will go into background pretty much anyway bar big Royal occasions where everyone will be very british and polite and avoid any potentail issues.

FirstNationsEnglish · 21/06/2026 19:18

Does Carole Middleton in some way out rank Camilla as the grandma of the future king ?

Camilla is not the children's grandma, she is their step-grandmother, and only that due to the fact she was in an adulterous affair with their grandfather ... which indirectly led to the premature death of their other 'blood' grandmother.

Regarding royalty, then of course Camilla 'outranks' Carole as Carole is only affiliated to royalty by marriage. However in the grandmother stakes, Carole is queen.