Would these comments and behaviours be reasonable deal breakers in dating?

[RedflagGreenflag]

I've was dating someone for a few months (met on Hinge, mid 40s)and am reflecting on my standards and self-esteem in the wake of it ending. Which, if any, would be deal breakers or have caused you serious concern?

-made a few silly sexual jokes whilst messaging, before we met eg..I asked him if he played a musical instrument and he made a joke about wanking
-first date in a coffee shop, I removed a long sleeved top as was too warm (had another top on underneath obvs) and he went "wahaaayyy" as if I was stripping
-made a joke about all women having a base level of psycho
-referred to disabled people as "Scopey"
-met a colleague of min at a works do and told me she was "rough" and this is why he doesn't date women from her area
-despite the fact he is on amicable terms with his ex wife, told me laughingly, when she asked for a divorce, that he had called her a "fat old witch" and threatened to take her pension
-told me inappropriate details about his ex including that she was restricted in sexual positions she could do due to bad hip and that she could orgasm immediately from anal sex (he told me this whilst we were in bed by way of praising my comparative flexibility)
-said "You look lovely in your dress; my ex wife never wore them because of her body type"
-met an acquaintance of mine and said "You're naturally beautiful, not like women like that who plaster on the make up"
-when I was trying to encourage him to get o know me better and asked if there was anything he wanted to know about me (cause I had tried to ask him lots about himself) he said "What is the smallest penis out there have encountered?
-told me, in bed, that he had yet to encounter a smelly vagina
-told me he had dumped a woman as her pubic hair was too long (after avoiding having sex with her for weeks)
-shortly after we began a sexual relationship, told me he thought genitals in general were gross and then was annoyed with me when I went a bit quiet and distant for a few minutes after he said that
-first time we had sex, he seemed clueless despite being married before and many relationships. He kissed me for a while and I was expecting some foreplay (I know I could have initiated this but I had lead on taking him up to my bedroom and removing clothes so didn't want to lead ointment everything). Without so much as touching me intimately, he entered me without a condom. He stopped as soon as I told him to and was visibly upset and said he thought I had wanted it as we were naked and he was laying on top of me. He was genuinely upset and I ended up comforting him!
-I disclosed to him that I had been sexually assaulted in a previous relationship. Despite this, he sent me a GIF that appeared to be of a woman being assaulted, face down on the floor and crying..looked like really rough porn but you could only see her face.
-he had some very laddish mates and he said he didn't judge them for sleeping with prostitutes although it was not something he would do. Told me they had all been giggling in the pub about some story about a woman with a massive anus.
-in a weird coincidence, a mate of his turned up at my house to collect something I had listed on marketplace. He arrived 15 minutes earlier that agreed and ex and I were in bed. When ex realised who it was, he got dressed and said hi his mate. he later told me that the incident had been the subject of joking on their group WhatsApp, with one them writing "He was just pulling out of her as he arrived!"

I felt unsettled with him lot. Would the above reasonably explain that? I have very poor self esteem and anxious attachment style and I am trying to work out if there were reasons outside of that which would make others feel insecure in this dynamic. He was affectionate, attractive, a good dad, good to his mum, a professional, kind to animals, funny, lots of friends and very keen on me. He would send gushing messages and romantic songs and GIFs a lot. He seemed quite future -focused with wanting to progress the relationship quickly. He made me feel very chosen. He was not the type to ask me things about how many men I had slept and liked natural-looking women. So there were lots of good things about him too.

I would suggest a significant time away from dating and getting some professional help if this man was better than previous ones.
Having been around someone similar he is seriously disturbed. I was in a bad place for a while afterward as I was very confused.
In my case, he could be very romantic and OTT with gestures. He was constantly telling people he was going to marry me.
But it’s all fantasy thinking. You are dealing with a seriously disturbed man. He may have a good career but so what? Plenty of sex offenders, rapists and murderers have responsible jobs.
The fact that his father was violent means he is violent by nature - the GIF showed that. Shouting at you when you were in bed naked could be classed as violent.
You need to stop working him out and working you out.
You need to look at your childhood and life experiences to understand why you didn’t walk away at the first sign of discomfort/shock.
Once you have done that you can have some boundaries in place for any future relationship.
I bet this man has friends who have wives who detest him and think he’s a creep.

He sounds to me like a man who never really grew up. There’s an element of lowest common denominator - all jokes, all words lead back to me talking about my penis. Someone in the thread said The Inbetweeners and that’s exactly what I thought of when I read ‘wahey’, I wouldn’t be surprised if he cheers in a restaurant when someone drops a plate like in a 90s school canteen.

Two things can be true at the same time. You can be nervous about having sex with someone after 25 years with the same person and also be a prick.

It isn’t the act of being nervous it’s how it manifests, does it manifest with clear, honest communication of ‘I’ve been with the same person for a long time’ or does it manifest with rabbit in the headlight actions that completely mis-read a situation and then turning yourself into a victim? The sensible thing at the point you said no, would be for him to say ‘I’m so sorry I completely mis-read the actions’ and then it could have opened up a conversation about foreplay rather than him becoming the hard done to party.

Equally, that being a hard boundary for you I don’t understand why you’d console him?

You’ve talked a lot about his red flags, and I do think you are well rid of him, but not so much your own actions around them. Often if you want to reflect, then reflection has to be examining your own role in events and asking what you did well, what you didn’t do well, what could you do differently.

This isn’t an exercise in blaming yourself for someone else’s shortcoming. This is about ‘did I exercise a boundary clearly, and did he respond to that with respect, or did I not exercise the boundary clearly, or did I exercise it clearly and it made no difference’

When he started talking about his ex wife after sex, did you say ‘I’m not sure talking about your ex wife after sex is the best bedroom chat’.

When he started sending gifs you didn’t think where appropriate did you say, you don’t think it’s appropriate?

I will repeat I do not say this to blame you for his actions, I say this because if you lay down boundaries quickly you will either see behaviour change or you won’t. That will tell you what you need to know much sooner. This person respects my boundary and changes their behaviour. This person can communicate and discuss behaviour I do not agree with and see my view point.

He did lose his temper with me twice but that seemed to be more about his fragile ego than outright aggression.

This was my experience with a man like this. He was lacking in lots of areas (sexually as well) and doubled down with insults when he felt threatened even if the threat was imagined (explaining that most women don't orgasm through penetration - something that was totally new to him and he choose not to believe - actually mansplaining to me how this was wrong!!!).

How long were you seeing him? Shouting at you / losing his temper twice sounds too frequent to me….

Have a look at the shark cage analogy for dating - I’ve seen it mentioned on here before. An effective “shark cage” will keep you safe from creeps like this. I suspect yours needs a bit more work.

I need you to know, that bad men know how to pretend to be good men.
Thats why they can appear sweet and funny and charming.
Red flags are there to show you whats underneath when the mask slips.
Women stay with abusive men for years for multiple reasons, but a large part of that is that these men can make the 'good' feel really good and genuine. Its an act. Its part of the psychology.

Face palm.

So now we’re adding, raises his temper with you when is ego is hurt and raised his voice at you when you were naked and vulnerable. All in the early stages of seeing him. Not even six months in.

And lots of men who are vocally very against violence ARE violent. It’s the “I’m a nice guy I’d never hurt anyone” bs. Nice guys don’t need to say they are nice guys. If he actually said the words “I’d never hit a women” btw that’s him telling you he would absolutely hit a woman, btw.

And his own father role model was violent. Cycles often repeat.

Op he is one hundred percent dangerous. I have no idea why you don’t see it.
It’s waving infront of you in neon with great big fecken bells on it.

Yes because men regularly lose their jobs for what they do behind closed doors…oh wait…no they don’t!

And it only takes one time to kill you.

But even if he’s never physically hurt you, it’s about the only red flag he hasn’t ticked. You don’t need to wait around for the full list.

I think this analysis is close to the mark…. he is just really emotionally immature. Mature in some ways…. competent dad, very responsible job but with this relational immaturity.

He wasn’t in one long marriage but two marriages plus a serious relationship that produced a child and plenty of other shorter relationships. So I was surprised he seemed so nervous and inept in bed. His ex wife does seem to be on reasonable terms with him so I don’t see that he is that bad. He even sent her a card when she was recovering from a recent operation.

I am trying to reflect on. My boundaries and I know I often kept quiet because incident want to seem difficult, uptight etc.

Yes, he told me early on that he never felt good enough in general, was more comfortable with criticism than praise and that he felt he was punching with me. But when I did try to raise something I felt wasn’t right, he experienced it as a personal attack, got defensive and belligerent.

OP, you're tying yourself in knots here. I do understand because I've done that myself in a previous, abusive relationship.

In future, you need to be incredibly cautious before disclosing to a man that you have a history of trauma, especially sexual trauma. Sadly many men will be completely indifferent to how this affects you and some, like your ex, will actively exploit it to harm you and get kicks from doing so. You've repeatedly expressed surprise/confusion that he, for example, sent that GIF whilst knowing you'd been sexually abused. The confusion disappears if you instead consider that he sent it because of your history and not despite it. As everyone else has said, he is bad news.

As PP have also noted, why on earth do you think the job he does is any indication of his character where women are concerned? You said you're sure he isn't "that type". Well, clearly he is because you gave us a long list of his repulsive behaviour.

Yes, I have absolutely been tying myself in knots. I felt really unsettled and emotional during this brief relationship and he has convinced me that I’m just too much. Whilst I can be anxious and am working in that, I guess I’ve been reflecting on whether there were good reasons I felt like that with him beyond just having anxious attachment. The rape gif came at the very end of the “relationship” so doesn’t in itself explain how I felt before that. I think I was quite overwhelmed by the early intensity he created .

The man who killed Sarah Everard was an experienced police officer who would have appeared to be a pillar of the community - but turned out to be a complete horror show. A “responsible job” is no real guarantee of behaviour and integrity in private life.

You're absolutely NOT too much. HE is not enough (as my ex wasn't).

Unfortunately, a certain generation of men's whole egos are based on the illusion of masculinity. And anything that dents their illusion of themselves as being strong and masculine is to be attacked.

Not understanding how a woman's body works? Criticise her.
Not understanding social niceties? She's too sensitive.
Not understanding normal boundaries (the talking about your sex life to his mates)? You're a prude.
Relationship breakdown? Financial control.
Upsets you with his insensitivity (see normal boundaries above)? Needs reassuring himself.

Since my ex I honestly can't be arsed with men. I know they're not all like that. But I think the good ones are snapped up FAST after divorce and the rest are the ones with problems.

I don't want to have to try to socialise a man at my stage of life. I accepted it once and he's a bit better than he was before our relationship. But urgh.

@ClawsandEffectI'm sorry you experienced that. X

Forgot to add: the man who abused me was also, on paper, respectable and responsible. Long-standing professional career and very active in the community in volunteering for good causes etc. Generally very well regarded and liked by those who knew him.
I too was told that I was just too much this, too little that and so on, to the extent that I became a shadow of myself.

@TreesAtSeaso sorry you experienced this.

I still think my ex was more immature, fragile-ego man child than abuser. Like I said, despite everything, his ex wife still speaks to him and he even goes to her for advice. So surely he can’t be that bad. They have even been able to laugh about the fact he called her a “fat old witch” when he was upset about her wanting a divorce.

I'm betting the 'fat old witch' is remarried while he's still single.

My ex's wife remained good friends with him for the duration of his life, even though, during their marriage, he beat her up on more than one occasion.

It means nothing.

Seriously, you need to STOP with the excuses and thinking that someone can't be abusive AND also be personable and friendly AND also be emotionally immature. Those things aren't mutually exclusive.

How many more times do people have to tell you? How can you not understand that it is abusive to send someone a gif of a woman being raped?

His insecurity isn't a sign that he wasn't abusive. Most abusive people are colossally insecure, actually.

@BauhausOfEliottthank you. That does help. I’ve really been tying myself in knots. Think I’m just scared to try dating again, especially as he labelled me as overly emotional. Made me feel I was 100 percent the problem.

Then you are absolutely not in the right headspace to be dating anyone, @RedflagGreenflag. In the kindest possible way, your judgement is so unbelievably out of whack you're actually a danger to yourself.

Well, I still speak, though usually by text, to the man who abused me as for certain practical reasons it would be very difficult to cut him off completely. But he is no longer in my life in any meaningful way, I never initiate contact and, most importantly, for years I've had zero illusions about who he really is underneath the surface.
And, yes, it was "that bad" in my case and, from what you've posted, it was for you too. When I finally started to see the light, I filled several A4 pages with incident upon incident over the years. I sometimes can't believe it myself when I read it all today.

@BauhausOfEliott and @Switherings are both spot-on, OP. Please listen to them and take their advice.

Maybe his ex wife keeps the peace because she’s well rid of him and there are children involved? Just because he sent her a card doesn’t make him a nice man.
If a woman discloses SA to a partner, and he sends a dark rape gif from a porn site to her as a message, he’s dangerous.
He is dangerous.
He is not just some bumbling fool with low self esteem.
The ‘bumbler’ I was with told me (I left soon after) that he’d driven his ex wife to a nervous breakdown just to taunt her.
She was eventually cordial with I’m as they had two daughters but he was a very, very warped man.
When we split up he told people I couldn’t cope with a relationship, I had a breakdown etc.
He had a large group of friends, great career, he’s constantly doing charity work.
But behind that mask he’s a distasteful man who I would not want any woman to go near.
You have to stop looking for crumbs of comfort.
There are none.
This man did nothing nice to you or for you. He wore a mask when he needed to but the real him is a very, very dark man.

I think you should do the Freedom Programme and therapy, as your boundaries seem way off and you're second guessing yourself over this man with a shopping list of terrible behaviours.

Him maintaining contact with an ex doesn't mean she's happy about it. She may still be in the cycle of abuse. Plenty of women continue to appease the abusive man they split up from, because of children or trauma bonds etc.

I don't think you should be dating again until you're in a much stronger and surer position emotionally.

A relationship shouldn't be difficult or painful or about constantly overlooking poor behaviour.

@PetulaGordenothanks for taking the time to respond. I know this will sound messed up but I minimised the rape gif at the time because I knew he was irritated with me. In fact, he actually broke up with me later that day so I wondered if he was just pushing me away at that point. It’s no excuse though and he is a grown man and I had done nothing wrong.

Honestly OP that list just gets worse and worse as you read it.
You're worth more than this, please don't give this man another thought.
You should be relieved its over