How do I persuade me elderly parents that they want to sell up and buy a property with an annexe with us?

[OrmRenewed]

Dad had a heart op in november. He's OK now but still not 100%. Both of them will be 79 this year. Mum has health problems too. We live 14miles away. Not far but far enough not to be always there when they need us. We want them to live with us but we have a 3-bed terrace and no space. And we know they will need there own space without children making noise all the time. Soooo.... when my friend was here we googled houses with an annexe and found a few that were perfect. 4 or 5 beds with a 2 or 3 bed annexe. Affordable if mum and dad sold their place and put approx half their equity in.
I don't know how they would take the idea. I don't know if they would love it, or resent the mere idea. But it makes sense.

So how do I put it to them? If at all.

Have you any siblings to consider? IHT issues and all that?

Yes I have a brother. Which is why I said only half their equity. They are selling in Bristol commuter belt and moving further away so would be cheaper.

I understand that this might be a really difficult issue to broach, Ormy, because there is a benefit for them and also a benefit for you.

The main issues seem to me to be establishing what they want and whether anyone else's nose would be put out of joint.

So how do they want to live? Do they really want to live cheek by jowl with a noisy young family?

And what about other siblings etc? If your parents had half their equity left, then presumably they should sign that over to them - if there are any. ANd then it all gets a bit like King Lear.

Thanks quattro. The only potential nose is DB's but if half their equity goes to him I can't see how he can object.

I need to have a serious conversation with them. I kept waiting for them to broach the subject, hoping they would. But I will have to gently break the ice. They currently live in a 4 bed house with a massive garden that they have always cared for with no help. Those days are gone now.

Sadly many of their friends have died. And they;ve stopped a lot of the activities they did. Their main interest is volunteering in a town about equidistant between them and us.

Sorry about that

Before broaching it with them, I'd sit down and have a chat with your DB to make sure he is happy with the idea

You also need to consider what happens in the event of them needing a substantial amount of care. I'm thinking in terms of incontinence, dementia etc. What would you envisage happening then? Would you be prepared to undertake that care? Because it could be a very long term commitment and potentially pretty unfair on you in relation to your DB.

If the plan is for nursing care in the longer term, then that would need to be funded and you'd need to think about how you would manage that. I think there are provisions whereby local authorities could claw back some proceeds from sales of houses etc. Best get a solicitor who knows about that sort of stuff to advise you.

I didn't think about talking to DB first. Good idea. And if they went for it I am 100% sure that dad would get a solicitor onto it straight away - he's quite canny re money etc.

Thank you all.

If I were you I would talk to your brother about it first, make sure he has no concerns.

But have you considered what would happen in the future if they needed care that you couldn't provide? Normally they would be expected to sell their house to fund residential care, I think. I don't know what would happen if they part-owned your house.

HAve you spoken to them about it? I think you need to discuss the possibility with them but without mentioning that you have already been searching for houses.

Also - perhaps have a look for 3 bedroom houses with an annex so that they have some equity left for themselves. I would personally not be happy with giving half my equity to my two children and having nothing left of my own.

"I would personally not be happy with giving half my equity to my two children and having nothing left of my own"

yes that concerns me too.

why not talk to them about selling up and buying a place nearer to you?

My dad moved into a bungalow next to our house ( we bought them as one unit ) He put it what he could afford after selling his house. ( about 20 % of the price we paid.) We had 16 wonderful years of living with Grandad Tom and never regretted it for a minute. I nursed him at home and he died in his own bedroom with me by his side. His name never appeared on the deeds as he didn't want us to have to sell the house when he died. His cash was then divided between my 2 siblings. If you can do it and your parents can have their own space we found it was a wongerful way to live.

Orm do they have any savings other than the house, so that they would still have their own cash other than just pension coming in?

I can see why you want to do it - I think you should speak to your DB and get his take, and then the two of you broach it with your parents if DB is in agreement.

lonicera - that would be better but as they are so elderly and with health problems it might be that they would need more care sooner rather than later and then they might have to make another move, in with us, or into a home.

mummig - that is exactly what I'd want. It sounds lovely

alibaba - I find their finances complicated TBH but they have an existing reasonable income beyond their pension.

I think the next step is to take to DB.
Thanks all.

sounds a bit like you will be gaining a lot and your brother will be somewhat worse off... but just ask. if they want to they'll do it. not sure why you need to "persuade" them.

I would think long and hard about doing this. A friend of my mums's did this. Her daughter and SIL then decided to sell the house they had bought together (can't remember why but it was about three years after they bought together). They gave the share of the property to my mum's friend equivalent to what she had contributed. It wasn't enough to buy the equivalent of the house she had sold three years previously so she ended up living in a flat and being pretty unhappy about it (but would never have said anything to her daughter).

I don't think she was deliberately shafted by her daughter but the effect was much the same.

that's a bit harsh isn't it, herhonesty? I personally would have said it was the other way round - the brother gets half the equity and doesn't have to do the looking after of 2 elderly parents.

I remember talking about this with my mum and she said as long as you lot live in the annexe
She likes her space and garden too much to downgrade.

We're doing this with my parents who did the same thing with my grandma.

Mum and dad have a big enough house in an area we are happy to live in so we are buying half the equity from them. They then have the choice whether they give that money to my siblings or use it to buy themselves a seperate house somewhere else either to let out or use for holidays etc.

We're going to hold the house as tenants in common (not joint) so we each have defined shares which should help if full on care is needed i.e we might have to sell up but our equity is protected.

If they need basic care/ attention, we'll be around to give that and that has been agreed with my siblings. We're also drawing up a full schedule of how bills etc will be paid and what obligations each have - things like welcome to come into our bit of the house but please don't do so early in the morning, adult bedrooms are private, that sort of thing.

When we first suggested the idea, my brother had an interesting comment that he wasn't entitled to any share of the house until mum and dad were dead so didn't need to be bought out immediately iyswim. If mum and dad either then needed a lot of care or decided to spend their retirement crusing round the world, he wouldn't get anything and that wasn't our problem.

Not that interested in any inheritance as such. But there is a lot of equity from the house which my parents may well use to look after themselves as and when they need to. I am suggesting a way of doing that.

As to my DB getting a bad deal, I think that as he is 4 hrs away and can help very little with my parents, I reckon he's not doing that badly really. He will be left free of the day-to-day concern for 2 ageing parents

I would be careful and really discuss it carefully with your brother. My parents built an annexe on their house which my gran paid to have built but she died not long after moving in. My parents did give my uncle nearly half of what she had paid for the building work but my gran had paid for all the furnishings and bought very expensive ones. My uncle is still convinced that the whole thing was all an evil plot by my parents to increase the value of their home and as a result my family are now estranged from his

If your parents buy furniture, fixtures and fittings for their annexe and then die, is your brother going to demand he gets half the value of those? Be wise to check.