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Original poster

first time buyers and tenancy aggreements

34 replies

Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 13:25

Hi all ,
We are actively looking for a property to buy and we are privetely renting . Our shorthold tenancy aggreement ends in june . We have asked our landlord through the estate agent for a periodic tenency with a 2 months notice on our part .
Unfortunately he is reluctunt to accept that so we are now in a doficult situation . On the one hand we dont want to sign a contract as we might find a property before the contract ends . On the other hand we dont want to rush into buying something.
Does anyone have any advice ?if we find a property in the next fee weeks will we actualy have everything ready to move by june july ?

OP posts:
wowfudge · 31/03/2016 13:44

Whether you have an AST or a statutory periodic tenancy, your LL will need to give you two months notice to end it and with the AST it can't end before the fixed period is up. You don't have to move out once the two months have expired - the section 21 notice the LL needs to send you is notice that he intends to repossess the property. If you don't go voluntarily, he'll have to evict you via the courts.

Is your deposit correctly protected in one of the three schemes? If not, the LL cannot correctly serve a s21 notice and it will be invalid.

If you don't sign any new AST, your tenancy will automatically become a statutory periodic one anyway. You only have to give one month's notice.

CotswoldStrife · 31/03/2016 13:51

Meh, that is tricky. Presumably if you don't sign the new AST the LL will issue 2 months notice anyway for you to go in June.

Our Estate Agents always say that it takes around 3 months to purchase a house and I think that's pretty accurate - sometimes it mystifyingly takes longer.

The trouble is that if you leave your current rented property then you'll be unlikely to get less than 6 months anywhere else.

PreemptiveSalvageEngineer · 31/03/2016 14:01

Add to which, if you found a property today, it'd still take several weeks for any purchase to complete, so factor that in, as well.

Best of luck, by the way!

Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 14:02

Wowfudge i am assuming he will give us two months notice now in order for us to keave in june . I am not sure why he is not agreeing to us giving him 2 months notice one our offer has been accepted its really frustrating . Our deposit is proteccted .
If he gives us two konths notice and we dont find anything by june is it possible to ask to stay ?

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Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 14:03

Thanks preem .

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Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 14:04

Cots we are to view properties with no chain currently empty would that still take 3 months ?

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hejsvejs · 31/03/2016 14:06

Refuse to sign the new AST and it will automatically turn into a periodic one.

I can't see him serving good tenants notice because of this.

Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 14:13

Thats what i am thinking hej
We are offering to give him 2 months notice on periodic even if we are legally binded to give just one . I dont see what he could gain by not agreeing to this and serving us woth notice
We even accepted a 25 pounds increase in rent

OP posts:
PreemptiveSalvageEngineer · 31/03/2016 14:14

We're cash buyers, looking primarily at empty properties. The fastest conveyancer we could find still can't guarantee to get it all done in less than six weeks. There's a lot of little fiddly bits that need to be done - some of them with goverent agencies ('nuff said!), some with the seller's solicitors, and no matter what the seller says, they don't necessarily hustle.

Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 14:36

Wow i would think cash buyers on an empty property would be more straight forward ! This is all very frustrating!

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Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 14:52

Also do you think is worth trying to contact the landlord directly to ask for this ? We have been negotiating though agents at the moment

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northerngoldilocks · 31/03/2016 14:57

Yes - ask the landlord directly if possible. Agents are likely to get renewal fees so in their interest for you to renew for 12 m. You may need to offer 2 months notice and that you won't give notice between Oct - January or something - as over Xmas is a difficult time re re-letting. Assuming you'd have hoped to have bought by then anyway. Otherwise - what about a 12m contract with a 6m break clause? This is the standard contract I offer tenants.

wowfudge · 31/03/2016 15:04

That makes a difference OP: you are talking to the agents and not the LL. They are interested in getting contract renewal fees and anything else they can charge for. Contact the LL direct. Otherwise the agents may just tell him you've said you're leaving at the end of the fixed term.

wowfudge · 31/03/2016 15:07

There's no 'if possible' about it when it comes to contacting the LL - you are entitled by law to his contact details. If you don't already have them, the agents must supply them, I think within 28 days.

Worst case scenario - can you put your things in storage and lodge with a friend or family for a short while? When I bought my first house I gave notice on the flat I rented and lodged for about five weeks with a friend, who also let me store my stuff on his landing.

bluespiral · 31/03/2016 15:11

I just wouldn't sign a new contract and it will automatically turn into a monthly rolling one. If you continue to pay your rent and have been good tenants I can't see them wanting you out.

NoSquirrels · 31/03/2016 15:22

I'd definitely get in touch with the LL direct. We always let tenants go onto periodic, but we dealt direct with them. When we rented ourselves, the agents rack up nice fees from both LL and tenants at renewal time, so they won't be advising the LL to let you do this!

Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 15:22

We are a professional (both working ) couple with no kids always paying rent on time obviously so i think we are confident considered "good" tenants.
Wowfudge we are expats here so no family around unfortunately i guess we could stay at friends for a while but becasue how long it will take its very unpredictable i would like to avoid that .
I have asked for the landlords details previously when there was a leak from the flat upstais and the agent wouldnt give it to us as she said is her job to contact the agent
So i am pretty sure she wont give it to us now .
We have a business address in the contract so i guess we could write to them

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Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 15:28

She came back to me saying that the landlord can agree to a renewal at 1200 per month (currently 1175 ) for a further 12 months with a 3 months breaking clause we will need to give two months notice but can only serve this after 1 month has passed
I just dont see how the landlord benefits from this ? He will have renewal fees and i will still be able to leave with the same amount of notice
How is this betrer than periodic ?

OP posts:
MsSampson · 31/03/2016 15:40

The answer is that it's not better for the landlord, but it is better for the agent. If you just move on to a periodic tenancy then they can't charge you £200 or whatever for drawing up a new contract.

The exact same thing happened to us, and I called their bluff, and said that we would move out. They agreed to let us stay. Risky strategy! (although not for us as it turned out our deposit wasn't protected, so there would have been nothing they could have done anyway). Definitely contact the LL directly. If you tell the agent that it's your legal right to have your LL's contact details they'll probably give them to you sharp-ish. If I was being charitable I would say Letting Agents often operate in ignorance of property law, although some of them must be fully aware and operate on the basis that most tenants are.

I would highly recommend a quick look at the relevant section of the Shelter website to understand your rights.

MsSampson · 31/03/2016 15:41

That should have been that some agents operate on the basis that most tenants are ignorant of property law...

Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 16:03

I have asked her agent and she said they cannot pass the landlord details as the property is fully manage by them but they are happy tonhelp with any further negotiations .
I can not find anything relevant saying i am entitled to have the contact details of the agent . Can anyone help ?

OP posts:
wowfudge · 31/03/2016 16:14

You mean the landlord - under section 1 of the Landlord and Tenant Act 1985 the landlord's agent must provide the landlord's address within 21 days of receiving the request. It is a criminal offence not to provide it without reasonable excuse. 'We manage the property' isn't reasonable excuse in these circumstances.

Original poster
Nicky883 · 31/03/2016 16:21

Thanks wowfudge yes i meant the landlord i have quoted that section so i am hopping that she gives me the details .
I just want to discuss it with the landlord to make sure she told him wxcactly what we said as i dont see why this 3 months breakong clause contract is better

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wowfudge · 31/03/2016 16:23

The other option is to download the title register for the property from the Land Registry website. It costs £3 for an instant download. Make sure you use the official govt website. With any luck his address will be on there.

wowfudge · 31/03/2016 16:25

A lot of agents are ignorant of the law relating to all sorts of aspects of the business they are in.