Help me better communicate with my adult children

[hooyah]

I am mum of two boys 17 nearly 18 and 20 and in the last few years, I really feel like our relationship has suffered to the point where we don’t chat anymore, I feel like they’re constantly avoiding me and don’t really like me. This is obviously upsetting and I’ve been talking to my husband about it at length initially looking for support asI feel they are actually quite rude to all times But it basically ended up him telling me I need to reframe the way I communicate with them as I’m driving them away.

Well, this doesn’t take away from the fact I think my husband should be more vocal if they are disrespectful to me, I also have to acknowledge what he’s saying and maybe need to think about reframing the way I communicate with them but struggling to basically change what I think who I am and what I say.

A couple of examples - When we were on holiday, the boys went on a night out absolutely fine, and when I asked about how their night was, they also mentioned they hired bikes to get home. This was a 30 minute cycle through a city Centre and they had both drunk a fairly significant amount & I commented that they shouldn’t have hired bikes and cycled after drinking so much. This of course killed the conversation and my oldest said Christ I wish we’d not said anything.

another day we spent at the villa the two boys literally stayed indoors all day Watching films and on their phones., I expressed dissatisfaction that we’ve spent all this money on a holiday for them to stay indoors. Dc got annoyed and gave very curt/rude responses.

these are very minor, but you get the gist. I think the problem is I do nag. I do struggle to let go but I also parent and want to keep them safe but I can’t seem to find the balance.

any advice?

You will push them away if you carry on like this.

Yes they were daft re the bikes but… it had happened. So nothing to be gained.

And a day chilling on the screen aged 18 and 20…. Maybe that’s what they fancied. They were on holiday. What did you want them to do?

how are they being rude and disrespectful in these examples?

Your husband…. marriage Issues?

Im guessing you’re quite negative about a lot that they do. Why is a screen day on a villa holiday (assuming mainland Europe where it’s been hotter than hell all summer) such an issue that it warrants comment?

If you are routinely negative in conversation with them then yes they’ll avoid it. The comment about the bikes was particularly pointless because they’d already done it.

can you think of some positive things to say?

at this age the intensive parenting is largely done and it’s only really if they come to you for advice that parenting really swings in.

making negative comments about their choices isn’t really parenting at this point,

No marriage issues and disrespect and rudeness is different for each - my Eldest does have quite a sharp tongue, swears more than I would like & It’s probably the more disrespectful of the two. my youngest generally is better but when they’re together, I guess they gang up & take a similar approach, but, I have to accept that maybe they feel under attack . It’s just more things like eye rolling, tone so the way they speak to me like I’m talking rubbish or stupid.

You repeat that you don’t feel your husband advocates for you re the disrespect?

Have you spoken to him about this?

Yes, I hear what you’re saying commenting on something they’ve done is pointless and this is what I need to stop - but how?!? I fear it’s so ingrained in the way I communicate with them. I’m really struggling to change.

Why does your DH have to be vocal if they are disrespectful to you? You should be vocal about this yourself!

Sorry OP but you do sound like a bit of a fun sponge. I can see why that's depressing for them.

Do these boys work? your younger one work at and school and keeps his nose clean?

They are generally thriving boys?

For a start, tell THEM that you are going to try not to be a negative nag so much

I can empathise a little because I have similar internal thoughts when I have conversations with my late teen / adult children too. But the difference is I’ve learnt to keep quiet. You really have to let them do what they like now. It’s not your place to say anything naggy - you have to hope you’ve done a good enough job that they’re going to be relatively sensible and just let it go.

DH was in a similar situation. Every conversation he had with the kids always turned into some sort of lecture or demand.

Thankfully, he realised how damaging it was and really makes an effort to just chat with them. Build them up rather than knock them down.

How would you treat someone who was constantly negative?

I think your DH is right about reframing your communication / relationship with them. They are adults now so you have to evolve. Treat them as equals not parenting them constantly, expecting them not to swear / don't try to tell them how to be on holiday.

do you have any positive examples of when conversation goes well? What are their interests? What makes them laugh?

what do you enjoy? What makes you laugh? Can you do a trial of just trying to build positive conversations and interaction and bite your tongue on anything negative?

observe how they interact with your husband and vice versa? How does he connect with them?

can you try imagine if they were your friends or acquaintances... you wouldn't be telling friends to buck up and do more presumably? Try to apply the same approach to the boys and see what happens..

I think you are beyond the years of 'boys respect your mother' (although your DH might be more inclined to say something if he sees you making an effort but them not responding)

It’s hard to let go but one is an adult and the other basically legally so.

It’s about parenting them but non mutual respect.

It’s not easy and you do have to change how you word things and i get the transition because my ds is 21 so I’ve just been through it.

I would have worded them being on screens all day as “it’s clear you are feeling rough after a good night out. I think a day chilling is a great idea as I was thinking tomorrow we can make the most of <whatever> by doing/going <whatever>.”

With the bikes I’d have commented “well I’m glad that turned out better than it could have as I wouldn’t have wanted to deal with <enter consequences> in a foreign country”

You can point out risks etc without nagging. But ultimately they know the risks and part of growing learning to RA.

And we probably all took those risks or worse as teens/early adults. We had far looser RA boundaries - and no mobile phone if it all went wrong!

As a secondary teacher of 30 years, and having two young adults (boys) of a similar age, my top tip would be ‘pick your battles’.
what do you like about them? It’s all been quite negative so far, but I bet they’ve both got a lot going for them. Do you tell them?
Do you have fun with them?
Are they able to give input into what you do together? (ie: on holiday) did you do things they enjoy? If you did, did you tell them how much you enjoyed their ideas?
They are young men, they will make poor choices, that’s part of how they learn. Our role is not to remind them of every poor choice, hopefully they learned most of that by seeing you role model as they grew up. I see our role as one where they can come to us when they’ve done something that they need help with, so if for instance they had been caught for drink cycling, you may need to help to navigate how to get out of trouble.
There are times when it can become negative for all of us, in my experience this is when I dig deep and think about what they are good at, their best attributes and try to focus on those.
I know it’s not always easy, but it’s likely they will do things you don’t approve of, but they are navigating how they are going to be as adults. Let them make mistakes, and try not to focus on them. They will not be duplicates of you and your husband, they are separate from you and will be different.
if you can change the narrative, I think you’ll find that your relationship with each of them will improve quite quickly.
I’ve always found that when I’m in the car, or walking besides one of mine, they begin to talk and I just try to listen. If they want a comment, and I’m worried about them, I try to pose a question, rather than give a negative reaction.

My friend used to have a box for her stroppy 17 year old (who planned to go away to uni) and whenever she was particularly horrible my friend would put something into the box, like loo rolls or a new kettle or something, so that she could comfort herself that that day was soon coming. Her daughter never realised what she was doing. 😁

When my ds eye rolls and talks as if im
stupid my common response is

“did you really just eye roll and act as if someone whose been on this
planet as long as you couldn’t possibly have more knowledge about that than you and is stupid. Because that really would be the definition of stupid”

That gets him backtracking every time.

It’s quite a common phrase to go through - thinking you know more than your elders. For me I find the trick is not locking horns but getting him to think about his actions.

“DS, do you actually think I don’t know anything about X?”

”well no”

“ok, so can I ask why your tone of voice indicates you think I’m an idiot?”

DS and I have a really good relationship. He does respect me and absolutely hates when I think he’s treating me like an idiot etc.

However tang doesn’t mean at times his tone and actions and behaviour don’t indicate that exactly what he thinks. But I also know if went in combative his age and lack of maturity would get him locking horns.

I’ve found this age is like a game of
semantical Tetris!

That and the ability to tell ds im legally not responsible for him so living under my roof does come with a minimal expectation of behaviour!!!!

Honestly right now I’m struggling to think the last time we enjoyed a really good laugh together or sat around the table and I didn’t end up feeling shit (Which I blamed on their altitude, but thinking now is probably because I said something that was unnecessary!) and that’s really sad and why I’ve come on here for help. I genuinely feel like I have forgotten (Maybe never learnt) how to talk with them as equals and adults who are decent / lovely human beings finding their way in the world. Eldest works full-time and he’s currently saving for a flat with friends. Youngest has just passed his driving test and going into final year of A levels all of which of course is pretty amazing so I really don’t have any reason to be so negative and that’s what so frustrating now I’ve actually realised what I’m doing.

Lovely positive conversation tips needed. We’re out for dinner tonight and I’m determined to change things for the better before it’s too late.

You can do it OP! Starting tonight.

Good on you

and honestly be honest and say that you are aware of the nagging and going to try to reign it in

At dinner tonight, perhaps you could start with something like:
I’ve been reflecting on how I speak to you, and I know I come across as negative, so I’d like to say sorry and try to be much more positive going forwards. I’m actually really proud of you both, I see how you have been able to work and achieve and I just want you to know I see the great things you do too.

This is perfect and thank you all. Time to change and I think making myself accountable upfront is definitely the way forward

Sending 💐 and 🩷 OP!

its not easy to change patterns and habits you have fallen into so it's big thing to take on.

remember people probably won't notice your efforts straight away and then are also unlikely to change / response immediately..

I would start by trying to be a bit quiete and focus on watching / observing the others. Listen to them, hold back any negatives and try to respond positively / encourage things they are saying.

let your DH know what you are doing so he can be supportive, help encourage positive conversation, doesn't inadvertently call you out on being different (they might mistake quietness as moodiness so be careful here). Ask him for tips if he is willing to give them as he knows you all best and was the one to originally suggest reframing. Try not to get disillusioned or down if it still feels like you can't connect well straightaway - it will take time. Ask him to help bring you into the conversation if there is a habit of them all grouping together. Can he give you extra affection (hand hold etc) to help you feel that you have his support.

you might want to consider some counselling once back home so you can work through your feelings and how you can evolve in a safe space without bringing your sons into it.

I think you have to learn not to micromanage them, to show interest and curiosity in their lives/adventures, and be supportive rather than judgmental. I know it is hard, but they will make choices you don't approve of, learn to pick your battles.

Also, for things like holidays together, maybe ask them what they would like to do, tell them what you would like to do and negotiate things you will do together before hand, and give them space beyond that.

So at dinner tonight just ask a simple

”so what’s everyone’s favourite sort of the holiday so far?”

Listen and nod to the answers.

find some shared ground you’ve all enjoyed and suggest doing that activity again as a group.

It’s hard as they grow up because as parents we tend to focus on what they no longer enjoy doing with us or as adults.

When you find the common ground that disappears because you’re left ft with the shared enjoyment.

That and a pack of cards so you can keep the fun safe and away from conflict if conversation dwindles!

@hooyahHow did the meal go? I’m hoping well!