DD continuous stealing/lying

[Despairingatxmas]

We desperately need some help as to how to stop this behaviour as I'm exhausted from it. DD is almost 13, since she was around 8 she has been 'stealing' things from us and others. It started with small amounts of food, special treats saved etc, this has happened consistently for almost 5 years. We have tried giving her her own box of treats each week, she eats all of that and then takes from her younger siblings/our boxes. It has now escalated to things, make up mostly that has been taken from my bedroom and/or my handbag, last week she took £80 from the side pocket in my handbag intended to give the cleaner. She can 'earn' £45 a month in pocket money if her bedroom is kept tidy but she seems to have decided not to bother. We have asked why she died it many many times and she just says 'don't know', never sorry or any emotion and im now hugely worried. Does anyone have any ideas on what to do? I have just found something else that has been stolen and I can't decide if taking Christmas presents is too harsh or if im being ridiculous to even consider giving them to her now. Help! X

@Despairingatxmas this is my DD1, who is now 16 and diagnosed with binge eating disorder. My DD is adopted so has a trauma background which goes some way to explaining her behaviours. She is also diagnosed with ADHD (plus autism) and I strongly suspect that she is dopamine seeking when she ‘steals’ everyone else’s treats and raids the cupboards for serious quantities of carbohydrates and foods containing sugar. Is there any possibility your DD could have ADHD?

Do you know what she is doing with the money she is stealing? Is there any chance she could be getting bullied at school or trying to ‘buy’ friendships?

I totally empathise with your feelings of despair. Our situation has been ongoing for five years now - it coincided with the start of puberty and secondary school - and shows no sign of abating, despite many interventions. I cannot keep ANY money in the house, except for a couple of pounds hidden in a tin of Dobble, my DD1 cannot ever be left in our home unsupervised, like never, and I have just invested in a proper security safe so that I can store my DD2’s Christmas treats and sweets as she is only seven and deserves to have some semblance of a normal childhood.

Some ideas: can you speak to your DD’s head of year or pastoral leaders to try to ascertain if there may be any issues at school; does the school have a community police liaison officer who would have a gentle word about the repercussions of stealing money; can you self-refer to CAMHS or can you afford private therapies; if you believe there is an issue with food in general (and my DD1 steals money and bank cards to fund mega-binges) then the eating disorder charity BEAT has a wealth of resources and training courses you can access.

I was like this as a teen sadly. What are her friends like/financial situations?
My family are comfortable financially but not incredibly wealthy and I went to a private school on a scholarship so all my friends were incredibly well off and had huge amounts of pocket money. I couldn’t keep up so I would steal a little here and there to help. My parents also gave me £40pm to keep my room tidy but it wasn’t enough. Bear in mind she’s 13 so she’ll probably want to go to Starbucks with friends after school or get some sweets etc. A tenner a week will allow her to do this once a week and nothing else, no spending or saving money etc. £45pm isn’t enough and it isn’t worth it to her unfortunately.

The root cause of this is that she needs money. She’s a teenager so don’t expect her to be open, empathetic and considerate. A lot aren’t!
You need to talk to her about how much money she needs, when and what for. Then create a list of jobs she can do around the house to earn that money in a month. Ie she needs £100pm, create a list of jobs that in total equal £100pm.

dont kick off at her, she’ll just push back and it’ll create a rift. Remember some kids have little emotional intelligence at this age but she doesn’t mean it. She’ll grow up and be embarrassed but at this point support her in getting what she needs.

you have a cleaner so might be able to afford that but if not you should support her to make money herself in the local community. Dog walking etc

I was similar although didn't steal money. I was bulimic for years and hid it very effectively. The stealing is probably an effect from something else underlying. It sounds food orientated from what you've said but could be something different. Can you afford private therapy? My mum insisted I went, in hindsight I'm glad she did.

£100 a month in pocket money seems completely wild, is that what 13 year olds get?? It does feel quite food orientated BUT it’s also the things so make up etc so I’m unsure. We can explore private therapy but what would I be looking for, someone who helps with compulsive behaviour or do you think someone who deals specifically with food? Thank you @WhompingWillows, whilst I do see there is an impulsiveness I’m not sure about ADHD, the dopamine hit idea is worth some more thought. X

@WhompingWillows and I will speak to school after the holidays as the PCSO input could be hugely helpful I think x

I would look at a psychotherapist specialising in teenagers, they will likely have expertise in a broad range of issues. She may not really understand her own drivers of her behaviour, it doesn't necessarily need labelling, she just needs support to understand it and her feelings.

Does she go into town on her own/with friends? If she does she will be caught shoplifting sooner or later.

In terms if the current behaviour, take something of hers to compensate every time she steals.

@Despairingatxmas I cannot reinforce how this is the worst possible advice ever in your situation.

I am sure you know this OP, but do not do this. The stealing is driven by something else psychological that needs exploring and understanding. This would be a terrible approach to take.

Christmas has been particularly tough, I think I'm now super on edge that any moment she is going to take something. I didn't want to see her not give people a card Christmas Day so I gave her some money to pick some up, she got a card and small present for everyone except me. It's so stupid but lots of other stuff I feel like I get over relatively quickly, this lack of thought feels really hard. She isn't sorry whatsoever just feels it's my fault as when asked before Christmas I said I wasn't sure what I wanted. I just wanted the tiniest token item to show she had thought about me but perhaps I'm asking too much.

Is she giving the money to 'friends' OP?

I only ask as my friend's DD (diagnosed ASD and ADHD) went through a stage of this. She was obviously vulnerable and kids at her school would ask her to bring money in. They had great difficulty in getting her to understand that they were taking advantage of her. Poor kid was desperate for friends having been terribly bullied.

Does the school have a senco you can talk to?

No, she's always had a tricky time making friends but she spent the money on buying overpriced food from a local tourist attraction. I think this is the only time she's taken money, perhaps lack of opportunity as we rarely have cash though

Then I'd go down the senco route and counselling.

I've known a few foster kids (with and without diagnosis) who used to steal food/money and they've all come good with the right in put and support. Its been hard work for everyone involved but they've gone into adulthood as lovely and kind young people. Best wishes OP

Please don't go down the diagnosis route before you talk to her openly...

I have a lock on my bedroom door.

Stealing is often a cry for attention.

I stole from my mum when l was 9. My dad died when l was 8. She must have spoken to someone because she just gently asked me about it. I stopped soon after.

maybe you've mentioned this elsewhere but i don't understand restricted food?
now all children and households are different but we had zero limits on food (if i brought it into the house, it was meant to be eaten).
my dh remembers as a teen "various degrees of starvation" as he puts it (tall healthy build family).
when we ran out we ran out till the next shopping day, zero stigma on who finished the crackers, who ate half a loaf of bread etc.
we had the kids in some high level sports and certainly thought nothing of feeding them 24/7 (scrambled eggs at 0400).
stealing however was never an issue but they would have heard this being unacceptable from an early age, similar with lying and cheating zero tolerance.
zero cash ever given till high school all gifts for friends family pre approved, purchased together, dh would have shopped with them for me and me for him.
as for high school $$ it was for school lunches.
it must be very difficult but why is food bought but limited?

Food isn’t ‘limited’, we buy specific things that each child in particular likes for their breakfasts, lunch boxes and snacks. I read online that giving her her own snacks that were just hers that she had chosen would help reduce the stealing. In our house outside of meal times, I expect the kids to ask if it’s ok to have xyz, however with our daughter I’ve said she can have whatever our of her box without checking as long as she knows that once it’s gone it’s gone until I shop again the following week.

Are you feeding her enough?
does the family have financial constraints interfering with grocery purchases or suitable physical activity sports to balance out the snacking?
in some ways I see your set up and forcing her to steal.
and why do you view it as stealing?
equally strange her buying food treats for friends, don’t kids like lip gloss, bath bombs, hair clips.
if indeed she’s food obsessed, you’ll want that investigated but what is your relationship with food like?

I know I'll get slated but I'd punish her very severely every time she steals. Take her off the internet for a week. Take something of hers to give to siblings if she takes their things, including her pocket money until she stops stealing from others. Your other DC shouldn't end up losing their things because she is greedy and doesn't give a shit about her family. I'd ask her why she thinks she's being excluded from family treats, and remind her it's because she's stolen from family. If she didn't steal for a week she'd get her pocket money back. She's above the age of criminal responsibility and she'll end up in severe trouble with police if you don't stamp it out. I'd have come down hard from day 1 not let it go on for 5 years.

@caringcarer i know i'm a vintage (grandmother now) and yes there would have been serious repercussions like you said with frequent reminders regarding trust and the importance of relationships etc etc. but equally this would have happened when 3-4-5 when little ones try to take things that are not theirs. mind you the morality of not coveting, not stealing, lying would have been overheard as a family from early on in life, it's just not a done thing.
equally i know this approach is probably no longer well regarded but will have been rebranded to suit the younger generation who generally appear to have a much softer approach vs the guilting methods that were used 30+ years ago.

Some children - and adults - have eating disorders (specifically binge-eating disorder and bulimia) that mean that they cannot control their compulsions/addictions around food. I have to have certain foods locked away in a safe as my DD1, who has binge-eating disorder, cannot control herself; she prowls around the house in the middle of the night and eats and eats and eats and eats. Her eating is not about hunger it is about an addiction and compulsive behaviour. I literally cannot afford to replace the binge shopping but I have to as I am obligated to feed my DD2, who is seven.

I’m 60.

My dm sought advice and treated me very gently. It’s a cry for attention.

I would tell her it’s wrong and ask her to pay it back. Then l wouldn’t mention it.

Stealing can be a sign of ADhD/ASD or trauma too. If she’s been doing it since 8 l would wonder if there’s more going on.

100% that there might be underlying neurodevelopmental issues.