ALERT !!!! Designer vagina on tele tonight !

[Pupuce]

Just looked at what's on tele tonight to discover that Channel 4 has a programme at 10pm on designer vaginas*... California latest trend ! What will they think of next ! Anyway I thought this would be a good topic for tomorrow's discussions.....

• For aesthetic reasons or to improve sensation after childbirth - I read.

pupuce - that caught my eye aswell, and I must admit, I'm strangely drawn even though I know it will probably make me want to puke!

If you have a designer vagina, does that mean you give birth to model babies? That's if you ever dare go through labour again after all the injections, snips and tucks or whatever the surgeons have to do.

Ouch, ouch, ouch! Give me designer CLOTHES any day!

What does the "model" one look like anyway, most women never really see other women's? Was discussing this at work today, to learn of someone with 11 piercings down there! Now, that is OUCH!!!!!!

Where do they put the 'designer label?'

On their designer labia?

All right so it reminded me of my episiotomy... it felt as painful ! And no one mentioned pelvic floor exercises... would that not solve most (maybe not all) problems ?
I found the programme balanced but I did smile when I saw the NY lady (the one who wanted to be as tight as possible) running in Central park in a skimpy top (looked like no bra) and wondered when she would go for a breast plastic surgery... as they might drop soon........ (sorry I had to have a go at her!)
The urologist was good at giving the other side of the coin operation wise (I thought)....
Now I'll have to look in the mirror but from what I remember I see no reason to go to LA !

Good night girls !!!!!

I was doing my pelvic floor exercises while I was watching. Found it a little boring really, mainly dippy Californians.

Pupuce - I too thought the most painful part of the whole programme was seeing that woman running along with no bra! And no, quite honestly the thought of any more tinkering in that department, after having stitches for all 3 of my births, brings me out in a cold sweat. If I had that amount of money, I think I would rather spend it on something less painful - but good luck to all of those brave (and rich) enough to do it!

This programme really irritated me because it was trying to tackle two issues in one and getting them pretty much mixed up. The biggest problem most of these women were facing was lack of tone in their vaginas after the stretching that occurs during childbirth. And no, it doesn't do much for your sex life (after two long labours and two ventouse deliveries, I should know). But some of the women talking to camera also had some pretty serious medical problems besides - one, on examination, turned out to have both posterior and anterior prolapses, another stress incontinence and yet another a 'fallen' bladder. These are conditions that often require proper surgical intervention, not dodgy laser treatment at some hi-gloss clinic in La-La land. This 'serious' side of the programme i.e what chilbirth can do to women and how the effects often go un-talked about and untreated by the medical profession, was more or less completely negated by the focus on the 'designer labia' plastic surgerey which came as part of the surgical package at this clinic. This is obviously a much more attractive hook for a TV programme than the messy prolapses and incontinence which can be the real consequences of childbirth. Following the birth of my second child I had to have major abdominal surgery to correct a collapsed pelvic floor which had made me completely incontinent in terms of bladder control, and also to mend a severe vaginal prolapse. I'm sure this has made me hyper sensitive on this subject, but I really feel that linking surgical procedures to correct damage casued by childbirth with getting your flaps tarted up is not doing women any favours. There's already too little attention paid by the medical profession to how women's bodies are pulled around during childbirth, and what help they get to clear up the mess afterwards. Rant over.

I agree with Grizzler, it is one thing to want your body to work in the same way as it did before kids and another to chop off your labia to make them pretty.

I would imagine that the labia op could be done with a local anasthetic and would not be too dangerous (no more so than genital piercing anyway). If someone wants to do this for their own asthetic reasons I don't see the problem.

I found the justification that large lips chafe when doing exercize was quite hillarious.

One thing that surprized me was that only a certain shape of labia were shown in porn. Does anyone know of a man who is bothered what shape labia are? It is a good job women don't expect penis to all be the same shape!

Do most men even know what labia are?

I just remembered that I read in 'Wicked Whispers' in The Mirror a while ago, that apparently a blonde husky-voiced TV presenter had been neatened up 'downstairs' - not sure if they meant that she was husky-voiced before or after surgery though!

This wasn't as terrible as I'd expected. I can understand the effects of pregnancy argument but didn't really understand why anyone would want the genital mutilation. Still they wren't being pushed into it by their menfolk. If that's what make them happy and they've been warned about the risks its up to them. Told my husband he'd better not think I was going to do any of it though.

Let Me say it, please!

Adopt suitable nonchalant tone and say "isn't that an island in Greece?"!!!

Seriously, I watched an incredibly moving programme some years ago about a surgeon working in Africa for problems exactly like you've been describing after childbirth. Some of these women had walked for days and days to get to the clinic, otherwise they'd be social outcasts for the rest of their lives. Then, happily I saw a second prgramme which charted the start of a hospital (I think) which had been built with money from people who watched the first programme and wanted to help. I can't remember what it was called, but it was really uplifting and incredibly sad at the same time.

I agree with others that this programmed muddled two very different issues. How can you compare a woman who wants to be able to stand in a doorway naked without her labia hanging down with one who has severe prolapses (which were glossed over anyway)??

Kia - I think I saw that programme too. I know that I moan about the mess my nethers are in after having my brood, but these poor women were really suffering. Any tears or prolapses that they had suffered during childbirth (and indeed some of them had had labours which had gone on for days and days) had not been dealt with and had left them severely doubly incontinent, causing them to become social outcasts. It was heartbreaking and made you realise just how lucky we are to live in this country even with our dilapidated NHS.

The programme did gloss over the really important reasons for vaginal reconstruction, such as prolapse and incontinence, which is a shame as many women do suffer with these to varying extents following childbirth. I'm sure that the programme makers only focused on the cosmetic reasons to sensationalise an otherwise serious problem and appeal to the nosey side in all of us (myself included) in order to attract the biggest audience. Still, it definitely helped me to decide that I would never have it done for purely cosmetic reasons - far too painful.

Just to change the subject, the funniest thing I saw on TV last night was the wedding of Kyle and Chardonnay in 'Footballers wives'. I wonder how many takes it took them to film him dressed as a prince on a horse going to kiss her asleep dressed as Sleeping Beauty, without laughing!

Just back from a long lunch (ahhh, the joys of working in publishing), and interested to see the various responses. The problem that the African women referred to by Kia were experiencing is called a fistula - a hole which develops in the pipework between the vagina and the urethra - caused by being left in labour for days on end without medical help to get the baby out. So I guess we have something to thank the NHS for. (Although I can't help thinking that my own damage was either caused or exacerbated by reckless use of the ventouse). I didn't have a fistula - just complete wreckage of the pelvic floor - and at least I've been fixed up for the meantime and don't have to peruse the aisles of Boots for special offers on Tena Lady these days. I still believe, however, that the problems many women experience after childbirth, be it complete incontinence, stress incontinence, prolpases, loss of sex drive, whatever, aren't talked about openly enough (aren't we all meant to be too happy looking after our babies to worry about ourselves?) and there really should be more attention given to postnatal care.
Wendym - it was the linking of the very real medical complications of childbirth and the utter self indulgence of labial cosmetic repair that I objected to.
Husband insisted on checking out labia (can't remember what they look like myself) after watching programme and assured me that I have a very neat pair. So who needs a pelvic floor anyway?

A friend of mine has had a 'downstairs' op. done recently by a chap in Harley St that was recommended. I presume she was having pain as he said she had been stitched wrongly after her baby. He did the op. and she said how much better it was. R

P.S Have I missed the follow up programme about the young couple that adopted 3 brothers and sisters?

Oh and Dr Kypros is on tonight BBC1. R

Rhiannon, if you are talking about the BBC1 follow up 'love is not enough' I'm afraid you have missed it.

That other one you mention, Dr Kypros, Life before birth, is brilliant, very moving.