Two words for Boris Johnson

[KarlosKKrinkelbeim]

No, not the obvious ones.
Michael Heseltine.
Also succeeded in unseating his leader through spectacular disloyalty; found afterwards his colleagues would not hold their noses and vote for him, and failed in his ambition to become PM. Deservedly.
I have voted Tory at the last three elections. I will not do so again with that man in charge. Labour needs to get its shit together, chuck Corbyn out, get someone solid (Sadiq Khan?) and press for an immediate election. I think they'd find a lot of disgusted Tory Remainers moving in to their camp.

If everyone had voted for Miliband we wouldn't be in this mess.

People didn't vote for Miliband for very good reasons. He is not a stupid man, but a weak one, as his behaviour after losing the election demonstrated.
Labour has relied on the Miliband tendency for too long. the north London intelligenisia is not speaking to the core vote. Khan is your man, in my view. Yes there will be bigots who will not vote for him because he is muslim but I think not so many.

I think if Labour had voted the other Milliband in this might not have happened.

If Corbyn had been more vocal about Remain to start with that might have helped. I wonder if there are any stats on how it is thought people voted by political party.

Anyway here's hoping someone more moderate gets in as Tory leader. If most of the parliamentary MPs voted Remain then maybe they will vote for someone other than Boris.

yes, Corbyn should be put in the stocks for his failure to eve attempt to energise his core vote. He couldn't have made it clearer that he really didn't care. Contrast with Nicola Sturgeon who, little thought I like her, gave strong leadership and a clear message to her core voters.
Some very odd results from all this - I am thinking of voting Labour again and liking Nicola Sturgeon

Karlos I completely share your disgust for Boris Johnson, and not because he is a Tory, but - practically - how do you prevent his name going on the ballot? It's a two way race with the candidates decided by MPs, but the result depends on the Tory party grassroots membership - and they love Boris.

People didn't vote labour because they believed that labour were responsible for the global financial crisis, which they weren't. They navigated us through the crash very well and in a way which was approved by the then opposition.

They left office with a 96 billion pound debt , we now have a 1.5 trillion pound debt.

Back to the point though, people won't vote for Boris. I think he has lost the image of the friendly, bumbling, charming man.

Where the HELL is Osborne by the way, has anyone seen him at all?

Sadiq Khan wouldn't do the job. He'd be great though.

Weirdly, I've warmed to Boris ( die hard, lefty, remainer, Labour Party member). Has he fooled me?

I think Gideon is crying in a corner.

The whole web of lies about Labour causing a global economic recession made me very cross.

Some stats on the voting by party from Lord Ashworth

A majority of those who backed the Conservative in 2015 voted to leave the EU (58%), as did more than 19 out of 20 UKIP supporters. Nearly two thirds of Labour and SNP voters (63% and 64%), seven in ten Liberal Democrats and three quarters of Greens, voted to remain.

More stats on the website.

Lets face it, this a victory for Murdoch and the right wing press, we have got to challenge that. The tories are being investigated up and down the country for possible election fraud and it is hardly being reported.

the strength of the labout vote is accounted for by London. Londerners know what leaving will mean for their economy. What Corbyn failed to do was get his core vote out in the north, wales and the midlands. This is the problem the labour party have - it's become the party of the London middle classes and divorced from its other power bases (Scotland being the pre-eminent example).
Khan is your man. I'm going to keep saying this til it happens. I may email him. Feeling a bit bonkers today so why not. Sure I won't be the only one.

Hair brush... Oh, that's not the game?

Do you really think Boris would be an unpopular choice? I can't stand the man but he does seem popular. I find him sinister- his buffoon exterior hides an astute and manipulative politician. He has exploited the referendum to manoeuvre into power.

I've been really impressed by Khan, He'd get my vote. Would he take the poisoned choice of leadership when he has four more years in charge of London?

Oh god the thought of BoJo as PM really concerns me, not least his moral compass is all over the place. Sinister is right.
V disappointed in Labour. I do like Khan a lot and also Chuka Umanna, does anyone know whether Khan can take on leadership and be mayor of London?

I wouldn't trust Boris to steer us through the mess he's created. I suppose the best alternative candidate is likely to be Theresa May, not that I have any enthusiasm for her either.

Surely Sadiq Khan will be too busy being mayor of London to stand for Labour leadership? Corbyn did seem to be almost invisible throughout the referendum campaigning.

But as someone who voted remain, if Boris Johnson becomes leader of the conservatives, I'll be doing whatever tactical voting I think is most likely to get them out in the next elections.

whether Khan can take on leadership and be mayor of London?

Leader has to be an MP and Khan is no longer an MP.

He will get his chance one day but now is not the time.

I'm a lifelong Tory voter, I've always voted on political principles and I lean to the right so I have always voted Tory. I'm not sure I will next time. I didn't vote for an extreme right wing government and now I'm worried that is what we are going to get.

I would NEVER have contemplated voting labour before but Chuka Umunna was speaking on the TV yesterday and he was very impressive. He is the sort of person who could really capture the interest of professional people who would usually have voted Conservative.

I voted Labour at the last general election. I have never voted conservative (swung between labour/ lib dems) and I feel really weird in sort-of supporting David Cameron. I still don't like him or many of his policies, but I do think he is genuine and Zoe's what he does because he thinks it is in the best interests of the country.
Boris, however, I don't trust at all. I think the only interests he has are his own. I don't think he gives a fig about what happens to this country, as long as he has power.
I really hope this pushes us to an early general election, but there is no legal requirement to do so.

Isn't it strange how the referendum has turned politics upside down?

I've caught myself in the last few days thinking that I'd vote for tories like Ruth Davidson or Andrew Tyrie.

It's not just the professional people though, we need to understand why Labour are losing voters in Wales and the North, the traditional working class and we need someone who can inspire those people too. Don't think Chuka Umunna is that person.

Dunno. Corbyn could take credit for mobilising the youth vote - he was the one chosen for the under-35 TV debate after all. Plus, his reasonable and fairly non-committal stance on the EU could be a boost to LAbour in the next GE. He has told his MPs to prepare for an election after all so he may have had his eye on the main prize, rather than the referendum. As did Cameron, Johnson, Gove et al.

Corbyn understands that his traditional voters are upset by immigration because of its effect on low wages and also knows it's because of some directive (that either facilitates or stops what I'm saying - cba to google) that means employers can pay minimum wage in a migrant's own country rather than min wage here, meaning it's cheaper to bus over 100 fruit pickers from Poland than bring people from the nearest town. That needs to change by making migrants subject to the UK minimum wage laws. Exploitation is bad for them too and stops local people being employed. Nothing to do with British people not wanting to do certain jobs .

Perhaps coming out too strongly for Remain would genuinely have been political suicide for Labour. Many voters will remember the ambivalence and think favourably of it. I'm still horrified that we voted to leave though.

As for Khan as leader - are you serious? He's terrible! He may have been a better choice than Goldsmith but that's not saying much. Umunna had his chance and couldn't hack it then so I can't see him coping with the media scrutiny, negativity and prejudice that Corbyn gets daily.

AllthePrettySeahorses is a classic example of the small-minded tendency in Labour which places interests of party above interests of country and isn't smart enough to hide the fact.
Corbyn is a failure looked at from both angles, however. If Labour doesn't act it will lose the north, wales and midlands at the next election as well as Scotland. Ad the country needs strong leadership right now, and that will become clearer as the grim implications of brexit sink in. If labour acts decisively and makes a good choice, it could win next time - decisively.

Karlos - I promise you I am anything but small minded. But what I am is open minded enough to speculate on why Corbyn did what he did, whether I necessarily agree with it or not. The Tory party has also put its own interests above the country and I will speculate on that too. As a committed Remain voter, I damn well understand the implications but I think that it is important to debate what the leaders' motivations were and the likelihood of their success.

Don't you dare refer to me in the phrase 'isn't smart enough.'