Is a masters really becoming the norm?

[Terracotta57]

DC who is at Oxbridge, and about to go into final year, feels that many are planning to do masters (and this is in humanities / social science fields not stem, so not funded). I know that the job market may be pushing many to do masters (and of course many others will choose to purely from love of their subject), but I'm also surprised it seems so common given the increasing weight of student loans and exorbitant cost (especially at the top unis where fees alone can be over £20k). Is it really becoming the new norm and does that mean that even an oxbridge degree isn't able to compete if there isn't a masters attached to it?

There are too many graduates chasing the few formal internships being offered by large companies so they are fiercely competitive.

A large company I'm aware of closed applications for a STEM internship after ONE day because they had received 1000 applications for 20 roles. However there are less competitive opportunities in smaller companies. This is where Uni career teams need to be earning their money and making sure they build an employer network.

I'm not sure what students experience is of Uni career support? It's an extremely tough market but not impossible. I would encourage a year studying a language or travel rather than a panic Masters.

Yes, has been for a while. I don't count as a graduate in my country because I don't have a masters (they equate a bachelor's degree with their equivalent of a HND0).

"I would encourage a year studying a language or travel"

Why do you think learning a language is useful for a generation who will have AI from when they start working?

Radical idea...perhaps to talk to people within your organisation from various countries who might not have English as a first language. Many companies have international teams and and an additional language is a very useful or essential skill for some global industries.

I work in an international environment. We can use AI for communication and it's getting better every day.

My DS has just completed a masters in August and, for which I am so happy and relieved, has just started a job. For which the masters was not a stated requirement in the job description but DS said the hiring manager has told him that he filtered candidates for the job by looking to see if they had a masters qualification / were working towards one. DS is a journalist and it was a MA in journalism. The job market is awful, many of my DS’s friends are getting post grad qualifications to try to help them into a career. But it’s just all so expensive and time consuming for everyone. They are mostly getting into very high levels of personal debt to fund this, it’s not a good way to start in life.

It's not necessarily useful to have any old MA but an MA from a top programme with good links to employers in that field can absolutely make a huge difference. I teach MA students, they keep me posted on what they get up to after, and most of them eventually get really good jobs.

The job market for graduates is so bad right now. As long as you're being strategic about it, an MA can be worth it.

1. Between 77% - 80% of grads from UK unis are now getting a 1st or a 2:1, so how do you set yourself apart, as a candidate? You do a masters that is job specific, so e.g. you do your degree in Economics and then you do your masters in business finance and you write your dissertation on the exact area of business in which you want to work. Boom! You're already streets ahead of your fellow grads with just a (very general) Economics degree.

2. The job market is INCREDIBLY TOUGH right now, even for young people with great degrees from great unis. Doing a masters gives you another year of doing something constructive that will hopefully give you that edge when it comes to the employment market, and you have another year to hope and pray that the job market improves. And hell, most people have a shit load of debt when they start work anyway, so one more year doesn't make a huge difference.

It is already getting an overhaul ... https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/lifelong-learning-entitlement-lle-overview/lifelong-learning-entitlement-overview

a gap year after undergrad is needed with internships and some travelling/ life experience.

Travelling isn't seen as anything particularly great any more unless you're doing some job-specific work while doing it. That's partly because it's not an option for many lower income students, so travelling is a MC luxury and seen as such (quite fairly).

Internships are great, if she can get one, but they are very hard to get and many are ring-fenced for disadvantaged or minority groups. If she's white British, good luck, unless she can tick any of the diversity boxes. Work experience is the best thing to have and anything is better than nothing as it shows work ethic.

Yes @cheezncrackersunless people have a young new grad or are involved in grad recruitment I don’t think they realise just how bad the job market is for new grads with no experience right now.
A friend of mine has kids in their late 20s who took a few months - a year to get into grad roles so she thought that was still the norm.
This year she was involved with recruiting to her company’s grad scheme and was shocked to discover they had 4000 well qualified people apply for 12 posts! Many of them had masters degrees even although that wasn’t required. And most of them had graduated over last year or 2 so had presumably been job hunting all that time!

100% this.

DS has just started his 3rd year, after failing to get a placement - he was openly told by 2 separate companies there was no point in going any further with his application because he was 'too white and male'.

Thankfully he has a very lovely uncle who has offered to pay for his masters, so he'll do that next year in the hope it gives him a sporting chance of getting a job after uni.

Just curious - who funds them?

Yes I recruit young graduates into entry level role and see hundreds of CVs. People who wouldn’t have entertained us a few years ago. I see some that have a degree and masters and not a jot of paid work. It doesn’t add anything to application and in a lot of cases I suspect it was a panic masters.

Research councils, charities, companies, universities.

It's not getting better at building real relationships.
If having human-human skills becomes rarer, they'll become more valuable. AI can translate on paper, but not communicate in personal or sensitive settings.

"AI can translate on paper, but not communicate in personal or sensitive settings."

For the moment.

People are not going to stop wanting people.

Snap!

Mine is funded by my university. There are others funded by UKRI bodies. I don't understand it all tbh, I'm just glad I'm funded.

I’ve got one in the arts. I didn’t find it helped me that much. I am now doing a BSc. Although I had a good career in journalism - to the above poster talking about journalism you don’t need a degree in journalism you need a foot in the industry. Also it’s an industry in enormous decline with no money and shit wages.

DS2 is in the final year of his MChem from a good Uni and currently on a year in industry. He’s also on for a first and has over four years of paid part time work in addition behind him. I’m still very nervous for his prospects next year.

Notwithstanding , we have two offspring on this thread who have just got journalism jobs after a lot of hard graft, so let's not piss on their chips, eh?

Most band 5 roles expect a degree. It's also virtually impossible to get a band 2 job without significantly higher qualifications than listed in the "essential criteria".

I suppose. It’s good they’ve achieved what they set out to. I hope they make better money than I did. Perhaps they are more talented than I was and will avoid the downsides.