Neurodiversity at Oxbridge

[Cheesesamosa]

DC who has adhd starts at Cambridge in October. I’ve read many times on here that neurodiversity is relatively common at Oxbridge and they are very used to dealing with / supporting it. However I’ve just come across the admission report for last year and it’s actually really low in terms of declared disability. 1.4% with ASD and 2.3% with adhd, dyslexia, dyspraxia etc.

These figures come as a surprise though, so far, disability services seem proactive. Interested to hear experiences and advice from those with neurodiverse DC currently attending?

DD just finished Y1 at Cambridge confirms that most she meets are clearly ND, it is almost unusual not to be. I wonder if perhaps it is just an inherent part of who they are and so it isn’t declared as such. I know some ND YP who have differing opinions as to whether neurodiversity is a disability and some say yes, many say no, some see it as their superpower. The section on the Cambridge statistics puts ADHD into a category of disability so they are not collecting data on those who do not see it as such but are ND.

@PettsWoodParadise fair point and totally agree about the disability label. For my DC it certainly provides benefits alongside difficulties. We declared it because they need extra time in exams and other access arrangements, so we have to work with the label, whether we agree with it or not. Hence why I suppose I am still a bit surprised by the low %.

I would say that 100% of the students I was at Oxford with 25 years ago were ND. I called the police on a boy who was having an autistic meltdown/burnout because I thought he needed sectioning. My best friend suffered burnout and is still experiencing the effects a quarter of a century later.

However, if your DD is managing her ADHD well and has reasonable accommodations in place, she should do really well.

Dh did some work assisting people with accommodations for exams while he was at Cambridge.

He gave it up after realising he was actually more disabled than the people he was helping, just he didn't have a diagnosis.

Not sure if everyone there is ND but it is very very common - we go to a lot of university events, as a ND couple it's a very happy environment for us.

my DH went to Oxford and every single college friend of his is ND, though not necessarily all of them have formal diagnoses.

I didn't declare my ND, but I received the supported I needed when I sought it out. They were very understanding and supportive, both my department and college. It's just pushing past the reluctance and thinking I can cope to seeking help.

As mentioned, being ND isn’t disabling for many people and if the student isn’t disabled by their differences they won’t declare they are disabled when there not.

At 1.4% the number of students declaring they’re autistic is significantly higher than the national average. I work in the sector and it usually 0.25%. Most autistic students do not have any support needs.For example, an autistic senior manager studying for an MBA is unlikely to engage with DSA funded autism mentoring as they already have high level people skills.

What an interesting thread. I have two close relatives who went to Oxford and I wouldn’t think either are ND. On the other hand I have two close friends who went to Cambridge who I’d describe as definitely ND! I can imagine as PP have said that not all ND students require extra support therefore it’s not declared. My DC with ADHD (just finished year 4 so obviously very different!) has had no support, not medicated, and has scored exceptionally well in all assessments despite no extra time etc. My close friends who went to Cambridge and are certainly ASD wouldn’t have needed support at an educational level.

DS is studying a STEM subject at Cambridge and says almost everyone he comes across on his course is ND.

He doesn't have a formal diagnosis but my mother is a SALT and has always been sure that DS is on the ASD spectrum. We never sought anything formal because he's never really needed any academic support, more social situational support.

There was a study by academics at Cambridge where they sampled the student body there in heavily mathematical degree courses and found that the percentage with an ASD diagnosis was around 7%, which is several time higher than the general population. There would also be many more without a diagnosis.
The situation with ADHD is different - it's more common in the general population than ASD but my impression is that the rate of incidence at top unis is not enhanced - unmedicated ADHD has a negative effect on academic outcomes due to its impact on time management, organisation. Very bright students with ADHD still make it to top unis but I have not seen any evidence that they do so in percentages enhanced above the general population; the negative effect of ADHD on school performance suggests that the opposite should be so.
Those with high functioning ASD and associated "special interests", i.e. spending a lot of time hyperfocused on one or few areas tend to end up with the kind of supercurricular profile that oxbridge and other top unis select on.
The degree and type of neurodiversity is also likely to depend on course/department. Incidence of ASD is probably particularly high in maths and CS but less so in natural sciences or humanities.

I was there 30 odd years ago. With hindsight there were an awful lot of ND men- DH didn’t stand out at all, but he really has ever since.

It can be tricky persuading a school to look at a diagnosis for a child who is doing well academically, and also parents will be less inclined to push for it if they're doing well.
That will effect numbers of people who are actually diagnosed.

Everyone at Oxbridge is Neurodiverse compared to the rest of the population; high IQ is a neurodiversity just as much as learning disability is.

I agree, we may all be ND in my family but only DD is diagnosed; she hasn't needed to disclose this to her (non-oxbridge) uni. I suspect ADHD in myself; I did academically extremely well but then zig-zagged when I got to uni, sometimes excellent sometimes just well enough. DS (oxbridge maths) I suspect may be similar, was fortunate to be in school environments that played to his strengths so we've not pursued diagnostic discussions. He's more sociable than others doing maths ...

Thanks all, really interesting. @piisnot3 i take your point re the academic suppprt needs of those with ASD vs ADHD, and also that many with ADHD who are managing to still perform well enough at school to apply won’t have been diagnosed.

DH went to Cambridge, I would say most of his entire friendship group from that time are undiagnosed ND as is he. I have some training as was responsible for students with disabilities. I can’t officially diagnose but the University sent myself and others on an in depth course. Which was when I realised I ticked many boxes myself I taught myself to read before I went to school as an example. I’m one of six children and was always ‘very different’ to the others. @KeirSpoutsTwaddle my DH remained in academia which was for the best as most definitely his tribe.

We had always known that my son was "quirky" but he only got his ADHD diagnosis once he got to Cambridge. He describes his entire friendship group as neurospicy.

ADHD meds ("study crack") and SSRIs circulate freely. I doubt whether most of the students bother registering their ND.

I'd never recommend oxbridge to someone with autism - other universities with great courses and much better support

The interview process has even traditionally been advertised as "not looking for what you know - that can be taught - but the way you think".

Which would you consider the best in terms of support, midgetastic? My DS is applying to Oxbridge but I worry greatly about how he will cope with university generally (ASD, possibly some ADD traits)?

Depends on the course
I'd suggest Maths at Warwick rather than Oxford for example

I was at Cambridge, and agree, with hindsight there was a massive amount of ND there, and on arts degrees as well as maths and NatScis. But no one had a diagnosis back then.

@midgetastic What makes you say that? I've always seen the entire college set up as a way of supporting ND people - particularly staff - to follow their special interests. Also, friend's daughter with ADHD/ASD but fantastically able completely could not cope with a degree at another uni, because the living arrangements were just too communal and difficult. I think it very much depends on the person, and also the size of the college (I think being ND at Trinity for example would be very hard work).

@Cheesesamosa Make sure he also gets the support allowance - DD's school (she's ADHD) have already highlighted this to her and she can use it to get a new laptop for example.

Thinking more , I think it's where you have a combination of background ( not upper middle class) with autism that I have seen failure by oxbridge - the bullying of such students ignored , and ND childen who don't have the default background sometimes can't cope very well with the changed social expectations

I have met professors who seem proud of the fact that they let the students sink or swim and see it as toughening them up for the outside world , whereas sone of the other universities I have worked with put a lot of effort into working out how best to support specific students , gradually helping them build those skills

Both my DCs went to Cambridge and neither of them, not any of their friends, are ND. They were just normal kids who were clever but also socialised and played sport. I'm just adding this to balance the above comments which seem to imply all Oxbridge students are ND.

I agree about the social background. I went to Cambridge from a northern comp and even though I was middle class for there, everyone else was so much posher and so I found the whole social side of it bewildering and pointless and very nearly left at the end of the first year. But more furious than bullied.