A levels for a biology degree

[Desert76]

DD is in year 11, so just starting to think about applying for 6th form and A levels.

At the moment, she thinks she wants to do a biology degree.

She’s thinking of A levels in Biology, maths and English language, all of which she enjoys and is predicted good grades in.

We’ve looked at entry requirements at a few universities - most want two sciences, including biology or chemistry, so maths would count as the second science.

Some say they want biology AND chemistry, or that chemistry is highly recommended, or have a lower offer if you have chemistry.

The thing is, DD doesn’t really like chemistry. She’s predicted a 6 for GCSE when all her other predictions are 7 and 8s.

So the questions are:
Should she do A level chemistry? (I strongly feel she shouldn’t, best to do what you enjoy)

Given she doesn’t really like chemistry, should she actually rethink the biology degree, even if the entry requirements would allow her in? - is it going to be lots of chemistry? Or can she maybe avoid it with judicious choice of optional modules?

She prefers human biology to plants at the moment.

Sorry but Chemistry is really helpful for a biology degree.

In my day the standard was Biology, Chemistry and Maths.

It’s not a deal breaker. She’ll get offers and should be able to manage, though she may have to brush up on one or two aspects of chemistry when she’s there.

My dd did a Biology degree, Masters and PhD (all RG institutions) without either Maths or Chemistry A level. The Maths was the one she slightly regretted not doing.

Yeah I reckon you need Chemistry for a competitive Biology degree. In my day it was Bio Chem Maths or BIo Chem Physics, which is what I did, even though I hated Physics. I got A stars in Bio and Chem and B in Physics. Long time ago so probably little relevance now but was fine with this for Molecular Biology degree at uni.

I think there is a lot of chemistry still in a Biology degree. Id look at tge uni requirements in details on UCAS if you haven't already, maybe there are some Biology degrees where it is not preferred. You can find the stats for what most kids on the course had somehwere too.

Most don’t ask for Chemistry. OP has already said she has checked.

Chemistry is crucial IMO for a biology degree at an excellent uni.

Make sure she knows what English language actually is. It’s fabulous but linguistics, not anything remotely like the GCSE

Have a look at uni syllabi; back in the day, it was a year of chem in first year (unless it was a university offering exemption based on A level results). Just so she knows what she’s heading into

She didn't say that. She said she has seen some that dont. The question she needs to ask is if that is a few or many. If its only a few that dont want Chenistry, or dont state that they 'prefer' Chemistry, then her daughter would have to accept that she is limiting her pool of choices and chance of offers. Equally, if they dont require it but 75% of current students on the course have it.

I personaly think my ability to understand university level biology modules - molecular biology, genetics, immunology, biochemistry etc would have been hampered by not having done A level chemistry (which is quite different from GCSE as you get the 'real' explanations, not simplified, which some find easier to 'get') and I would imagine there is a chemistry component/modules in first year. But maybe there are some degrees without those type of modules?

There is a fair bit of chemistry in a level bio, if she doesn't like chem, then she might not like bio

I'd be wary of taking Chemistry A level from a 6 at GCSE. It's a hard A level. Maybe ask the school what grades A level students achieve from various GCSE grades in their experience.

There's some info here about what grades students get with various GCSE grades.

https://api.repository.cam.ac.uk/server/api/core/bitstreams/83e815f2-b2e0-47bc-a308-25d28dc28e44/content

Here's a screenshot, at GCSE 6, more than 50% are getting a D or below.

My dd is like yours and enjoyed Bio but not a fan of chemistry and took A-level biology. There’s quite a lot of chemistry in the syllabus including a Biochemistry module iirc. Chemistry and biology are a popular combination to take.

Dont do A level Chemistry without a love for it. Its a brutal A level if you aren't keen.

Therefore, id filter the biology degrees by who has no interest in Chemistry A level. Those will likely be the ones where biochemistry isn't a major component.
Uni's insisting in Chemistry will have a biology degree with a chemistry bias - and im guessing thats not what she will want.

Also, look at biology adjacent degrees - examples human biology, environmental biology, microbiology etc etc etc

Interesting that some unis want chemistry or offer lower with it and that so many PPs say it’s essential. My ds took bio, maths and PE and had offers from 4x RG unis plus Lboro for biological sciences or biology. So there was no issue with not taking chem. Not sure if things have changed as he started uni in 2021?

He did a masters btw and found maths A level helpful.

Which unis ask for chem? If her PG is lower I wouldn’t do it, esp if she is not keen.

Best to check specific degree courses at unis she might be interested in. Many biology degrees did specifically require chemistry when my DC applied, but that was several years ago. New unis may be less demanding than trad unis. Also check the actual content/options for the degrees as some at least will have modules that are not chem heavy.

I have a degree in human biology and studies biology, chemistry and maths at A level

I found chemistry a level brutal but not because it was hard we just had a terrible teacher. He was an old school chemist, not an actual teacher.
I dropped it after a year and took environmental science.

I found maths too difficult as I'd not been able to do the higher paper for GCSE. Only the top 30 were allowed and I was 31st. I dropped down to an AS level in statistics which was helpful for the degree.

I ask her if she just 'doesn't enjoy it's or actually finds the content too difficult. If it's the latter she may struggle.

Just for interest, I checked biology at Leeds (one of DS’s choices and surely an excellent uni) and it just asks for another science or science-related, inc maths and lots of others.

I agree tho it’s worth looking at modules as well to see how much chem there is. I am sure chem A level is helpful but if you won’t do well at it it’s probably not the best idea.

Warwick and Imperial say the same as Leeds. Oxford is also happy with maths or physics as well as chem as a second science. So which unis do demand chem?

I did a biology degree. All biology students had to study chemistry as one of their first year subjects irrespective of which specific biology honours degree we wanted to ultimately take (this was in Scotland, so a four year degree). We also all studied the same biology modules in first year (including human and plant biology), then began specialising in second year.

Chemistry is fundamental to understanding biology. I personally didn't really enjoy it and viewed it as a means to an end. Many others felt the same as me (of course some others loved chemistry and went on to do biochemistry related degrees).

I'd highly recommend your daughter looks very carefully at the entrance requirements for various universities for any courses she is interested in before selecting her A level subjects. And also looks at the course structures to see what are mandatory and elective subjects within the degree.

I think it was Kings college London and Edinburgh that wanted both bio and chemistry , and Queens Belfast that strongly preferred both. I think there was another but I can’t remember now. They were more human bio - I think the KCL one also included anatomy.

Maybe we just happened to look at the wrong ones in our initial scope.

Good call to look at the actual modules in more detail.

But it’s not true now.
The universities that want more than one science typically want high A level grades. If math is stronger than chem, she should go for math.

Actually not always true. DD's doing a biomedical degree, she had several offers including 2 RG universities who were happy to take her without Chemistry. The grade offers where slightly higher but that is normal with RG universities.

She didn't have a problem during her first year and actually did quite well in her Chemistry module. Even though she's still not keen on the subject.

I would say do the A-levels she good at as she's likely to get higher grades. As long as she does at lest 2 science subjects.

Whether it is true or not that universities still require/like Chemistry A level, it will alwasy be the case that you need a solid post GCSE level understanding of organic chemistry at least to fully understand molecular biology, biochemisty, cell biology, genetics and immunology imo. If someone wanted to focus on microbiology, botany, zoology, biomechanics etc then I guess it would be less important. I am sure they will enforce catch up chemistry modules in first year if necessary.

Contrary to popular opinion, A-level chemistry is not generally required for a degree in biological sciences, though many require a "second science or maths" (even then, sometimes psychology or geography count as a "second science"). If she is interested in a broader natural sciences degree, biochemistry, pharmacy or medicine, then she should definitely take chemistry. If not (and doesn't sound like she is), then biology + maths is fine.

A-level biology on its own is also fine for almost all allied health professions (not sure about radiography, haven't checked). I just mention this because people often say "A-level biology on its own is no use, DC should drop it" when a young person has chosen biology without maths or another science to go with it. Biology keeps a lot of doors open, even on its own.

In your daughter's case I would go for a biology degree with a quantitative element (e.g. Biological Sciences at UCL) so that she can flesh out her CV in that direction should she not want to stay in biology.

@Desert76 Do you remember which KCL degree you looked at? I was just on their website out of curiosity and they don't seem to offer a straight biology degree, only natural sciences. (Can this be true?)

Chemistry is certainly useful for a biology degree, but depending what field she wants to go in to not essential.
I did biochemistry/cell biology where chemistry was pretty essential.
However a broad Biology degree (check before applying for compulsory modules such as biochemistry) or plant biology, human biology, zoology, environmental biology is definitely possible without taking chemistry.
She should have a look at degree courses and universities and check their entry requirements to make sure she’s not ruling anything out by taking maths instead of chemistry.

There is biochemistry content in biology A level too, just to be aware. On the plus side it would be enough to give background for first year degree level biochemistry modules.

Chemistry A level is difficult and would be a hard slog if you’re not that interested in it.