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Feminism: chat

Feminism: sex and gender

Original poster

Diversity Trust

72 replies

wincarwoo · 17/04/2023 13:25

Hi, so my workplace is organising training delivered by the Diversity Trust who I can see are very much TWAW. Title of the course is speak up and speak out - ironically!
What should I do? Go on the course and challenge whilst I'm there? Or I'd quite like to have a word with HR about how I object to the Diversity Trust's stance (which I presume will be hypocritical). Any suggestions welcome

OP posts:
Original poster
wincarwoo · 24/04/2023 07:24

Titerama · 24/04/2023 07:15

So here’s where we’re at then

OP wants to go to HR before the training to calmly object to the unknown content.

Calm objections to include

  • I won’t be silenced because that’s how wars start
  • if you are inclusive of trans women in feminism you are brainwashed

Cool - bound to succeed.

No worries tiitrrama. I think I can manage myself thanks.

OP posts:
tourdefrance · 26/04/2023 18:24

I heard we were ditching Stonewall because they are ‘problematic’ so wonder if we will end up with these people.

BiggerBoat1 · 26/04/2023 18:27

Titerama · 18/04/2023 01:24

Or you could maybe go to the diversity training and listen with an open mind, instead of presuming and going in to challenge with HR with this presumptions.

This!

Original poster
wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 06:41

@BiggerBoat1 I don't have to support an organisation whose values I fundamentally disagree with. I'm sure someone clever can come up with an analogy about it.

If they believe e twaw then they won't be suooorting allyship with women the twos are not mutually compatible.

OP posts:
Original poster
wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 06:42

tourdefrance · 26/04/2023 18:24

I heard we were ditching Stonewall because they are ‘problematic’ so wonder if we will end up with these people.

I'll feed back. There will be scenarios so I'll be interested to see who these focus on.

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BiggerBoat1 · 27/04/2023 07:17

@wincarwoo I didn’t say you had to support them. I agreed with the person who said to go along with an open mind. You don’t have to agree with someone to allow yourself to listen to what they say.
I fundamentally disagree with your stance on this issue, but I’d still afford you the courtesy of listening to what you have to say.

Original poster
wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 09:56

BiggerBoat1 · 27/04/2023 07:17

@wincarwoo I didn’t say you had to support them. I agreed with the person who said to go along with an open mind. You don’t have to agree with someone to allow yourself to listen to what they say.
I fundamentally disagree with your stance on this issue, but I’d still afford you the courtesy of listening to what you have to say.

If you fundamentally believe that men can be women then I don't have to listen to what you have to say.
By the stance of the organisation I suspect they are biased against the needs of women in favour of the wants of men. That is not something I will support openly or tacitly.

OP posts:
Titerama · 27/04/2023 11:16

You suspect and assume, and are choosing not to even listen. And your justification is that they are biased 🙄

Your employer requires you to listen whether you like it or not. And you’re doing a great job of showing why this sort of speak up and speak out training is so needed in the workplace.

Original poster
wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 12:09

Titerama · 27/04/2023 11:16

You suspect and assume, and are choosing not to even listen. And your justification is that they are biased 🙄

Your employer requires you to listen whether you like it or not. And you’re doing a great job of showing why this sort of speak up and speak out training is so needed in the workplace.

Yes if they believe TWAW then that indicates bias.
My organisation does not require me to attend. That is my own decision.

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Original poster
wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 12:18

@Titerama I'll be going to see if only some views will be seen as acceptable and whether they assume that everyone else buys into the madness.

OP posts:
NewNameNigel · 27/04/2023 21:19

Yes if they believe TWAW then that indicates bias

Being GC also indicates bias. Everyone is biased.

NewNameNigel · 27/04/2023 21:20

wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 12:18

@Titerama I'll be going to see if only some views will be seen as acceptable and whether they assume that everyone else buys into the madness.

Using the word madness here in this context seems pretty biased to me.

Original poster
wincarwoo · 27/04/2023 21:53

NewNameNigel · 27/04/2023 21:19

Yes if they believe TWAW then that indicates bias

Being GC also indicates bias. Everyone is biased.

I don't think you understand bias. It's not about agreeing that something that is false is true.

OP posts:
NewNameNigel · 28/04/2023 08:15

I do understand bias. One way it manifests is seeing your own view as the ultimate truth.

I think people on both sides of the debate believe they see the truth and the other side is stupid/bigoted and therefore not worth even listening to. It's why the issue is so polarised.

Original poster
wincarwoo · 28/04/2023 09:07

NewNameNigel · 28/04/2023 08:15

I do understand bias. One way it manifests is seeing your own view as the ultimate truth.

I think people on both sides of the debate believe they see the truth and the other side is stupid/bigoted and therefore not worth even listening to. It's why the issue is so polarised.

Men can't be women. It's not really controversial. Only in the narcissistic western world where a tiny minority are trying to gaslight the majority.

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NewNameNigel · 28/04/2023 09:14

I don't think men can literally be women either but that doesn't mean that people who believe ve that don't have bias. Everyone has bias. Especially those who believe themselves to be the ones who can see the objective truth.

Original poster
wincarwoo · 28/04/2023 09:22

NewNameNigel · 28/04/2023 09:14

I don't think men can literally be women either but that doesn't mean that people who believe ve that don't have bias. Everyone has bias. Especially those who believe themselves to be the ones who can see the objective truth.

My original point is about an organisation delivering diversity training who are biased due to their views.

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Original poster
wincarwoo · 24/05/2023 10:28

In the training now and there is a slide with TERF on it. TERF isn't explained. So they are assuming that people understand these terms. And the irony that it's being used without acknowledging it as a slur.

OP posts:
ToBeOrNotToBee · 24/05/2023 10:37

wincarwoo · 24/05/2023 10:28

In the training now and there is a slide with TERF on it. TERF isn't explained. So they are assuming that people understand these terms. And the irony that it's being used without acknowledging it as a slur.

Ask them.
"Whats a terf?"

Original poster
wincarwoo · 24/05/2023 10:41

I have. I got some waffle about genetic women wanting access to genetic women's spaces and how it's very controversial

Then we got the figures on increases in trans hate crime

OP posts:
ToBeOrNotToBee · 24/05/2023 10:45

wincarwoo · 24/05/2023 10:41

I have. I got some waffle about genetic women wanting access to genetic women's spaces and how it's very controversial

Then we got the figures on increases in trans hate crime

So they agree transwomen aren't women 😉

Original poster
wincarwoo · 24/05/2023 10:46

@ToBeOrNotToBee haha yes.

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