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Original poster

Pushy, hot-house - WHY??

48 replies

Creole · 12/01/2006 13:14

What is it with us parents?

Why are we so judgemental of other people?s parenting? It seems us parents are the greatest critique of parenting.

What?s wrong with wanting the best for your child?

Why the label "pushy" or "hot housing", if a parent is trying their utmost to give their child a decent education, or fighting for their educational right.

I so wished my own parents took as much interest as some of you on here, who just want the very best for your kids.

I really don?t understand it!

OP posts:
Original poster
Creole · 12/01/2006 13:18

Forgot to add that this puzzles me as someone who was educated in an african country, where education is so valued with very limited resources. Yet you have people who are making the good use of the good resources here but being labelled.

OP posts:
Original poster
Creole · 12/01/2006 13:51

I guess people don't talk about this??

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Piffle · 12/01/2006 13:52

Creole I just know exactly what you mean

snailspace · 12/01/2006 14:44

Message withdrawn

Pruni · 12/01/2006 14:47

Message withdrawn

Piffle · 12/01/2006 14:51

And always the hardest to try and justify that your child has latent ability sadly...

crunchie · 12/01/2006 14:58

I know exactly what you mean Creole, there was a recent thread about a clever child you had missed out on additional help, and the parent was being told off for wanting to get the additional support. It was the CHILD that had dreams of Oxbridge, not the mum. I thought it was such a shame tbh.

Original poster
Creole · 12/01/2006 15:58

Yes crunchie, that was the post that made me start this one!

And I agree with the person who said hothousing is quite rare - I cetainly have not met one.

I'm beginning to believe the jealousy argument though.

It's really strange, if you take an interest in your child's education your are pushy, if you don't you are a bad mother.

OP posts:
Original poster
Creole · 12/01/2006 16:03

But Pruni, how would you know if the child is not being allowed to be a child? No one lives with an alleged "pushed" child to know exactly what the life of that child is really like.

However, I have seen those american shows on child beauty pagents and thats a different argument.

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Meanoldmummy · 12/01/2006 17:00

I have an exceptionally bright 3 year old, I haven't pushed him and wouldn't - I am very proud of his abilities - there, I said it! but even more proud of his lovely natural innocent personality, his cheek, his charm, his kindness to his baby brother, and all the things that can't be quantified but are more precious than gold. I find it's other people who can't see past his intellect, not me - both he and I have been treated badly or scornfully because people assume that I am a pushy mum and he is a show-off. He's a lovely little person with a real zest for life - but all too often the moment he opens his mouth and speaks people start glaring and muttering. It's bound to have a dampening effect on him eventually - I think it's meant to. It makes me very sad.

foxinsocks · 12/01/2006 17:10

It is also very British (I'm afraid to say). I was schooled in 2 different countries (England was one of them) and over here, being intelligent and doing well was never really the done thing but abroad, I was positively praised and encouraged. In fact, I often think that had I not had the experience I had abroad, I would have turned out a completely different character.

It's the 'love the underdog', 'it's OK to do well but there must be something going on with high achievers' mentality that seems to exist in some quarters over here.

Sherbert37 · 12/01/2006 17:26

We always make more fuss of school reports of kindness to other children etc rather than true academic prowess, as this is important.

Pruni · 12/01/2006 17:31

Message withdrawn

flashingnose · 12/01/2006 17:45

I'm very good at Trivial Pursuit and quizzes but have been known to pretend I don't know the answer so I don't get sneered at .

People just think you're being a smart-arse - knowledge is not valued in this country. But if you're David Beckham...

Original poster
Creole · 12/01/2006 17:52

But kids that go to Oxbridge at 12, is that the doing of a pushy parent or the desire of the child? Because there are some very exceptionally able kids who decide for themselves without the input of their parents - I think there are loads out there.

I think this all boils down to that old debate about nature/nurture of intelligience.

OP posts:
hana · 12/01/2006 18:43

how awful that you have to pretend that you don't know the answers in TP
nothing wrong with being smart or knowing things

snailspace · 12/01/2006 19:36

Message withdrawn

Meanoldmummy · 12/01/2006 19:39

I remember deliberately making spelling mistakes in writing notes to classmates (messing about writing notes in class! - I also remember disagreeing about something trivial with a girl I was quite good friends with, and not dumbing down my note.... and being called a "snotty know-it-all smart-ass egghead bitch"...childish but I was very hurt. I dread watching my son go through this. I used to have a real problem with being tongue-tied and stammering because I was terrified of being teased for using "big words" and trying to be clever...the trouble was that the big words were the ones that occurred to me first and I had to try and think of less ostentatious ones. I became very paranoid and had big problems making friends. Bright children have a very raw deal in our schools and society at large - they are either teased and scorned, ostracised, or simply used as teaching aids. And I remember being bored to tears a lot of the time because it wasn't considered appropriate to give me anything different to do.

Blandmum · 12/01/2006 19:47

I was at Oxford at the same time as RL. She not on;y got the best first in her year, she also got almost twice as many marks as the person who came second.....and he also got a congratulatory First. At the same time she did a degree in physics at Oxford Brookes.....and got a firt in that as well.

With the best will in the world her father could not have 'hot housed' her into this. That said, he was banned from attending common room meetings with her,. they had to pass a motion banning all parents from JCR meetings, as he kept attending and taking part.

getbakainyourjimjams · 12/01/2006 19:57

Doesn't she say her father hot housed her now- I'm sure she does. She has an elder half sister who he tried to do the same with, but the mother stopped him- read an interesting article with the sister years ago. RL is happy being a mother somewhere now (Israel I think- I think she has an academic post, but not high profile) (and her father was a nutter- I had a nose at the JCR minutes- he was banned from the college library as well incidentally)

snailspace · 12/01/2006 20:18

Message withdrawn

Meanoldmummy · 12/01/2006 20:21

I was at Oxford with another underage student, a boy of about 14...can't recall his name now. But he didn't appear to me to be hot-housed. He wasn't even particularly bookish - in fact several of the local pubs had a photo of him in the bar cautioning staff not to serve him alcohol - it seems he tried his luck every so often! He was just very very gifted. I think people don't like to accept that there are children who simply have a natural advantage - they find it more comfortable to believe that there must be "hot-housing", which they can regard as a form of foul play which devalues the resultant achievement. Perhaps it's because we intrinsically think it's immoral for anyone to attain anything too easily.. a sort of "something for nothing" complex. Puritanical and weird!

getbakainyourjimjams · 12/01/2006 20:23

The interveiw with her sister suggested that it was all from the father though- he spent her infancy teaching her maths (in quite ingenious ways it has to be said- using stairs and movement etc- I'm sure a lot could be learned from his methods and applied to teenagers). Wish I had the article- it was interesting.

edam · 12/01/2006 20:30

Ruth Lawrence's father was definitely weird. I'm sure she is naturally gifted, but he started hot-housing her from the moment she was born. Remember an interview with him when he explained the techniques he used. Would never allow her mother to use babytalk, for example. When still a tiny baby he would say 'your mother will make you comfortable and dry now' when she needed her nappy changed.

The thing is, she's continued being academically successful in adult life, so presumably she would have been gifted even without all his heavy intervention - and would probably have ended up with same academic results, just a few years later.

There is an anti-intellectual tendency in this country. Partly class-based. But some parents do hot-house, forcing their children into multiple activities the children don't necessarily choose and not allowing them any time to relax or play on their own terms. That's very sad.

Blandmum · 12/01/2006 20:31

While he did push her, I don't think you can just train someone to be that good at maths. You can either do it, or not, to a degree.

While he could have pushed her to A level, I can't see that you could accellerate that much at such a younge age, unless there was a lot of basic ability.