Mother sectioned

[JulesIM]

I’m a heartbroken daughter, please help

My frail 84 year old mother with advanced dementia was in our opinion illegally sectioned from a care home this week. We are currently engaging with healthcare barristers on this. She wasn’t given family representation, consultation was not given with her gp or her social worker or her carer of four years.

Does anyone else have a loved one who has been sectioned from a care home, simply because they can’t cope with them?

Thank you

Jules

Sent from my iPhone

I assume thIs was instigated by the care home, which is not a specialist dementia home, or not as specialist as it claims to be? If so, I would approach the CQC.

https://www.cqc.org.uk/contact-us/how-complain/complain-about-service-or-provider

To be fair, a care home isn't usually able to manage people with dementia unless it is a specialist care home (You would usually expect this to be a nursing home, not a care home, there are specific differences)

Nevertheless, this is a distressing time for everyone and you have my sympathy.

Do you know if section 2 or section 3?

Do you know who sectioned her and their reasons, what section is she on, is she still in the carehome or now in hospital. It sounds very upsetting.

Mum was sectioned under 2. Normally three people and the fourth is a family member or carer as mum can’t speak for herself. We weren’t given that opportunity and they simply went ahead without us. Also normally mum’s GP but not in this case. They spoke to me on the phone for all of 20 mins and couldn’t have cared less. They were then meant to get impact from mum social worker, mental health team etc - they did this so quickly that didn’t listen to anyone else. Mum would have been terrified by three strange people in her care home, then whisked off in the night to a scary place. Mums carer of four years visited the next day and has advised it’s a dangerous place for mum to be, the staff don’t care and are horrible, they can’t tell us if she’s eating etc. I’m beside myself with worry. The care home let mum down and wanted her out. X

Yes the care home said they could cope with advanced dementia but obviously couldn’t. They wanted mum out and this was so easy for them to do. I’m worried sick about mum. She had a new hip six weeks ago and is at risk in the hell place they have sent her too x

Section two. 28 days but I’m not sure she’ll make it with all the people she’s surrounded by in the ‘prison’. It was hell and I can’t sleep or eat with worry x

They said she was a danger to herself and others. The care home wanted mum out, we’re incompetent and weren’t patient enough to help with her meds. Mum had a new hip six weeks and is in so much pain.

I agree Sally. But mum is on a specialist wing of a home for advanced dementia. The senior members of the team said the young ones lacked experience in dealing with dementia. So they wanted mum out x

Hello OP

I’m sorry to hear about your mum. You might get more responses if you post on the Elderly Parents Board on here, or you can report your own post and ask for it to be moved.

So awful for you, and poor mum.

No experience at all but wanted to send lots of love to you, what an awful thing to be going through. I really hope a knowledgeable person can help your mum.

Look on the Mind website, you can apply as nearest relative to discharge the Section, the Consultant has 72 hours to review and there are limited grounds for blocking it.

However, you would then I think be responsible for your mum and if the care home aren’t coping with her and can’t have her back, finding another placement may be tricky.

I think if the care home aren’t meeting her needs, whilst unsettling and disorienting for your mum, it may be the better option for her to have a spell in hospital.

The NHS dementia unit near me is lovely, purpose designed, small wards but I’m aware services aren’t the same everywhere.

https://www.mind.org.uk/information-support/legal-rights/nearest-relative/sectioning-and-guardianships/#:~:text=Your%20nearest%20relative%20can%20write,order%20from%20a%20section%2037.

Here you go, hope this is useful.

I'm really sorry to hear about your mum. Not really on topic, but just wanted to say that I think section 2, 28 days, should mean that she will get section 117 aftercare. Something to ask her social worker about.

I am sorry your family is going through a distressing time.

I know a section is frightening but honestly it can be for the best. A hospital/psychiatric unit will have at least a month to help your DM and they’ll be able to review her medication.

Do you have a social worker? Have the hospital contacted you yet, with my DM there was a weekly meeting that I joined in on Zoom.

It doesn’t sound as if the home was the right place for your DM, I know this is hard to accept but if they can’t keep her safe then she must be moved.

My DM was sectioned in her own home and taken to an amazing psychiatrist unit and has since lived in a care home and now a really suitable nursing home. I had to be really pushy and proactive viewing suitable homes for her. I viewed 11 homes and many others wouldn’t take her.

Deep breathes for now, you must be in shock, I wish you both all the best.

@JulesIM there’s a right of appeal against a section 2 within the first 14 days. PP are right that you as nearest relative (if you are - is your dad alive or are there any elder siblings? They’d be NR if so) can also appeal and in that circumstance the responsible authority have to show your mum is dangerous to herself or others. If they can’t the section is discharged.

I’d suggest legal advice first thing tomorrow morning, a patient gets legal aid for applications - I don’t know about situation for relatives I’m afraid. If your mum doesn’t have capacity (likely) the mental health tribunal can appoint a solicitor for her. Good luck.

Sorry just realised it is section 3 if the section goes beyond the section 2 that leads to s117 aftercare.

Have you visited your DM in her new setting? It sounds like the home she was in reached a crisis point and had to act quickly - people with dementia, as I’m sure you know, can deteriorate rapidly to the point where they need to be placed in a different setting for their own safety and the safety of the other residents.
It’s not illegal for a Section 2 to be implemented without consulting family, although it’s obviously good practice to do so. Your permission isn’t required. Your DM will not have been sectioned just because her current care home don’t want her there - they will not be able to meet her needs. I’m sure that you would want her to be cared for in the most suitable place?
It’s obviously a worrying time for her, dementia is a complete bastard of a disease.

That home ain’t taking her back, OP. Didn’t they warn you she might have to go - they usually do.

Concentrate on getting dementia drugs and pain control sorted first, then while that’s settling look around for a better facility.

Thank you for that. Through a friend we are contacting a barrister tomorrow who specialises in these areas. They are aware we would do this under legal aid. How do I start the process please under the 14 day ruling re the tribunal?

Mum is in a terrible place and at risk. The ladies ‘prison’ is next door to the mens. They scream all day and bang the walls. The staff are abusive and I’ve talked to senior people at the unit, also raising a safeguarding - anything I can do. Mum with her new hip is at risk and I feel helpless. X

The home didn’t listen to my warnings that the aggressive lady next door was pushing mum etc (we had multiple safeguardings raised). Then the staff were lazy and for days at a time said mum wasn’t taking her meds - we had permission for this to be done covertly. I clocked them giving drugs, they tried once (in water) then chucked them away. So mum wasn’t getting her meds. Combined with the pain of the new hip etc . When the order was made and mum was waiting for transport they left her alone and she fell and banged her head.

The place she’s in I can only describe as hell. The other residents are dangerous, the staff abusive and mum is at risk. Mums lead carer of four years was there yesterday and witnessed this. I am doing the necessary to sort this. Mum is not safe with a hip which needs to be protected. We are living in hell right now x

I'm sorry you're going through this, an awful situation.
I think you need to focus on where mum is going next as it sounds like this care home couldn't cope. Even if the section is revoked they may refuse to take her back and you probably don't want her going there anyway as they've been so awful.

Have you spoken to a social worker yet to get advice on looking for another home? I'd get going with that as a matter of priority

Sounds shit. You have my sympathy but I'd also say that my mum's original home not coping was the key to a better situation for her. But it was the worst time of my life.

I hope the barrister can help you. I'd talk to the Age UK and Alzheimers Society helplines. But tbh I would also try and work with the team on site. I'd put in a daily call to speak to your Mum's consultant. You may find that their plan is what you want anyway.

The fact that your Mum's care plan includes covert medication is helpful. It sounds as if her behaviour had deteriorated under stress and that may mean that she becomes eligible for CHC funding - Google Beacon CHC for advice on applying for this. It might give you more options.

People get "sectioned" because they need assessment and/or treatment of a mental illness that cannot be provided elsewhere at the moment.
People can be sectioned wherever they live, including care homes.
For someone to be sectioned under S2 Mental Health Act two doctors and an Approved Mental Health Professional have to all find that the criteria are met.
Depending on the urgency, the AMHP should consult others involved in the person's care/life including the person the Mental Health Act says is their 'Nearest Relative' (usually a spouse/ partner or family member) .
It is not necessarily unlawful for someone to be sectioned without this consultation as it depends on the circumstances and urgency, but I'd say for someone living in a care home where details of family are likely to be known it would be unusual for them not to be involved.
Someone must have made the referral for a Mental Health Act Assessment - if not the obvious people - the Care Home, GP, Nearest Relative, Social Worker, who you understand weren't involved, who did? Does your Mum have a CPN? A Psychiatrist?
Who has been identified as the Nearest Relative? As your legal advisers will tell you, this person has the right to seek the discharge of the patient or to ask for a Tribunal to consider whether the patient should be discharged.
I'm so sorry that you are heartbroken about what happened and it sounds like it was a real shock to you, let alone to your Mum.
Being Sectioned doesn't mean your Mum can't return to the care home, the idea of going into hospital is that she gets some help with the aspects of her illness that led to the admission.