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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

cms - how much input should parent have on naps?

54 replies

RattyRoland · 05/03/2013 21:48

My ds is 13mo and recently started with cm two days a week. Cm is great, really like her. The only thing that troubles me is she wants ds to nap an hour at 10am and 1hr30mins at 130pm. In my experience ds won't nap at these times, so he has a routine of sleeping 1h30m at noon at home.

Cm seems quite certain she wants naps at her times but says ds cries and takes ages to settle at 130, I think because he's not tired then- he would never nap as much and so soon after the first nap at home. Ive mentioned this to cm but she suggested I do my usual routine of one noon nap at home and she'll do hers with ds.

This means he has two routines and I'm finding him hard to settle to nap, as is cm, hopefully not CIO though :( is it normal that cm does own routine and parent different and would I risk alienating a really good cm by asking her if she'll agree to nap him at noon like I do?

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HSMMaCM · 05/03/2013 21:58

Why doesn't she want him to nap at noon? Is she collecting children from pre school or something? You need to know why she wants to do something different. If there's not a good reason, then she should do the same as you.

MajaBiene · 05/03/2013 22:02

Children might have to nap slightly differently at the CMs - so 12 might not be doable, but 12.30 or 1pm is - but she should't be trying to make him take two naps when usually he only has one.

VoldemortsNipple · 05/03/2013 22:08

I don't think you're being unreasonable in your request. As HSM says, unless there is a good reason why she can't let your dc sleep at noon. But even then, she should be keeping to a routine which is best for your dc and not herself.

Sometimes at nursery we get requests from parents with children your age, for them not to sleep at all in the day, which we have to refuse as it is not in the best interest of the child.

Could you ask the childmindee to cut out the morning sleep and just have a sleep early afternoon.

catkind · 05/03/2013 22:27

CM should be trying to follow your routine unless she's agreed with you reasons not to. The EYFS which she is supposed to be following is all about working with you and treating each child as an individual. She shouldn't be trying to force your child to nap for her own convenience, and if she is she's not that great a CM. You say she's certain SHE wants him to nap at 1.30, that's not on. If she was certain HE wanted to nap at 1.30 it'd be different - children can be different in a non-home environment.

We've talked CM through what our baby does at home, and asked her to follow baby's cues as far as possible. Result seems to be baby napping a little later at CM's and a lot longer - just wish she'd do the same at home! Funnily enough, what she does at CM is more like your home schedule, what she does at home is more like your CM schedule except the naps are only half an hour. But this is CM following what baby wants, not vice versa.

Original poster

RattyRoland · 05/03/2013 23:51

Thanks all. I'm finding the naps thing very hard - she's certain he should sleep at these times and I'm not sure she'll agree to change without me insisting which I feel could damage our relationship. I do think she's a great cm, I'm quite worried though that ds had a great napping schedule and now he's struggling with a new one :(

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MajaBiene · 05/03/2013 23:53

Why on earth does she think that your DS needs to go back to two naps at those times though?

Twinklestarstwinklestars · 06/03/2013 02:33

Seems odd that she's insisting he has 2 naps when he normally only has one, I would never insist on this you can't force them to sleep at certain times.

ZuleikaD · 06/03/2013 07:27

I think you're right to insist he only has one, if that's what he has at home (though IME most babies of 13m are still having two naps, but the first one much earlier, like 9am). I also think it's reasonable to query why he can't have his afternoon nap earlier. If she's trying to make him fit in with another child's routine then she just needs to suck it up and put him down when you ask, but if she has to pick up from a morning nursery session or something then it's a bit different. Though she should still be able to get him down closer to 12.30, I would have thought.

Flisspaps · 06/03/2013 07:44

I'm a CM - I expect children to nap if/when they need to, not to a schedule convenient to me.

Original poster

RattyRoland · 06/03/2013 08:04

Thanks again. I'm going to have the conversation with her tomorrow when he's next with her. I've discussed with dh and we really like the cm in every other way, but think the naps thing isn't working and is really unfair on ds as he's so unsettled now. Unfortunately if cm won't compromise a bit and things don't improve then I'll have to quit my job as we most cms very booked up and we found it hard to find this one...:(

OP posts:

AThingInYourLife · 06/03/2013 08:10

Don't quit your job FFS, just tell this woman that you are paying her to look after your son and she needs to accommodate his needs, which are for a single nap at around noon.

MrsMushroom · 06/03/2013 08:12

It's a case of she who pays the piper I'm afraid. Your views come first just as they would with a nanny.

As for worrying about damaging your relationship with her you should not be in fear of that unless she's extremely unprofessional. I would put my foot down and insist.

I also agree with FLisspaps....she's right.

MerryMingeWhingesAgain · 06/03/2013 08:22

As a parent, I wouldn't expect a CM to be able to ensure the DC gets a nap at the exact same time as they do at home, they have to fit in a bit with the cm's day. But adding an extra nap he doesn't seem to need or want is going well beyond this IMHO and not really on.

Original poster

RattyRoland · 06/03/2013 08:30

Ok I feel very reassured now, I will definitely have the conversation with cm tomorrow and hopefully she'll agree to my request...if not will have to look for another cm.

OP posts:

anewyear · 06/03/2013 09:04

Another childminder here, Agree with Flisspaps

AThingInYourLife · 06/03/2013 09:30

No, I wouldn't expect a nap at the same time at home.

I would expect the child's existing habits to be taken into consideration, but obviously the day has its own rhythm at CMs.

But I would very unhappy with a strict, very different, sleep schedule being imposed by a CM.

And I would be cross if I spoke to the CM about how her imposed naps were upsetting the child and was not taken seriously.

cory · 06/03/2013 09:59

It might be difficult for the CM if she is looking after more than one child: if everybody is very rigid about their child's nap times, she could end up never getting out of the house- and then the parents would complain about that. When we chose our CM one the things that swayed us in her favour was that she was looking after other children too, so company for dd- but also meant she to fit in with others. Which was precisely what we wanted for her, but might not be every parent's cup of tea.

AThingInYourLife · 06/03/2013 10:10

Fitting in with other children would never require adding new morning naps.

It might mean napping later than usual or having to be woken up to go on school run.

But what is being imposed is weird and unnecessarily prescriptive.

momb · 06/03/2013 10:16

If she has other commitments with the children in her care at 12, then it may not be possible for her to honour your request for a noon nap. This being the case, she may be giving him a shorter nap in the morning becasue he is falling asleep in his lunch at 12.30 or whatever and she isn't able to nap him over lunch time.
Talk to her. This isn't a deal breaker and it may be that between the two of you it is possible to come up with a plan to gradually move his naps back at home too (maybe for an hour?) so that she doesn't need to chhange his routine so much.

fivesacrowd · 06/03/2013 10:20

Yet another cm agreeing with fissflaps. It would be much easier for me if all my mindees fell asleep at the same time and when it suited me best, but child centred cm doesn't work like that. Tbh most of the babies I have will sleep anywhere so will nap in the pram or the car if we're out and about or go down in the cot if we're in the house. I let them sleep when they're tired.
Have you said that your ds has to be put down in a cot for sleeps? If the cm needs to be out and about at the times your ds normally sleeps then this could explain her wanting to change his naps, but still doesn't make it ok though.

AThingInYourLife · 06/03/2013 10:20

She's trying to increase his daily naptime by an hour.

One can only presume because sleeping children require no minding.

ReetPetit · 06/03/2013 11:02

strange does she go out at all/groups or anything?

i would think your ds nap times would actually suit most cms as they have morning school run, morning activity/group, lunch, then nap (ime), then either another activity out or at home then school run....

i find it odd she is trying to add a morning nap, unless she feels he really needs it - is he getting up much earlier the days he is with her? maybe he is irritable and tired and she finds a sleep works better but surely not if he is not tired.

i would speak to her about it. you sound like a reasonable parent and aren't really asking for much - at least he does sleep! and does he self settle? if so, i think she should count her lucky stars,she is being a bit weird tbh imo

Seb101 · 06/03/2013 11:17

To a certain extent your child will need to fit into the childminders routine and the routine of other children. If all the children slept exactly when parents would like, you would always have a sleeping child and never get out the house. Especially if like me you prefer to have children sleep in a cot at home. She may be trying to add the morning nap so that your lo will last longer into the afternoon and therefore nap with the other children then. I don't think its a big problem. The amount of sleep she is trying to get your lo to have isnt unreasonable for his age. If this is a new thing I'd suggest giving it some time for your lo to adapt. Children i've looked after have sometimes slept drastically different nap times/lengths than they do at home. They can cope prefectly well with this. If the childminder is otherwise good, I cetainly wouldnt see this issue as a deal breaker. She is probably trying to juggle lots of childrens needs and is trying to make her setting run smoothly. The childminder may also be trying to get all the children to nap at the same time. I've always done this and achieved it well. It may sound a little selfish, but I believe a childminder that has had an hours break when all the kids are asleep is probably going to perform better in the afternoon. I know I do! I need that break and therefore work very hard to get my children to sleep at the same time whenever possible. Having said all that, if your lo doesnt adjust and isnt coping with the childminders routine, then she should of course adjust it to suit their needs. But I'd give it a chance.

ReetPetit · 06/03/2013 11:58

agree with seb - if this is what she is trying to do, get all the mindees to sleep at the same time - then i don't see any problem with this. It is much better for you/your lo/your cm that she has had a break, than she is frazzled.

I think you really need to ask her about her motivation. Maybe she just feels he needs the morning sleep on those days? Babies behave very different with childcarers than at home so maybe she is finding him hard work and thinks the longer sleep/morning sleep will help him/her/other mindees.

don't necessarily assume she is doing this all for her own benefit, there may be any number of reasons - including possibly a lunch time nursery/playgroup run which coincides with when you want him to sleep.

Original poster

RattyRoland · 06/03/2013 14:03

Thanks. We really like her as a cm and respect her routines, hence we've been happy to go with her suggestions. I'm sure she has been lo's best interest,at heart, I asked this qn though as I wasn't sure how flexible cms usually are and didn't want to offend her!

I do think shes excellent with children, I will discuss napping options with her tomorrow and update :)

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