To be shocked at ‘school readiness’

[Copyandpastry]

2 weeks into this school year with a new class of reception children who 90% are utterly unequipped to be in a classroom. This is a list of things that come to mind the children are unable to do.

-put on their coats. I don’t mean when they struggle to get their arms in or don’t know how to turn a sleeve from inside out. I mean completely unaware of how to even attempt to put on their own coat.
-Recognise their own name.
-They walk away while you are actively talking to them

-Nor a single child has used manners, pleas or thank yous, without being prompted to do so during the whole 2 weeks.
-take their coats to their pegs. Children are taking off their coats at the door, dropping them to the floor and walking away.
-close a toilet cubicle door or pull their pants up before they walk back into class (our toilets are directly off the classroom)

This is not even mentioning the running away or out the classroom when asked to do something they don’t want to do like sit on the carpet, children outright saying no or screaming at staff.

These are not SEN children who are developmentally delayed. Covid babies are no longer an excuse. I’m absolutely baffled how parents have neglected to teach their children basic skills and expectations of behaviour, I have never had a year group like this.

AIBU to be shocked at the lack of school readiness

We may be a similar age. (I'm 65 now.) However, it sounds as if you perhaps came from a wealthier area.

My mother gave up teaching shortly before I was born because it would have been next door to impossible to carry on with a baby. Day nurseries didn't exist outside cities, as far as I know, and I don't think there were all that many childminders available. My parents didn't have the money for a nanny or au pair and they lived a long way from family, who might have been able to help otherwise. However, Mum went back to doing occasional supply teaching within a few years, then part-time teaching and finally full-time once my brother and I were both at school. Most of our friends' mothers and our female relatives also had part-time jobs and some worked full-time. By the time I was at secondary school the number of my classmates with SAHMs was tiny.

Some of that was to do with wanting to increase the money coming into the family, either because it was difficult to make ends meet on just one income, or because a second income would make it possible to have expensive things like colour TVs, better holidays, a car, washing machine and so on, but it wasn't just that. Working mothers got some financial independence and a few were able to leave unhappy or abusive marriages as a result. They could build up their own pension entitlement. And of course lots of women actively wanted to get back to work because it was more interesting than doing housework.

The social stigma around working mothers I remember was partly from a feeling that a man should be able to provide for his family and if his wife worked that implied that he was unable to do that (weird notion nowadays!). However, there was also a longer-lasting worry about mothers (and I do mean mothers, nobody said this about fathers) going back to work when the children were tiny. There was a strong feeling that babies, toddlers and very young children need a lot of individual attention and that was naturally best coming from the mother, or failing that, from a close female relative.

Vanished times!

Yeah but we do this here and these children will be the same at 7.....their parents dont do anything with them.

And, there would be outcry in the uk if kids didnt go to school til 7 because most parents now see school as babysitters, they dont value education.

Now all children are entitled to an education legally and food, unlike 100 years ago.

A hundred years ago all children in England were entitled to free state education up to the age of fourteen. That education was aimed at achieving good standards of literacy and numeracy.

(I say England because I don't know for sure about other parts of the uk, but don't suppose it was different.)

The kids would still be somewhere… most families have to work in the UK. So they’d just be in paid for childcare at circa £1600 a month instead. Might as well let them learn. I could read aged 3, what would be the point of holding me back until 7! By that age I’d read the entire year 6 library.

I mentioned in my post upthread about a general distrust in health professionals. Our toddler is 2.5 and potty training is currently a popular topic of discussion at groups. I've heard a few conversations along the lines of the health visitors are useless, the advice is

stupid and that there is no way their toddler is ready for potty training. You can't say anything in even slightest disagreement or you are "mum shaming".

There was no affordable group care at that time. Maybe playgroup for 3 hours morning or afternoon 1 or 2 days. You had to be on a high income to afford nursery or other type of childcare. The main parent normally did some part time or casual work unless a family member was available.

Sorry, I see this dedicated staff daily - preschool next to me. To be precise, I see them 'interacting' with the children on the climbing apparatus. Every now and then I am seized with a desire to give them a shake, to shake them off their phones. No, not all the time, they use the phones cleverly, whipping them out of pockets and then putting them back there again, pretending to engage for a few seconds with various children. And who could blame them - the salary is not enviable, they are far too young, those staff members. Children I observe on the climbing apparatus outdoors are always in varying states of undress - even if it is plus 5C outside - some children fully clothed, some are only in jumpers and light shirts. If a child chooses to sit in a puddle in this weather - obviously, it is character-building? I must say, I have never seen a fight in the playground thought - I think children left there, they age before their time, learn all the coping strategies and whatever.

So, roughly 100 years ago (around 1920–1926), about 20% to 30% of the world's adult population could read and write

The WORLD, not the uk. Uk was virtually 99%

Precisely. Can't agree more. Obviously, for economic reasons, not because pre-school is a miracle in terms of education.

I think this is a big part of the change. Parents used to have time with their own children. Today many children get an hour with their parents before bed plus weekends (if they are lucky). There was recently a post on here from a mum who had two young children in full time nursery and after school clubs being asked to take meetings until 6. Most posters suggested she should hire more child care to cover the gap, presumably until 7pm bedtime! The parents are no longer the biggest influence on the development of these skills, it is group care.

How rude.

That poster didn't say she couldn't control the class, just described some of the behaviours she sees.

Given that most kids start attending nursery at the age of 9 months/1 year and we are supposedly paying large part of our wages towards nursery 'education' with an EYFS curriculum, this is as much of a failure of nurseries not doing their job as much as parents? Most parents are at work all day and kids are in nursery through the most active, engaged part of the day. Most kids literally come home, eat, bath then bed. Very little time for potty training, learning to write name etc and kids are too tired at night to engage, then parents rushing out of the door to do drop off/get to work etc in the morning. I spend a lot of weekends catching up on cleaning and admin too.

If you want both parents working full time all day and not one at home educating the child, you need to improve nursery provision and accept that some life skills need to be taught there. It's like nurseries are offloading the responsibility of this onto parents and vice versa.

I think it's really odd nobody questions this since we are apparently paying the highest rates in Europe for a high quality early years education for kids that should be setting them up for reception. It's always blame the parents, even though for a lot of families, the nursery spends more time with the children than the parents do.

No, not all the time, they use the phones cleverly, whipping them out of pockets and then putting them back there again

Are you sure they are phones? A lot of caring settings use handheld devices for taking notes and accessing records. They might have been recording that Millie has managed to reach the top of the frame, but Archie is still nervous about going higher than the first rung, or checking what time Flora's mum is picking her up for her doctor's appointment.

I’m very sorry about your loss , that’s absolutely appalling.
I work in education and see the awful pressures parents are under and young people . Your post on your step daughter was highly judgmental when you saw a snap shot of her day , you are still at it in your follow up posts . Also why agree that she’d have a different story to tell if you are only pointing out the reality.
Many people have private struggles but not everyone chooses to makes scathing assumptions and judgments which this thread is full of . I’d bet the op has no dcs and that is very relevant speaking as a mum and a teacher . I’m fortunate in that apart from the usual exhausting struggles and challenges that are unique to parenting I’ve not have to deal with serious issues and I was lucky enough to spend the first few years with each child but the blind could see how difficult it is for parents now and I’m still relatively young as I had kids young . Ivs also cared for older relatives but it still wasn’t the same as the pressures of raising dcs and working.
Also being a sahm was a billion times easier that being a working parent. Our capitalist society does not support this now.
I’m sure your step grand-daughter is a lovely adult now despite her “awful” behaviour at the grand age of 4 😂 and I hope that you have a great relationship with her now ….
Have a good day also .

There has always been a wealthy class of people, the roaring twenties were very different experiences across society

I come from a family of miners in the North of England. I'm almost 70. My parents and grandparents could read and write. It's just a fact that in the uk in 1926 literacy was almost at 99%. I haven't made that up.

Screens and lack of prolonged engagement with parents… also group childcare settings… controversial I know but I think they do no good. Small
group ok in a consistent environment; but I think many childcare services now aren’t that. I think the lack of time with mum / dad whilst young will come out to be detrimental.

Then how did parents 10 years ago manage? Its a very recent shift. We're not talking decades ago when only 50% mothers worked, and very few full time.

This is based on the ability to sign official documentation not evidence of proper literacy rates in reality

@jumpingjohnny i think there were
more stay at home mums ten years ago even. And I think in the 80s/90s people used childminders which is a domestic setting. I don’t know of anyone my age (30s) who went to a group creche style setting before actual school.

I am older now but I was a nursery worker when young. I gave up commenting on what children could do back then because I would be told I was lying or forgetting.
Most 3 year olds could use scissors and draw mainly within lines. By 4 they all could. They couldn't start nursery at 3 until they were toilet trained. We didn't have many accidents, sure the occasional one, but not often.
The issues we would have is kids sitting at tables waving scissors about. They were safety scissors but we taught them not to save them about, we constantly reminded them. And you would see toddlers engrossed in play crossing their legs and would have to send them to the toilet. Lots of kids didn't flush the toilet after going and we would remind them of this. I used to about every ninety minutes go into the toilets and flush any unflushed toilets.
I was 1 to 1 with a non verbal autistic child who was toilet trained but had to be accompanied to the toilet as he would make the sink overflow and stand flushing the toilet for ages if left alone. He was fascinated by water. But he could go to the toilet himself.
We also taught them to tie shoelaces, although most still struggled with that.

The UK(there are people from other countries on this board, why is it so uk centric ) measured the population’s literacy in the 1920’s on people being able to sign official documents like birth , marriage certs .. their data is from that…

Things like potty training, being able to dress, use cutlery are basic parenting skills. Nursery can reinforce/encourage but should not be teaching these skills

@Copyandpastry how many of these DC didn't go to nursery?
Both my DC absolutely had to learn all these things you described at nursery. I remember having parents evenings at nursery saying we needed to help with teaching them how to put coats on etc as they got older