AIBU to feel angry about Notting Hill Carnival behaviour?

[ProudBlackMomma]

Any other London folk mortified by the Notting Hill carnival? Hundreds of arrests, lewd behaviour, vulgarity and litter. It does not represent my culture. It’s an embarrassment.

And 15 million to police the carnival EVERY year
So 20% of the cost for all matches across the year.

Can I ask what you mean by 'lewd behaviour '? The dancing or something else?

I had read that dance hall lyrics and dance moves have become increasingly sexualised since the 1990s and TikTok has motivated some to dance in more extreme ways. Is this what you were referring to?

If it was a ticketed event, I would imagine that a park would be big enough. The ticket price would cover the cost of the cleanup operation. Why should tax payers pay for these people to run riot every year?

London tax payers.

Tbf its mostly London businesses that benefit from the carnival and presumably they pay tax

Yes it’s funded by business rates too

How do carnivals in the Carribean cope? After all this is where the Notting Hill carnival traditions originate from.

I assume they are smaller and do not attract crime in the same way? It would be interesting to see how they are managed over there.

There were 2 reported stabbing incidents at this year's carnival. There are on average 30 knife related incidents a day in London.
We often used to see 5+ stabbings on a Friday night in the ED of the London hospital I worked in. So hardly stabfest.

Twerking in next to no clothes, simulating sex acts. It’s not what anyone should see on the streets of London to be honest. It feels very demonic but that’s for another day!

'Demonic'- that seems a bit dramatic, may I ask if you are evangelical?

I do agree it's gross and imo unacceptable. Would that qualify as public indecency- simulating sex acts?

I'm sure the original carnival wasn't like that : like a lot of elements, the dances seem to have escalated in recent years.

I don't understand why it can't be ticketed and at least partly relocated. It was originally in Notting Hill but it has changed a lot: it's a lot bigger for one. Change sometimes has to happen, especially when lives are at risk.

The 2024 Met Police report is worrying reading.

https://indd.adobe.com/view/8f2c320d-ea3f-43c7-9f30-eb367d870272?fbclid=IwY2xjawG6SJBleHRuA2FlbQIxMAABHdAAu3M2mOmU1hcGSaUZ1_bFI2Qj1OI2Q_lPWR654uodHy3_CsoA3V-_iQ_aem_la_YHtNhITsIwqxtvu_cUA

Genuinely I don't know what people expect. You can't ban it. People would just have private parties that would over spill and have no oversight on at all. An organised event at least manages it all to an extent.

A situation where people just celebrated it unofficially would be far worse and the policing would be worse as a result too.

The whole point is it is effectively the party for lower income multi ethnic families who can't afford tickets to a paid event.

There isn't just a racist element to this, there's also a class one.

It’s long been a bone of contention, as the anti social behaviour which increases year on year is pretty much ignored by the police. Another classic example of two tier policing.

Re Carribean countries with carnivals, it seems they police them far more strictly than we do.

British Carribean police officer Leroy Logan has some good suggestions. He agrees we should relocate it to Hyde Park.

: 'Compared with European festivals of a similar size, the festival is held in a particularly dense section of the city, and so gangs are attracted to NHC to commit crimes and/or settle feuds before disappearing into the crowd. Consideration should be given to changing the location to Hyde Park, or somewhere that is more open, to assist in policing it more effectively.'

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/aug/27/notting-hill-carnival-crime-cop-critics-met-police

What kind of anti social behavior typically happens?

Not Hyde Park, please!

Maybe somewhere like Brockwell Park/Mitcham? Notting Hill really not appropriate.

Are you living under a rock? Stabbings are pretty antisocial by anyone’s standards.

True and it's the same complaints every year for NHC.
Such a shame because the organisers and participants put a hug effort into those amazing costumes.

Well hundreds of arrests suggest that anti social behaviour was pretty rife. Don’t you agree?

Sorry for the confusion, I was reading something else about the Carnival and mixed it up with your post. I thought you meant anti social behaviour aside from murders.

The 2025 arrest breakdown: mostly drugs, then weapons, violence, and sexual offences. it’s the weapons and violence figures/ arrests that set it apart from other festivals. plus things like stabbings year on year, which just don’t feature at music festivals.

Bit rude. Bit troll hunty (against talk guidelines). I'm neither a butterfly nor subatomic.

I haven't read the whole thread yet, but I think it's deeply interesting that there are at least 3 of us who live on the route or in the epicentre and we're all saying that, aside from isolated incidents, it's an absolutely fine, lovely weekend. It's the people who live nowhere nearby, many of whom have never been, who think it's evil incarnate.

There might be the odd arrest during carnival season, which runs from the end of September to the end of November and takes place in 12 different towns here in Somerset, but it's very rare.
The carnivals date back to the foiling of the gun powder plot, you yes, arguably the home of carnival. It gurt lush night out for all the family and brings local communities together