AIBU to support Mum over my brother in property dispute?

[BePeachBiscuit]

I would love your views but this is a long one so please bear with me.

The context is that me (41), my brother (39) and my sister (37) grew up in a small holding, a small ex-farm with about 6 acres. My sister and I left home at around 20 but my brother never really did. He runs a landscaping business so storing his vehicles and tools there was always important. He lived in my mums house until he was about 35 (minus about 4-5 years here and there) when he converted one of the barns on her property into a house. Whilst he lived with my mum he never paid for rent, bills or food but he would do general building jobs and landscaping work. My mum would pay for some of these jobs but not all given that he wasn’t paying towards bills. Both parties thought they were getting a bad deal.

When my brother decided to convert the barn, my mum got the property valued and the barn and yard were worth a third of the total so she signed that over to my brother and has left the rest to me and my sister in her will (obviously depending on what happens before then - she is super healthy and will hopefully live for many more years and may decide to sell etc). She told us all about this plan at the time but my brother insists he didn’t hear it.

A huge problem has arisen now because after moving into the barn he is pressuring my mum to put the whole property into trust or let him buy her house now so he owns the whole thing. My mum doesn’t want to do this because she wants to keep control of her own house, especially because my brother can be quite dominating and forceful. My brother feels the current arrangement is very unfair because he has put so much work into the whole property, he couldn’t live with neighbours if my mum or us wanted / needed to sell it, and in however many years time he won’t have the money to buy us out. He also thinks the valuation was unfair. He is desperate to find a way to keep the property whole and ideally under his ownership. We have suggested he buy an investment property instead but he doesn’t want to do this.

My sister and I don’t even want to discuss this given that my mum is alive and well. But my stepdad died without a will and it was awful, which is why my mum wants it all agreed. And its stressing my brother so much that it is now causing a huge family rift. We’ve tried counselling but didn’t get anywhere.

So I’d love your advice.

AINBU by siding with my mum and telling my brother that this arrangement is fair, my mum won’t sign over the whole house and his best bet is long term planning to buy us out eventually (assuming my mum doesn’t want / need to sell in the meantime). Or AIBU and I should think about my brother’s side more and how to talk to my mum about transitioning the house to him? Thank you in advance for your help, any thoughts gratefully received.

Well it might be useful to understand why your brother thinks the initial valuation was unfair and to think about how the property might work if you/your sister (or your mum for that matter) decide to sell one day but no your mum should not feel forced, or obligated, to sign off the property to him now or leave it to him in her will.

So yes, listen to his arguments if you haven't already but unless you find them compelling, support your mum.

Your mother has three children, each get a third. It’s the only fair way. You and your sister can decide to sell to your brother at market value when the time comes.

Your mother is doing right by all three of her children.

More info needed I think.
Could he afford to buy it now, in theory?
He thinks the valuation is too high, or too low?
Why didn’t he pay rent?
Does he have his own family?
How does he know he couldn’t “cope” with neighbours? Most of us manage just fine. Has he a personality disorder or antisocial tendencies etc?

Ultimately he can’t force your mum to do something she doesn’t want to do can he so he’ll just have to suck it up? I guess she can’t evict him now if she’s signed the barn over already though (should his moaning drive her to want to). 🤔

Was the site valuation before or after planning on the barn?
For it to worth a third of the value of the whole, sounds like they consided the potential and not the actual.
How easy is it to split this off from the main residence?
Driveway/parking/boundaries/water supply etc, have they all been split?

On paper it sounds reasonable, but I could envisage it's not really a separate dwelling. But, your brother would have known this and has proceeded anway

He hasn’t paid rent and didn’t buy the barn off her - as far as I can see he deserves nothing but if your DM becomes ill or frail he may pressurise her to give the rest of it to him. I would speak to a solicitor and possibly get power of attorney for DM set up in you and sisters names so you have some control if eg she suffers dementia or goes into a care home in the future.

Did he pay to convert the barn? If so it's only worth what it is because of his investment, so to say all he gets is essentially his own money back feels a bit off. I think look at the whole estate before he did the conversion, the value then and divide by 3, take into account the value of the pre reno barn and the land it sits on, not its current state

He should have paid rent for the 15 additional years he lived in his mum's house if he wants paid back for his investment in converting his own home @MiceSpiders.

Support your mum @BePeachBiscuit , your brother sounds greedy and selfish.

YANBU.

I have seen this is my own family. My uncle, who was financial very well off himself, felt so entitled to my grandfather’s property that he created a will the way he wanted and asked my grandfather to sign it. My grandfather was so hurt that he went along and did what his son wanted. And then for years regretting how unfair the deal was to the daughters one of whom had a mental health issue because of which she could not work full time and didn’t get married. She was the one who cared for her parents more than other children.
Your mom should tell him that this is her home and he cannot pressure to sell it to him. Where does he think your mum will live?

Did he do and pay for the work on the barn? I imagine that's added a fair bit of value, has that been taken into account in the valuation? I think unfortunately the fact he's not paid any rent or for food etc won't mean much in legal terms (but IANAL).

Aside from that why on earth does he think he deserves the whole property?! It's crazy.

Even if he paid for barn conversion. He has used the house rent free for 15 more years than sisters did. So there had an unfair advantage.
2nd he has got ownership of his 1/3 share now versus his sisters getting years down the line.
So he should stop complaining. And it’s Op’s mum’s wishes. If she wants she can give him nothing to the greedy son.

Please support your mum. Your brother is an absolute knob.

I wouldn’t bank on him being able to buy you out. Maybe she should sell now.

It wasn't clear if the barn was woth 1/3 converted, as was with planning, or simply as an agricultural building. However if the barn is now a separate dwelling then your mum could have decided to apply for planning permission and sell the plot an unconverted barn to a third party if she had wanted to, so your brother benefited there from the value uplift that your Mum gifted to him, rather than charging him for. This is on top of the rent and keep (including rent for the space to store his equipment) she didn't charge him for.

He now has a whole house , you and your dsis have half a house each one day in the future if it hasn't had to be sold to pay care fees, inheritance tax etc.

@BePeachBiscuit I really feel for you as this is a difficult situation to resolve.

Forgive me if I missed it but I don’t think you said how old your Mum. Based on you and your siblings ages I would assume mid 60s +.

YANBU but unless you get this all sorted as your Mum ages she will become more vulnerable to your brother’s arguments. Ideally your Mum lives a long life and dies in her own bed. In that scenario you and your sister each inherit your 1/3rd. However, if your Mum needs care, or sadly needs to go in a care home, her property may need to be sold to fund care. Any solution now needs to take this into account.

As counselling has failed and your brother is digging in, my advice, assuming you are in England or Wales, is:

• Take your Mum to see a STEP solicitor who can set out the options taking into account deprivation of assets and inheritance tax. This should lead to her updating her will https://www.step.org/directory/members/search
• Make sure you all understand the legal agreements currently in place e.g. has the property been split and registered with Land Registry?
• For the portion of the property owned by your Mum, make sure she has an email address as one of the 3 permitted addresses (it’s free) https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/updating-registered-owners-contact-address
• For both plots of land register for property alerts (free) https://www.gov.uk/guidance/property-alert
• These two mean your Mum should be notified if your brother tries to change the ownership of your Mum’s property.
• Your Mum needs to have LPAs in place for Health & Welfare but also Property & Finance. She needs to decide if it is sensible to have your brother or just you or you and your sister and whether it’s joint only or joint and several.

I am going to be straight with you, your brother is in a strong position to wear your Mum down as she ages. He sees her daily and can drip drip how unfair it is. It is highly likely your Mum will eventually need help e.g. shopping, managing finances etc. and being on site means your brother is in the ideal position to take advantage. He may be able to intercept post or get her to sign documents etc. This may not be now but in 10 or 20 years time.

Unfortunately financial abuse of the elderly by family members is far more common than people realise and because it’s “family” it can be hard to get a parent to take action. Legal action is ruinously expensive so reaching an agreement now is in everyone’s best interests. YANBU to support your Mum but your brother does have some valid arguments about his hard work and money adding to an asset you and your sister will potentially inherit.

I would be asking the STEP solicitor if there is a way to draw up a legal agreement (not a trust) where your Mum remains the owner of the 2/3rds until she either dies or goes into a care home. At that point your brother is given first refusal to buy the property based on the market value at that time. I think it maybe known as a RICS Red Book valuation used for probate.

I would then be generous and in the agreement state he pays market value less 10% (negotiate on this I would say 25% would be my red line). Yes, you and your sister get less but your brother will potentially have spent a lot of time, energy and money maintaining your Mum’s property. The other option is your Mum on an ongoing basis pays your brother the going rate for maintenance.

Your brother doesn’t have a mortgage and so he can save every month knowing he will buy the property in the future.

When your Mum dies, if he can’t afford to buy you and your sister’s share outright it should also be possible in the agreement, or your Mum’s will, that your brother gets a lifetime interest in the element of her 2/3rds of the property he can’t buy subject to paying you and your sister rent/monthly repayment.

Example
Property = £300k.
Brother given 1/3rd = £100k Mum 2/3rds = £200 k
Mum dies 2050 her 2/3ds = £400k

• less 15% £60k = £340k
• Brother pays £200k to sisters =£140k owing to sisters
• Brother pays £1k a month to sisters reducing outstanding balance.
• Brother dies with £100k remaining, sisters inherit £100k when the property is sold.

Note: I know the sisters could die first so their heirs would inherit.

This is just one example, a STEP solicitor could give others.

I think that your brother is being very unfair, so much so that I’m wondering whether he has some additional needs, and can only see this from a “I won’t be able to cope with that” point of view? And not from a “estate split in three” point of view?

If you suspect that might be the case, I’d respond to every conversation about the Will with “It’s mums home. In the same way that I can’t tell you what to do with your home, you can’t tell mum what to do with hers”.

Then support her to ensure that the Will has been done by a solicitor and has a solicitor listed as a potential executor. And make sure that you and your sister are POA for her - if your brother can’t understand this he won’t be able to understand POA properly.

And support him to ensure that his property is sufficiently independent that if your mum does pass away that he can cope. Seperate all utilities, talk to your mum about selling him some land round his house if he doesn’t already own that, plant trees and build a fence between the properties etc.

Why does your brother think he should get the whole property having lived as a cocklodger for years? Crazy. Follow @Kirschcherries brilliant advice, start with ensuring your mum has a rock solid will which she has decided upon without pressure from anyone.

What happens if he becomes a bankrupt and presuming he has his 1/3 signed over, his property is sold, willy-nilly. You would be left in a pretty invidious situation. Is he likely to marry? The need for a watertight will is absolutely paramount.

This. I personally know of two instances where a will was totally changed to be wholly in favour of the dying person's closest carer, despite the dying person being unable to form a coherent sentence or even being conscious most of the time. In one case £100,000 was withdrawn from their bank accounts while they were unconscious in ICU. The wills were contested, but both were proved. Go to a solicitor with your mum and put massive safeguards in place.

Why would he have the money to buy the property now (off your mum) but not in 5/10/however many years time off you and your sister?

I can see his perspective that if his home doesn't function as an independent home once someone else lives on the rest of the smallholding, that would be a massive upheaval for him and would he even be able to sell the barn for anything like it's value (either as 1/3 of the estate or enough for him to buy somewhere else to live)?

But if your mum doesn't trust him enough to have him own her home while she still lives there then not sure what the best thing to do now is. With hindsight, him converting the barn and investing his time and money into it probably wasn't the best solution to a property that would have to be split 3 ways.

Absolutely this. Your brother is being greedy, protect your mum. Financial abuse of the elderly by family does happen.

I’m not saying he’s right, but I can understand why he’s upset. I live on a smallholding that was my dad’s and bought a small property on it that was my dad’s. I also used the land and spent a lot of money building stables and fencing the land. My husband and I lived here for 18 years before my dad died and got on very well with him, did a lot of care. There are no other neighbours close by, so we’re really not used to other people being close to our home space. It sounds similar for the brother in this thread. When my dad died we were left his house and land. My brother was left my mother’s house entirely. Mum’s house was worth a bit less, but my (parents (who were divorced but friends) said they had given my brother a lot of help over the years paying off debts for him. We are struggling a bit financially to try to keep the other house (dad’s). We have no money but want to make it a holiday let rather than sell it and have neighbours. I think if you’ve grown up somewhere with neighbours you won’t understand how weird it is to have neighbours when you’ve been used to just a family area.
But this is the way it is for your brother (and us!). If he can’t affect to pay his sisters out of the house he will just have to accept that things are going to change and he’ll either have to get used to it, find a way to afford to prevent it being sold, or find another property. That’s life.

What is your brother "stressed" by, exactly? The prospect of maybe not getting his own way? The idea that mere females might not roll over when the big I Am snaps his fingers? He's not stressed, he's bullying you.

Of course you don't give up your inheritance. Maybe talk to mum about giving you and your sister POA? Brother doesn't have to know. Appointments with a lawyer and a financial advisor might be worth the money too. Just mum and your sister and you - again, he doesn't have to know.

It's you mother's property , get her to make a will otherwise you will be strongarmed out of any inheritence.
Get the lawyer to point out to your brother he got his inheritence early, and is therefore very fortunate and has no say over the disposal of the rest of the property- what if your mother gets ill? The remaining property will be sold to pay for her care- your brother will have his inheritance free and clear and you and your sister will get nothing, or next to nothing.
As to diagreeing with the valuation the time to dispute that is long past- he accepted his inheritance he can't renegotiate it now- he has one hell of a nerve.

The way I see it, he is ruining the family. There is no way to reason with him and he will make your mum's life hell.

Your mum should considering selling and moving away. If he wants to buy it at market price, so be it.

The fact he lives next door means he will be able to bully your mum onto her deathbed.

It's your Mother's property to do as she wants.

You, your sister, and your brother have no say whatsoever.
I get that your Mother wants some backup from her family so give her carte blanche to do what she thinks is best for her.

On a personal note, your brother sounds a bit of a bully entitled, and should be told that he should back off.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but he seems to have done rather well out of your Mother so far.