To think far too many people in UK & elsewhere are making stupid decisions about drugs and ignoring the consequences re county lines, criminal gangs etc?

[Jane379]

I found out recently about the huge amount of cocaine in London sewage system. I knew there was a problem but was suprised how bad it was.
I read up on the situation a bit more and was shocked to find that Sweden & Belgium are apparently both concerned that the government starting to lose control to drug smugglers, problems are also rising in the Netherlands with journalists and lawyers mmurdered. Use also is rising in Norway especially among youth in Oslo etc.
AIBU to wonder what on earth people buying illegal cocaine & others are thinking?

A lot of the time it's not people in hugely depressing and difficult situations (not that this is an excuse, but I could understand the motive more) but people who are comfortably off, at least materially and surely could find other forms of stimulation?
It's well known that these drugs are addictive, and even if people aren't addicted and only use occasionally, why are so many happy to enable county lines, suffering in Mexico and others, violent criminal gangs etc for a temporary high? I've seen some users on here justify by saying the harm comes because it's illegal but that's dodging the question as for the foreseeable future they are illegal and buying from the gangs sustains the trade.

I would have anyone who takes or supplies illegal drugs never allowed to have a driving licence. Say for at least ten years. Assume in law they are addicted and there is a danger in them being behind the wheel.

Most people don’t become addicted to cocaine or MDMA etc. It’s a party drug and people are young and dumb and they cause euphoria. I am not surprised people want an escape.

Obviously the industry is evil. But should they not then legalise, regulate and tax?

Grow your own. Dump the dealer.

I would suggest that most people who take it are addicted to the feeling cocaine gives them. MDMA isn’t particularly addictive but cocaine is hugely.

No country has legalised cocaine.
I am sure somewhere would have tried that if it was the obvious answer.

I wouldnt say hugely. I was in circles with lots of it around when I was younger and I only knew one person out of about 40 people who ever became addicted to cocaine. Everyone was very able to switch in and out of it when jobs came along that did testing or for most when they reached 30s/had a child/ moved away. That’s anecdotal of course but I wouldn’t say it’s a hugely addictive drug compared to say opioids or even alcohol.

This. Amsterdam has not done this, and Portugal has just decriminalised possession of drugs but still goes after dealers & mandates treatment for addicts.

How do you get rid of the stink of weed that affects the neighbourhood. Why should people have to put up with it?

I'm not convinced by this. Maybe a lot of these people had higher tolerance somehow? I can imagine some people may have that but overall I don't think the evidence bears out that cocaine is less addictive than alcohol.

Really scary.

Oslo is apparently the worst city in Europe for this.

https://www.dw.com/en/focus-on-europe-ketamine-norway-and-its-huge-drug-problem/video-76508800

This is what puzzles me : poverty & trauma do drive drug use but surely a lot of young people have fairly OK circumstances? I thought Norway & the other Nordic countries were doing pretty well overall yet they seem to have very severe drug problems.

Many (most) people do not have any idea of the far-reaching consequences of anything they consume. They think about themselves (& sometimes a small number of others such as their family, to an extent) only.

Factory Farming--that bacon sandwich is torturning an animal with more intelligence than many dogs, contributing to deforestation, destroying the planet with the destruction mass-produced meat causes but who cares? It tastes nice.

Fast fashion--The amount of water it uses, the amount of waste it creates, the blasé attitudes it promotes. But never mind, this dress is really cute, it only cost me a tenner! Before we consider even what is essentially human slavery.

Artificial grass/patios-- Native plants destroyed. Insects essential for soil irration killed. Earth polluted. Pollinators starved. But it looks nice! And i can't be bothered gardening, and little Tommy won't have to wipe his feet when he comes in.

Legalising drugs would force those who produce them to come up with other substances, possibly far more harmful ones. It hasn't made much of a difference in the places it is legal either. Here in the UK it could even create more crime.

Drugs are no different. And are not the issue, WE are the issue. We're a selfish species with the brain capacity to know far better, but we like our instant gratification.

Drugs have been a problem for decades though. I was a teen in the 90s and the clubbing scene was awash with drugs, as well as it being very common to smoke weed. Loads of us experimented with drugs in our teens/20s.

I’m sorry but that last sentence made me laugh! I do know what you mean but that tickled me.

Hear Hear OP. So many people don’t give a shit or haven’t got the critical thinking skills to realise how getting their pathetic fix impacts on wider society.

I judge anyone who smokes weed. Selfish, pathetic losers.

I don't have a problem with legalising marijuana, but it's not enough...

The Netherlands legalised Marijuana but continued to keep hard drugs (like cocaine) something illegal that they just turn a blind eye to. This leading to the worst of both worlds where the space is left open only to criminals and those criminals aren't properly policed (except by themselves). It's the most fertile ground imaginable for the growth of violent international criminal gangs and the human trafficking, child exploitation that comes with it. It only became a big talking point after a lawyer was shot in,.which was a terrible thing, but multiple people had died before then, including children. They didn't matter as much because of race/class.

And of course, during the public soul searching there was a tendency to hold "Moroccan gangs" alone responsible. Despite the fact most of the people using the drug recreationally and creating the demand were white Dutch. And a lot of the corrupt people who facilitated the gangs were also white.

So I'm all for legalising cannabis but at the same time they.need to keep up the pressure on harder drugs and on policing and prosecuting people involved. And maybe changing the culture on how it's viewed.

Cocaine isn't a "painkiller" drug like heroin or opiates. It isn't taken predominantly by people who are already suffering to make their lives better. It gives you confidence and makes the users feel like they are more fun to be around (reality may differ). So people taking it may have low self esteem but predominantly it's a party drug. Of course, in time users may become addicted but because it has a perception of being fun it's seen as less bad than heroin. When really the consequences are as bad, but they are pushed onto other people (the children in county lines, people in Columbia etc) not the successful teacher taking Charlie once a fortnight

Heroin or Fentanyl addiction tends to take place in places where there is more despair or by people who already have terrible things happening in their lives (PTSD, history of sexual assault etc).

Because it makes people feel good and is psychologically addictive.
People think as long as they're not spending all their time or money on it then it's not doing anyone any harm except themselves.
If it wasn't illegal all the criminality/abuse involved in the supply chain could be massively reduced.

You can easily grown your own cannabis for personal consumption. Many do. 9,000 around Manchester alone.

Yes, I mean personally I don't have so much of an issue if that is what is happening. But I'm talking primarily about cocaine & other drugs where the situation is different.
And it's worth noting that cannabis can have serious health consequences. If any drug should be legalised for growing etc, probably that one, but I still have reservations.

I do agree a Portugal style policy could be good but what was done there was decriminalisation & controlled supply to addicts.

People who want to party with cocaine etc can't buy it legally in Portugal, nor Amsterdam. I don't think cocaine, heroin, ketamine etc should be legalised & no country has tried this. So legalisation wouldn't solve the issue of people wanting to party using cocaine etc, drugs dealers would still have a market.

Agree with this. It's dangerous people see it as less bad than heroin because it is still very addictive.

I am somewhat worried about fentanyl addiction becoming a bigger thing here. So far it isn't but the situation in the US is terrible and there are already enough problems in the UK as it is.

However, it seems opioids may also be more of a thing in America due to over prescription & predatory pharmaceutical companies, which has apparently also driven some users to heroin also...

I agree strongly with this but what should the next step be? Surely cocaine, heroin etc can't be legalised in the same way as cannabis given how dangerous they are? Portugal's method of decriminalising possession seems to work well but selling heroin, cocaine etc is still illegal.

Alcohol can have serious health consequences - although there are fewer home brew supplies than hydroponics suppliers.

You could grow your own cocaine, in theory. But a lot of science stuff that isn't on YouTube is needed to make it actually worthwhile.

Plenty of opium in the UK growing wild. Just a question of harvest and processing.

Yeah because prohibition and then repeal had no effect on gangs....as for your last point look at the difference things like Spotify made to Napstar. Most people will go for the more expensive option if it is convenient and legal.

Well no, drug dealers wouldn't have a market if it was legal and the quality was uniform. It would remove the black market entirely if done correctly.
But ketamine and morphine are already legal for medical use.