Page 25 | To think it’s shocking how bad Britain has fallen apart compared to other European counties

TheColourofspring · 2023-04-14T05:56:04+00:00

I am in Spain at the moment in one of the big cities. It’s clean, modern, well maintained. Transport is cheap, food is cheap, healthcare seems to work pretty well (from talking to local). Parks are noticeably well maintained- even saw park keepers! Clean & tidy. Pensions higher, if you lose your job you get a portion of your salary in unemployment benefits while you look for another and there are no penalties. Based on the premise that if you have paid in, you will get looked after if you are in need. I am not saying it’s perfect- no country is but it was the same when I was in France last summer. In Britain, everything is underfunded and close to the edge. Schools, the NHS, local authorities are all at breaking point. My local parks look shabby & there is very little maintenance. Roads have pot holes. Yesterday I read an article about pharmacies being the latest at ‘crisis’ point with major drug shortages (thanks to brexit). Queues at borders, people can’t heat or eat properly, food banks, housing is ridiculous for many people. I think it’s just so noticeable when you go to other places just how run down Britain is. Finding it shocking and a bit depressing - like I said, all countries have their issues but I think Britain really has been pillaged by the tories & Brexit really is a disaster.

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 16/04/2023 22:58

CoffeeCantata · 16/04/2023 13:20

Litter is bad in Britain, I think. Worse than in European countries - I assume it's linked to the passion Brits seem to have for take-aways.

But I think ideology also plays a part. When I worked in education I frequently came across an idea that it was somehow wrong to ask/teach children to pick up litter and take a pride in their environment. Now, give me a 'helping hand stick thing' and I'll pick litter till the cows come home - and the children I worked with loved it! But no, apparently - I was told primly by a teacher once that 'I'd never ask children to do a menial task!' OK... because in real life none of us ever have to do menial tasks, do we?

At another school, the grounds were almost ankle-deep in litter at the end of the day because of all the snacking and eating lunch outside. The school employed 2 people to pick up litter all day. Therefore, when you asked a student who'd thrown down their litter to put it in a bin they would often respond 'I'm not doing it - it's THEIR job." Perhaps if they'd employed 2 gardeners instead to keep the grounds looking good I bet there would have been less litter because of the 'broken window principle' where people take their cue from the state of their environment.

Parents, teachers and everyone should try to foster care and pride in our environment - other European countries do this better, I think.

Meanwhile in France....

To think it’s shocking how bad Britain has fallen apart compared to other European counties

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 16/04/2023 23:03

Tbf, that was due to the binmen strikes but rubbish has been an issue there for ages. Here are some pictures from a few years ago.

notimagain · 16/04/2023 23:11

@StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar

With regard to the rubbish and Meanwhile in France....

Just for completeness - not all of France, AFAIK what's depicted recently is certainly unpleasant but it's confined to parts of Paris.

Here down south our bins have continued to be emptied once a week, even on major strike days.

Florenz · 16/04/2023 23:14

Our bins are only emptied once a fortnight, the same as they've been for many years, probably when Labour were last in power.

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 16/04/2023 23:16

Mine have always been weekly in the south and the Midlands.

TheClitterati · 16/04/2023 23:25

I've just spent 2 weeks in Italy. It's a wonderful magical country. But seriously poorly run. From rubbish, transport, food was the same as here if not more, beaches all privately owned etc. Really made me appreciate the uk despite all the pot holes.

Mt Spanish friend tells me social security/ welfare is basically non existent in Spain? If you're not working there is very little support - you need to reply in family.

Cattenberg · 16/04/2023 23:34

In my part of the South-West, our bins are emptied… wait for it… every three weeks.

Recycling is collected every week, but it’s not the cardboard and glass that stinks in the summer heat.

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 16/04/2023 23:44

Cattenberg · 16/04/2023 23:34

In my part of the South-West, our bins are emptied… wait for it… every three weeks.

Recycling is collected every week, but it’s not the cardboard and glass that stinks in the summer heat.

I can imagine the smell. However, our recycling is fortnightly and we don't have a separate bin for it (just bags) so I always end up with loads of cardboard and bottles.

Cattenberg · 16/04/2023 23:51

TheClitterati · 16/04/2023 23:25

I've just spent 2 weeks in Italy. It's a wonderful magical country. But seriously poorly run. From rubbish, transport, food was the same as here if not more, beaches all privately owned etc. Really made me appreciate the uk despite all the pot holes.

Mt Spanish friend tells me social security/ welfare is basically non existent in Spain? If you're not working there is very little support - you need to reply in family.

There’s so much to love about Italy, but it’s always seemed a bit corrupt and lawless to me. Apparently, criminal syndicates have created illegal toxic waste dumps in the south. One of the worst hit areas, not far from Naples, is known as the Triangle of Death, as it has seen a suspicious rise in cases of cancer and congenital abnormalities.

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 17/04/2023 01:48

Cattenberg · 16/04/2023 23:51

There’s so much to love about Italy, but it’s always seemed a bit corrupt and lawless to me. Apparently, criminal syndicates have created illegal toxic waste dumps in the south. One of the worst hit areas, not far from Naples, is known as the Triangle of Death, as it has seen a suspicious rise in cases of cancer and congenital abnormalities.

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And the fact that the Mafia still hold a lot of influence in certain areas isn't great.

Natsku · 17/04/2023 06:09

Cattenberg · 16/04/2023 23:34

In my part of the South-West, our bins are emptied… wait for it… every three weeks.

Recycling is collected every week, but it’s not the cardboard and glass that stinks in the summer heat.

Bloody hell, I would not like that!
Bins are collected as often as you like in Finland if you have your own bin rather than communal ones (i.e. can opt for weekly, or fortnightly or presumably monthly if you really don't generate much waste. We have weekly but could probably switch to fortnightly but the hot summer smell puts me off that idea. We have to pay for it though.) but if you have your own bin then there's no collection of recycling, have to take it myself to the nearest recycling bins which is a bit of a pain as the cardboard and plastic bins are 3km away (but next to the supermarket so just do it when we do the food shop)

QuentininQuarantino · 17/04/2023 06:29

*Mt Spanish friend tells me social security/ welfare is basically non existent in Spain? If you're not working there is very little support - you need to reply in family.

this isn’t exactly true. It’s contributions based - so you can’t finish school and go on the dole forever (but you can access free training courses/vet etc to help get work) but if you’ve had a high paying salary, you get a fairly high dole. It is also topped up, so if you find a part time role you get the rest made up in benefits. you can’t use their NHS if you aren’t working (but can if you’re a dependent/spouse).

it is hardest for young people as youth unemployment is highest and they haven’t contributed enough to get the unemployment benefit, hence relying on family.

LBFseBrom · 17/04/2023 06:39

I too have friend in Spain who has been on disability for quite a while, has no complaints about benefits or health care.

MarshaBradyo · 17/04/2023 06:50

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 16/04/2023 23:03

Tbf, that was due to the binmen strikes but rubbish has been an issue there for ages. Here are some pictures from a few years ago.

These photos are quite something

ChunkaMunkaBoomBoom · 17/04/2023 06:51

Any yet people keep voting Tory. So that some rich people can get richer while the rest of us watch basic services fall apart.

thewooster · 17/04/2023 07:29

Wow those photographs from France are shocking, it must stink.

I'm in the East Midlands and we have:
Black bin for every day waste collected once a fortnight
Green bin for recycling collected once a fortnight
Red bin for glass collected once a month
Brown bin for garden waste collected once a fortnight from April to November

It works fine for us and my neighbours. There's a family of 8 a few streets away and the council have given them a bigger black bin - presumably because they've 3 times as much waste! But most of us manage with the bins provided.

Flowerly · 17/04/2023 07:57

StepAwayFromTheBiscuitJar · 16/04/2023 22:55

So you don't think in the examples given that the ethnicity was a relevant aspect, even in light of the fact that the main issue seems to be the attitude towards women within their specific culture?

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Apparently not so she reported the threads. 🙄

QuentininQuarantino · 17/04/2023 09:49

Could I caution against making judgements of an entire country (btw am neither French nor in France so no allegiance!) based on a photograph taken precisely because it is unusual and therefore newsworthy?

Scotland this summer.

GPTec1 · 17/04/2023 09:58

Silly posting pictures of any city during a 'bin strike, of rubbish not collected... thats the point!!!

Maybe consider that we in the UK ship out '000s of tons of crap every week to dev countries were much of it is burnt or ends up in the sea?

However, we still get weekly rubbish collections (Cornwall) and every 2 weeks recycle ones.

I was also very pleasantly surprised to see a fantastic wash and toilet block in Perranporth yesterday and it was free! Lovely day out.

Car parking charges are still through the roof though :(

RafaistheKingofClay · 17/04/2023 10:00

Natsku · 17/04/2023 06:09

Bloody hell, I would not like that!
Bins are collected as often as you like in Finland if you have your own bin rather than communal ones (i.e. can opt for weekly, or fortnightly or presumably monthly if you really don't generate much waste. We have weekly but could probably switch to fortnightly but the hot summer smell puts me off that idea. We have to pay for it though.) but if you have your own bin then there's no collection of recycling, have to take it myself to the nearest recycling bins which is a bit of a pain as the cardboard and plastic bins are 3km away (but next to the supermarket so just do it when we do the food shop)

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I live in the SW too and there isn’t much that can’t be recycled so I don’t find the 3 weekly bin collection isn’t much of an issue.

Food waste is collected weekly as is the recycling. That covers most of the stuff I’d throw away. It’s probably problematic if you have children in nappies or something similar though.

My big issue is tin foil and that’s just laziness on my part since it can be recycled if clean. I just can’t be bothered to wash it.

notimagain · 17/04/2023 10:01

Could I caution against making judgements of an entire country (btw am neither French nor in France so no allegiance!) based on a photograph taken precisely because it is unusual and therefore newsworthy?

Well said.

The Paris rubbish collectors industrial action situation is specifically related to the protests over pension reform, and has generally been confined to only some of parts of Paris itself.

I'm resisting the temptation to post some pictures of our (non-Parisian) freshly emptied bins and the recently washed/swept pavements.

Caddyautopants · 17/04/2023 10:03

I used to live in another EU country. And the average 3 bed house was £700,000 equivalent and food is much more expensive. Clothes are extortionate over there too.

I don't think we're falling apart in the UK. I don't think we're used to higher prices and other countries are. (Houses, clothes and food are still cheaper here!)

Natsku · 17/04/2023 10:07

RafaistheKingofClay · 17/04/2023 10:00

I live in the SW too and there isn’t much that can’t be recycled so I don’t find the 3 weekly bin collection isn’t much of an issue.

Food waste is collected weekly as is the recycling. That covers most of the stuff I’d throw away. It’s probably problematic if you have children in nappies or something similar though.

My big issue is tin foil and that’s just laziness on my part since it can be recycled if clean. I just can’t be bothered to wash it.

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We don't have biowaste collection unfortunately (they have it where there's communal bins but not for people with detached houses) so that's the problem. Almost everything else is recycled so some weeks there's just one or two bin bags in the wheelie bin which just seems silly.
Same with tin foil, if its not very messy than I'll wash it but if stuff is burnt onto it then I don't. But I tend not to feel too bad about that because at least the rubbish is going to a waste to energy plant rather than a landfill.

Snoken · 17/04/2023 10:26

Caddyautopants · 17/04/2023 10:03

I used to live in another EU country. And the average 3 bed house was £700,000 equivalent and food is much more expensive. Clothes are extortionate over there too.

I don't think we're falling apart in the UK. I don't think we're used to higher prices and other countries are. (Houses, clothes and food are still cheaper here!)

But whether things cost more elsewhere is irrelevant and it's not a sign of a country not doing well. If the salaries are higher, then the higher house or food prices comes with it.

QueueEtwo · 17/04/2023 13:33

Shelagh Fogarty on LBC just responding to Richi Sunaks speech today saying that the lack of maths is holding the economy back!

The things holding the Economy back are:
Brexit
Chronic illness
Inadequate housing
Lack of social care

So bloody true! Kids doing maths until they are 18 isn't going to fix anything!