The Beatles: Are they objectively excellent?

[FruityFrog]

I'm watching the film Yesterday. It's very good. The premise is that a solar flare or something causes The Beatles to have never existed, everybody forgets them. However, there is one person can remember their songs. He wows people with songs like 'Yesterday' and 'The long and winding road', people keep saying they're the best songs they've ever heard etc etc.

My question is, are they really the best songs ever, objectively? Some are incredibly simple and some super weird. Or are they significant because of what they represented at the time in the 60s, or how people born since then have experienced them through their parents?

Before my time slightly. I think they were a shift in music at the time but also are actively good tunes with (mostly) meaningful lyrics. Worthy in my opinion of respect. Are they the very best? Subjective amongst strong contenders.

I was born in the midst of Beatlemania, sang songs at primary school and learnt them in music classes, even studied lyrics as poems.
I find them utterly passionless. Cold even. Plinky plink with no soul.

How would you even begin to measure music objectively? And why would you, our ears like what they like. One person's perfect song can be another person's awful racket and there are other non musical factors to take into account

Before I launch into this, I just want to caveat my answer by saying that I have very catholic tastes: I love music of all eras, genres, countries, styles. I’m a classically trained musician.

The Beatles are objectively the most culturally important musical act of the C20th, the towering behemoth of music, culture, fashion and influence. They turned the music business from a tin pan alley racket of matching artists to songs, to a model where artists wrote their own music as standard (not that there’s anything wrong with ‘music factories’ e.g. Motown).

The Lennon-McCartney dialectic produced a constantly evolving musical style unmatched by any artist before or since, and led to the greatest set of works in pop music.

They broke America and showed how the UK can blaze a cultural trail.

There’s obviously loads more, but I don’t think The Beatles can be beaten.

I think it's impossible to be objective as you can't unknow them. I like watching people like Neil Brand and Howard Goodall analyse them as they are such music experts. I know what I like but know I'm no musical expert.

What they did and how they developed in such a short space of time was extraordinary though. Probably comparable to the Beach Boys.

I don't find Yesterday, Let it be, Something or While my guitar gently weeps, for example, passionless at all.

Some of it is. Not so much the Paul stuff IMO

Paul is wrongly vilified, because of the 1980s ‘Cult of Lennon’ after he died. Paul wrote Yesterday, Eleanor Rigby, Hey Jude. He is not ‘worse’ than Lennon, they worked together and in opposition to each other.

I'm a massive music lover with very wide ranging tastes and I've always been surprised by just how cold the Beatles have always left me. I think because they dont really have any tunes/melodies I can think of that really "grip you by the heart". There's a specific part in Strawberry Fields that does it for me and thats about it.
Compare them to Queen... Now Queen for me are truly something incredible. Insanely catchy, heartfelt, wide ranging. The beatles are overrated IMO but they were pioneers and you cant take that away from them. But yeah they've always struck me as soulless to listen to

I watched a documentary recently, might have been Sky, How the Beatles changed the World, or something like that. The more I learn about them, the more Im fascinated with their musciality and genius.

I enjoyed the film Yesterday but I remember coming out of the cinema thinking it missed the whole point somewhat - it wasn’t “just” the good songs that made the Beatles what they were, it was everything. The clothes, the hair, their looks, their personalities, their voices, the performances, the crowds at their shows. A random bloke singing the Long and Winding Road at the piano wouldn’t have had quite the same impact I don’t think.

The section about John Lennon in Yesterday also made me cry.

Interesting, as I find Queen utterly soulless. They are, with a few exceptions, instant turn off the radio for me. But, I do appreciate that that they are talented.

Before my time but I don’t see what the fuss is. I can honestly say there’s not one Beatles song I like. I suppose you had to be there at the time.

I was born in 1962 so they were there when I was growing up.
I've never understood their "greatness" and don't like any of their songs.

The White Queen? Nevermore? Love of My Life? Drowse?

Away from the big radio stuff each member of Queen wrote some really fabulous music.

And even among the more popular tunes, what about Who Wants To Live Forever ans Too Much Love Will Kill You?

Sorry, they don't move me.

Thats fair enough. It is interesting like you say how music moves us differently. There's got to be some science behind it 😂

I mean, I only know the hits because I've never liked them enough to investigate them anymore. It's fine other people liking them, they're clearly talented but they don't move me.

I dont like the Beatles, never have. I recognise their songs are iconic but I find them childish and repetitive

They have stood the test of time for 60 years which is a long time in pop music terms.

If you watch Get Back you will see how Paul was the work horse of the band but also his ability to hear and create songs in the moment is just extraordinary. They evolved their music in such a short time (they were only active for a very few years compared to other very famous bands) and in that time spanned such a lot of styles, genres and influences.

To me they were amazing.

I think a lot of people say they don’t like any Beatles songs because they perhaps only know the songs that always get trotted out. Try Here There and Everywhere, And Your Bird Can Sing, For No-One, Across the Universe - they have SO many different styles

And Your Bird Can Sing is my favourite Beatles song, Revolver my favourite album. Having stuck up for Macca, it’s actually a Lennon one

I first heard them when I was 14 at my Aunts house. The band has split by then . My Aunt had several albums and I was alone for the afternoon. I just played them one after another and was completely and utterly sold. I've loved them ever since. I've read everything ever written about them and never stopped feeling the same way as when I first heard them. To me they are the greatest band that ever was . I don't like Paul's solo stuff much with some exceptions. Or much of John Lennons solo stuff. Their magic was created together.