Edinburgh council defying the law

[SwirlyGates]

I know this was mentioned in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own.

"John Swinney has been left humiliated as his SNP councillors in Edinburgh voted to allow men into female toilets and changing rooms."

https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/john-swinney-humiliated-snp-edinburgh-37353610

Why are our elected representatives so determined to break the law, and will this be another case women have to take to court? (And pay for twice, yet again, through taxes and crowdfunders). The Herald claims, as of 20th June, the cost to tax payers so far is £766,000. www.heraldscotland.com/news/26210672.trans-prison-law-clear-will-john-swinney-now-listen/

"Why are our elected representatives so determined to break the law, and will this be another case women have to take to court?"

As we know, they are convinced that they are on TRSOH. So yes, I fully expect more court cases will be needed due to this.

Thanks for the link, I can't see how we can reach any other conclusion than the system of government in this country has completely broken down.

Where did elected officials get the impression that they can vote on whether or not to follow the law of the land

Is every person who puts themselves forward to be elected in this country the scrapings on the bottom of a very manky barrel. 🤯

I initially thought the SNP were pushing gender ideology for cynical reasons - to differentiate Scotland as being "more liberal" than England as part of the push for independence

But polling shows that the general Scottish population doesn't agree with gender ideology, so this position could lose them votes

So presumably they genuinely think they are on TRSOH??

Agree. What is the point of there being laws and paying MPs vast amounts to sit scrutinising and working all this out, if a group of ill informed activists with a lot of passion, a lot of hobby horses and very little sense or balance, can just vote to say fuck the law, we're imposing this?

Why should anyone bother following the law in these cirumstances?

Edited to add: as per usual there's a lot of emotive virtue signalling about GI, and no mention at all of women, women's needs and issues, the costs and exclusion for them or their struggles, so there's not even a passing attempt at equality. Next court case slam dunk already, more costs to the tax payer, and yet they just keep on going.

But what will happen? They can ask for the guidance to be withdrawn as much as they like it doesn’t change the law. Are they saying council buildings, libraries etc will all allow men into women’s facilities in defiance of the law? Because that is surely a slam dunk legal case against them

So they are willing to use tax payer's money to fight the incoming wave of legal cases? There really is no logic.

I think that some really do believe that we are essentially evil and that they are on the side of the angels.

This includes those with children who identify as trans. As Joyce pointed out, if you have gone along with your child having extreme body modifications in the name of gender identity, how can you ever admit that you were wrong? No, they are 'good people who wanted the best for their child', and they will fight any doubt by all means possible.

There are also males who don't want to give up their privileges and/or fantasy of being a true and honest woman.

Also, the group that bought into gender being gay rights mark II. They thought that supporting this made them 'a good person'. They didn't think critically about it, so admitting that they were wrong is not going to be easy, as it means destabilising the idea that they are a good person. I know someone in this group. They actually stated that they thought that believing X, Y and Z (the list of progressive causes) would actually cause them to be a good person. So believing the right stuff makes you good. Again, no actual thought was put into whether the list was utter guff or not.

With some politicians, backing down now will be inconceivable. They staked all on this. I also think there is an element of the in-group feeling like they know better than the plebs. I think this is manifested in some politicians, and also the lanyard class. This has been exposed in both the Paggie and the Darlington Nurses cases.

TLDR: More court cases will happen as some people cannot back down from their position for various reasons.

From the article (and I haven't seen others), it looks like they are planning on two things - firstly, to allow males into women's toilets on council premises, and secondly, to object to the EHRC guidelines.

"Greens councillor Alex Staniforth led the charge," well he would, wouldn't he. Apparently he identifies as non-binary (which I have only just discovered, because after all who would know?) Anyway, he wanted to defund Edinburgh Women’s Aid due to them excluding males from their women-only provision. There is the usual hyperbole, this time from SNP Lesley Macinnes, about "rhetoric and attitudes which have questioned the right of trans people to exist.”

The Tories objected, but of course they are in a minority.

There is a misunderstanding in the article though, which says, "The SNP, Scottish Green and Scottish Lib Dems combined to win this vote and force the Labour council leader to write to the UK Government to demand the guidelines are scrapped. They make it illegal for men to use toilets, changing rooms and service which are female-only." But of course, it's not the guidelines that make it illegal, it's the Supreme Court judgement that clarifies the law and says this is illegal, regardless of whether the guidelines are passed or not.

Yes, slam dunk legal case against the council if they go ahead with this - but someone would have to bring a case.

Incidentally, I notice that the Scottish Daily Express has this article under "News > Politics > Women's Rights" rather than something "trans". Well done them.

https://x.com/treesey/status/2070238051498926087?s=46&t=ZX_bLozRqm8etdGICMcAvA

I did see this on X which came from the meeting. Zoe (there is no hiding what sex he is), seems to think there are 10’s of thousands of transgender people in the area (which is questionable) but does beg the question if there are so many then why haven’t they set up specific services for them instead of trying to squeeze them into services set up for women? It seems like the typical argument - segregation based on sex (wrong) segregation based on self identified gender absolutely fine.

Aren’t they aware the Scottish government has just lost a court case on allowing men in prisons? How can people be this stupid!

A. They must be aware.
B. No idea how they are this stupid.

Also, the group that bought into gender being gay rights mark II. They thought that supporting this made them 'a good person'.

Yes.

I do enjoy reminding people that this is about gay rights, which also cannot exist without the EqA being followed, as explained by the SCJ. They may loathe and despise women and be very comfortable openly trying to destroy women's rights, but there's no point in waving their credentials about how lovely they are as an LGBT+ ally, when they're working on destroying gay protections and rights in law.

There need to be consequences for individuals in the public sector for pushing things they know to be wrong. Spending taxpayers’ money on court case after court case, losing, and then continuing in employment is starting to look unacceptable. Particularly when they keep losing on the same issues.

If local councillors incur unauthorised or illegal expenditure, can't they be personally surcharged by the district auditor, like the Clay Cross councillors in Derbyshire in 1973?

They ended up being made personally bankrupt.

Or does the Scottish legal system just turn a blind eye to such behaviour?