NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #15

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks although once it was in to the second week it was looking like this would not happen. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

However, as a result of problems with the livestreaming, apparently, as a result of a very large number of observers, remote public access to the hearing was suspended on Tuesday 11 February. It was suggested that it might be reinstated at some point but don't count on it.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11
Thread 12: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272276-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-12
Thread 13: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272398-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-13
Thread 14: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272939-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-14

That will be in the Datix report from Christmas Eve and the email from Kate Searle.

He didn’t report the taking obs in the resus room incident at the time it happened.

We will have to wait for KS to explain her statement.

Probably already drafted in August!

Am sure most are aware, but the crowdfunded for SP is over £20000!

Fear not @Zebracat I really don't think a few months is enough time for NHS Fife to get their act together, sadly.

What an absolute shitshow. Thanks again to everyone for the updates. It just gets more and more ridiculous to the point I actually can't even bear to think about it never mind try to write anything coherent. How can all these educated people be so properly stupid?

@RedToothBrush But WHAT a treasure trove from which to select! And now 5 months or so to perfect the closing. What a time to be alive 😉.

In all seriousness, I sincerely hope that NC and SP can take some time to relax and work through the presumably inevitable frustration and despair that accompanies being so thoroughly gaslit (special shout-out to DU's working definition of "aggressive" which apparently comprises someone speaking to him in a calm manner about something he believed they had thought about and rehearsed in advance. Fascinating.)

I hope one day they can find a funny side to all this. I think it's one of the few ways to adequately buttress one's mental health against it!

To add to the resuss discussion he could not enlighten anybody to the date of alleged incident. He said between October and December, in his complaint.

Which meant the investigation could not match the shared shifts and pinpoint date, as too vague.

SP had identified this event in the investigation as Halloween night and it involved a child who ate a snickers and had a reaction.

Upton then claimed that was a separate event, and not the one he was talking about.

I find it impossible to believe that the investigation could not nail down what shifts they were on together throughout the period and what incidences of breathing issues involved either or both of them.

His oral evidence never suggested an actual resuscitation event, seem KS either added that in or it was what he later claimed.

Was Kate Searle's statement discussed in the first days of the trial?

DU empathy - from what I've read on here never in a zillion years will that man have empathy for anyone.

Entitled, smarmy, £v#&-*!/

I too am curious as to when this was referenced in court. The Times article refers to a 'statement' from KS. I'm curious as to what led to her making this statement and who the intended audience was.

Just me that thinks no matter what way this goes it will end up in the Court of Appeal?

And potentially blow all the TWAW stuff into next century? (Or I sincerely hope not put an end to single sex spaces)

He did not report the resuss incident until later on it was not on the datix report

Kate snarl circulated an e mail about the hate crime at the time, but not a najour incident.

I think that last part of your post crosses a line and is uncalled for.

I find it impossible to believe that the investigation could not nail down what shifts they were on together throughout the period and what incidences of breathing issues involved either or both of them.

His oral evidence never suggested an actual resuscitation event, seem KS either added that in or it was what he later claimed.

The way KS's evidence is reported, it sounds as though her understanding was that SP stopped resuscitating a child because DU entered the resus. Surely if she thought that, she would have taken immediate action?!

I'd like to say a big thank you to everyone involved in these threads. I've not been able to read them in full butwhat I have seen has given me a real feel for what has been happening and the analysis is incredibly useful. So thank you.

With regard to the judge saying victim (and bear in mind I've not been following properly) could it simply be that they were discussing an incident where DU was in the victim role? It doesn't mean he believes it, just that it is standard phrasing. I could be completely wrong though!

Do you feel this is now ordinary behaviour for men?

From the times article: 'stopped doing resus' is so damning and appears to be untrue.
where did the times get this quote?

They attribute it to KS (Searle's) statement.

I've no idea of what the statement is, to whom it was made or when. I doubt I'm alone in that.

I'm just wondering how they've seen KS's statement....

Newspapers have mostly been using the most flattering photos of Dr Upton. I have not been watching the tribunal live, so having more photos from different angles is informative.

Clothes, make-up and earrings do not maketh woman.

witness statement - in the bundle

To be fair to the GMC, they've taken their cue from the GRA, which allows people to change their birth certificates. State-sanctioned rewriting of history.

What was it Orwell wrote about controlling the past....

You are man yourself, yes? The women of this board are well aware of the proclivities of the male sex and it is a very rare woman that has never been harassed or assaulted by a man at some point in her life. There is a hell of a lot of life experience here, you don’t need to tell us what men are like. We Know.

On this board we are held to a higher standard of posting behaviour, thanks in part to the report happy “board monitors” who like to take screen shots and tell the world how transphobic MN is. As a result we don’t speculate about the motives of someone like Dr Upton and pejorative words like “deviant” are not acceptable.

Well if he did report it, which he claimed in todays hearing and she did not do anything her registration is also on the line.

So i think we can conclude who the liar is.