NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #11

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks although at the start of the second week getting everything done in this time period was looking less certain. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10

I get the feeling that we are watching filibustering, in a way. The longer your answer, the less questions you can be asked and the more the issue is stalled. It seems NC sees that also.

NC - my task is extraordinarily hampered by JR's interventions. We will go v slowly

Judge - that's how litigation works

Same not sure whether to log in

I can't stand I know this man's views and they are legitimised by institutions and laws

Maybe Naomi should have objected more to Russell's cross examination.

To save my cushions, I need some chewy sweeties to gnash at.

Judge - we've gone as far as we can, let's get on with it.

I feel strong case could be made for an appeal if this does not go in favour of SP.

Well the judge has nailed his colours to the mast there hasn’t he.

bring on the appeal

Grow some balls Judge. Tell JR to STFU. Coward.

I think that first judge was a bit ridiculous in saying that anyone would think he was female.

NC - do you agree that it will be obvious to most patients that you are male, in A&E some who are drunk, on drugs, in pain, with eye injuries, for whom it won't be obvious

BU - someone's ability to see someone as trans isn't based on being drunk or intoxicated. Your perceptiosn inhibited by ocular injury, distress, drunkness doens't damage ability to see if someone is trans or not. I don't consider male to encompass transwomen don't agree it's obvious to most that I'm male.

NC asks about patient's perception of sex

DU goes on and on about whether people can 'recognise someone is trans'.

No, dude, it's about your SEX.

Oh dear judge - what about being impartial to both sides hmm?

Yes, the judge has made his position quite clear hasn't he I think.

Still the same. I'm trying to connect as an observer, is that correct? Don't want to be on camera.

He's just said he'll hide his sex from female patients.

He doesn't think he needs to tell patients he is male.

NC - you feel no oblgation to disclose your sex to a woman who's asked for a female doc

BU -not appropriate ot reveal personal history to any patient - sexual history, age, sexuality - has no bearing on my ability to care

Yes.

Desperately trying to keep up....and remain employed....

Lady voice is back this morning. Let’s see how long it lasts.

I'm absolutely astounded by his delusion. Surely he can't possibly believe this is true.

Is that his parents sitting behind him?

The arrogance of this man is astounding

DU: I don't think it's appropriate to disclose any private information about myself with a patient

in response to NC: Will you disclose your trans status to a woman who's asked for single sex care.

He's really done it now, he's admitted he'll deceive patients.