Why do all trans discussions end in a bun fight?

[Name5]

I have a natal daughter who is a young adult. I try to keep an open dialogue with her as her thoughts are changing as she gets older.
She is not causing any discord to anyone. I try to help when desparate parents ask simple questions about their LGBTQ DC ( this week it was about getting a job). Within a few hours there are big fights re toilets and rape crisis centres. Yes these things are horrifying but every bloody thread gets high jacked with these points of law. There should be a subject category for parents of adult trans people. This would allow issues to be discussed without the OP being subjected to accusations of ideology or affirmation. I don't believe my DD is better as a male persona but I can't and won't bully her to accept my feelings override hers. She's still my DC and all subjects are open to reasonable and lawful discussion. MNHQ can you please list a new category so people don't feel attacked and bullied?

You don't need a new category.

But also this is a public forum. You cannot demand that people agree with you - you need to accept all points of view as long as they are not deemed offensive.

I believe there is a 'parents of LGBTQ' board that might work for you.

But Feminism, Sex and Gender - that's telling you what it is.

Just to confirm there is a LGBT board within 'being a parent' which seems to be what you are looking for.

@Ohfuckrucksack thank you but it is for children.

There's also 'parents of adult children'

Thank you.

>She is not causing any discord to anyone.

This is your belief. My daughter who has a short haired Charlie in her year would vehemently disagree with you by what I've overheard in her friend chatter.

So yes the other parents, like me, will pipe up with the reactions of the "other" kids to challenge this blanket assumption.

So yes it isn't going to be without friction... and if mumsnet ran a "safe space " then women would have no space to challenge anything. Safe spaces spread like a virus.

I prefer the best of vipers. Sometimes I do get bit. And sometimes there's a frenzy and I forget who I'm biting and why. But I do like that it's not a hive mind.

But most of us stay here... so you should have an easier ride on the other boards... maybe. But you can't demand it. You're not entitled to an easier ride. No one is really...

Long... maybe I'd been thinking about this too.

Hold on, you've come to the Feminism and Women's Rights board and are expecting us to not discuss and full-on argue out issues with toilets and rape crisis centres?! Discussing in the wrong way? Should we be kinder perhaps?!
"Yes these things are horrifying but every bloody thread gets high jacked with these points of law."
Don't demean "these things" - they are not "bun fights" or "trans discussions". These are our hills we are all fighting for and dying on!
"There should be a subject category for parents of adult trans people."
Then why don't you find or create one? Off you pop.
"but I can't and won't bully her to accept my feelings override hers."
Bully her? Your feelings? Just stick to basic facts!

It's a bun fight because it speaks to people's core values and core values are what we defend the hardest.

On the FWR board, the core value is feminism.

“I don't believe my DD is better as a male persona but I can't and won't bully her to accept my feelings override hers.”

See, I can help you there…She is still your dd. The ‘male persona’ is a fiction. People can’t change sex. All facts, not feelings. HTH

Why are you posting about this in Feminism?

hmmmm

What actually happened is that most people told you that if your daughter walks into an interview and announces themselves as a card carrying ideologist, people will endeavour not to hire her.

I think op has gone through a lot with her child, I've seen previous threads, and I wouldn't like to deal with it.

It must be so, so difficult as you must want to be there for your own child no matter what.

That said, you can't expect strangers on the internet to feel the same, and certainly not the women on these boards. You won't know what they've dealt with either.

Why don't you ask on Site Stuff for a new category if you need one.

I saw that thread on AIBU most posters were honest about the fact that anyone going into an interview espousing irrelevant personal beliefs of any kind, especially controversial ones that can be particularly divisive is going to be viewed as "not a team player" and aa such won't get hired.
Why that thread in AIBU has caused @Name5 to come over to the feminism board to lecture us over people's honest opinions and truthful answers to her question is a mystery though

Try 'Site stuff'. Nobody here can create a new board for you and MN only read posts/threads if they are reported.

Also: I'm sorry your DD is struggling, it must be very hard. I hope she finds a way through.

The thread about getting a job wasn’t OP’s. OP said she tries to help on threads like that.

Unfortunately, while your DD isn’t actively harming anyone, genderism is actively harming many people. Arguably all women, especially vulnerable or religious ones. Children, particularly those who end up with surgery and drugs on their previous healthy bodies. Anyone who needs a single sex space or wants to do competitive sport.

I've always assumed "parents of lgbt children" included adult children.

The reason it ends in a bunfight is because there's no middle ground that everyone agrees on. Eg, Feminists suggest 3rd spaces, TRAs say no.

And women are, rightly, angry because our rights are literally at risk.

Because you can't reason with crazy.

OP there is already a board just for that purpose.

I have to add my voice in saying that while you don’t believe your child is causing discord, they are. I do hope though that you, your daughter and all your family get the mental health support that you need.

However, asking people to be kind and to not speak out about the negative impacts that even someone who thinks they are not causing impacts is very unreasonable. Just the language demands alone that one person makes of others is unreasonable. What other groups in society are allowed to make those demands just based on philosophical belief?

And asking on this board is not appropriate although maybe you did not intend to cause offense.

Other people are entitled to express themselves, and entitled to state the truth. I don't know what posts specifically you're referring to but no, women will not stop speaking of our concerns. I don't know about anyone else, but my days of sacrificing MY peace of mind and MY safety and MY privacy for some unknown gender-addled kid are long over.
You have no right to try to coerce me into acting against my own interests.

Because MN is renowned for being a hotbed of transphobia. It’s where people congregate and it’s given air time.

I try to help when desparate parents ask simple questions about their LGBTQ DC ( this week it was about getting a job).

That was an AIBU thread I think, wasn't it?

I know your situation is complex, because I’ve been in it. But I came here to this board because I felt strongly that my young person was reacting to unresolved issues in their life, and could potentially heap a whole load of new issues on top. I learnt so much about pronouns , Pride, binders and blockers and hormones and surgery and queer theory, and Stonewall, and Mermaids, and so so much more and it helped me crystallise my thinking. But if you think the people on this board are having a bunfight, my guess is that the parents of lgbt children board may be a better fit. They can’t actually be children because we aren’t supposed to attribute adult stuff like sexuality to children, or so I believed.
I think it could be very useful if you started explicitly, a support thread for parents of gender questioning people. Contributors are expected to be supportive on support threads. Of course, there will still be different approaches, but it may be that in a less polarised environment, you could learn from each other.
But do be careful on the FWR board. It’s very precious to us, despite regular scoldings and condemnation, it’s been a safe space for gender critical feminists. It’s a huge mistake to assume that we have not been directly affected by these issues, or that we want to bully you into behaving in a certain way with your child. But you will be challenged on the “they just want to live their life” argument because they don’t. Trans and non binary people demand that everyone else pretends that people can choose their sex, or be no sex. They have endangered children and young people caught up in it.They have changed language , they have ruined womens single sex provision in sport, health care, prisons. They have led to rape survivors being refused support and called bigots. This is hurting women, in all sorts of ways. And we will keep saying so.

There's a parents of adult children thread, and lgbtqia+thread, a mental health thread. And the thread you mention about the non binary person struggling to find a job was on AIBU. And actually it was one of the kindest AIBUs I've seen in a while. Usually it's grotesque on there but most people were pretty sensible.
Feminism Sex and Gender is not the right place to come for affirmation of genderism. (though I am sorry your DD is struggling. It's heartbreaking seeing your child suffer)

If it was the 'to think that non binary candidates are more unlikely to be offered a job' thread, then yes, it was on the AIBU board, not the FWR Board.