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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Why do all trans discussions end in a bun fight?

290 replies

Name5 · 27/09/2024 18:53

I have a natal daughter who is a young adult. I try to keep an open dialogue with her as her thoughts are changing as she gets older.
She is not causing any discord to anyone. I try to help when desparate parents ask simple questions about their LGBTQ DC ( this week it was about getting a job). Within a few hours there are big fights re toilets and rape crisis centres. Yes these things are horrifying but every bloody thread gets high jacked with these points of law. There should be a subject category for parents of adult trans people. This would allow issues to be discussed without the OP being subjected to accusations of ideology or affirmation. I don't believe my DD is better as a male persona but I can't and won't bully her to accept my feelings override hers. She's still my DC and all subjects are open to reasonable and lawful discussion. MNHQ can you please list a new category so people don't feel attacked and bullied?

OP posts:
Hairyesterdaygonetoday · 30/09/2024 01:05

WaitingForMojo · 28/09/2024 08:45

I can understand it, and I went to Cambridge, thank you.
I don’t see this attitude as being pro-women. At all. I’m a woman and it certainly isn’t my cause.

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But can you see that it affects, and harms, many other women? And that feminists, by definition, want to prevent harm to women?

Hairyesterdaygonetoday · 30/09/2024 02:11

Runningupthecurtains · 28/09/2024 17:05

Back in the day I spent every Friday and Saturday night in a club full of men with long hair and 'guy liner' who wore silk shirts blouses. None of them got attacked in the street or shouted at for the way they dressed.

Gender boundaries were being broken down and we were reaching a point where while a man in a skirt was still a talking point (see David Beckham's sarong etc) it wasn't a thing that lead to assault.

If that trajectory had continued we would probably now be at the same stage that women wearing trousers were in 1930's or 40's but the progress was totally derailed by an ideology that insisted that a man who wears a skirt must be a woman rather than a bloke in a skirt. This despite that fact that women now wear trousers more often than not. We were moving forward in breaking down gender stereotypes until the TRAs arrived and slammed the whole thing into reverse.

Now we are told some men are 'better' women than actual women because they are rigid conformers to outmoded ideas of what a woman should wear, how a woman should behave and what a woman should do.

I wish we lived in the world I enjoyed on the 90s and your son could walk down the street with long hair and makeup without attracting hate.

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Yes, those outdated sex stereotypes were quietly fading away, with until transgenderism suddenly slammed this very welcome movement into reverse.

I am still stunned by the way decades of progress were overturned by a fierce but tiny minority demanding obeisance to an ideology nobody really believes. And most bizarre of all, this me-centred ultra-liberal ideology is backed by people who claim to be left-wing.

Grammarnut · 30/09/2024 09:03

DrBlackbird · 29/09/2024 19:58

Okay @anyolddinosaur yes she made that one comment, true but we don’t always perfectly express our thoughts in a single post. Her other posts go on to talk about others equating those hobbies to male interests. Plus, we might all occasionally fall into the trap of labelling some traits as male or female. I catch myself falling into this trap sometimes anyhow.

My DD had a manny and I guess she equated certain sports and hobbies with boys.
**
so she's been told.
Cobblers to that. Ditto her interest in cars
**
its interesting that some view hobbies as male or female. My DD likes marvel, speaks Japanese and loves film. She is also a computer wizz. At boarding school she caused a rumpus for refusing basic cookery classes (my dad taught her to cook as a three year old, she didn't see the need to make scones! ) and she was sanctioned for wearing trousers.

It seemed to me that in those other posts the OP is agreeing that it’s crazy that her DDs interests were being labelled as male ones and agreeing that was part of the problem. And seemed to me that the OP was being given a harder time than warranted.

My opinion anyway.

I was more curious that OP's DD had learned all about cooking at 3. Scones are nice - and quite difficult to make (unless you like quoits with cheese in).😊

frenchnoodle · 30/09/2024 09:16

What is a Manny?

MarieDeGournay · 30/09/2024 09:18

frenchnoodle · 30/09/2024 09:16

What is a Manny?

A nanny who is a man.

Helleofabore · 30/09/2024 09:39

Grammarnut · 30/09/2024 09:03

I was more curious that OP's DD had learned all about cooking at 3. Scones are nice - and quite difficult to make (unless you like quoits with cheese in).😊

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i thought that was pretty common to be fair. At 3, mine was making their own pikelets and mini muffins with supervision. Probably helped that my MIL was a home ec teacher to be fair.

Grammarnut · 30/09/2024 10:16

Helleofabore · 30/09/2024 09:39

i thought that was pretty common to be fair. At 3, mine was making their own pikelets and mini muffins with supervision. Probably helped that my MIL was a home ec teacher to be fair.

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Do you mean dealing with batter on a hot griddle? Wow!

MarieDeGournay · 30/09/2024 10:25

Luxury! At 3 we were mining our own iron ore to make the griddles...
sorry couldn't resistGrin

anyolddinosaur · 30/09/2024 10:59

@DrBlackbird If someone suggested I was reinforcing gender stereotypes and I didnt intend that I would not claim their post was abusive. I might say read my other posts, I agreed that it's silly to label hobbies.

Why do you think OP started claiming "abuse" when it was not?

Helleofabore · 30/09/2024 11:17

Grammarnut · 30/09/2024 10:16

Do you mean dealing with batter on a hot griddle? Wow!

Edited
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Yep. We was hard task masters. Made them push the chairs up to the stove on their own and all!!

of course, they were assisted. And of course, they were supervised.

Helleofabore · 30/09/2024 11:19

MarieDeGournay · 30/09/2024 10:25

Luxury! At 3 we were mining our own iron ore to make the griddles...
sorry couldn't resistGrin

Nah, but we would send our kid up the chimney to sweep it.

Strangely most of my family are miners, now that you mention it.

ArabellaScott · 30/09/2024 11:22

MarieDeGournay · 30/09/2024 09:18

A nanny who is a man.

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In NE Scotland, it's just a 'man'. And a woman is a 'wifie'.

Grammarnut · 30/09/2024 17:56

Helleofabore · 30/09/2024 11:17

Yep. We was hard task masters. Made them push the chairs up to the stove on their own and all!!

of course, they were assisted. And of course, they were supervised.

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I am impressed. That's serious cookery. Well done!

Helleofabore · 30/09/2024 21:03

Grammarnut · 30/09/2024 17:56

I am impressed. That's serious cookery. Well done!

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They loved it. That was the thing.

They would cook everyday if we let them then. Now as a late teen? Forget it. Even though they are an excellent cook. 😉

DrBlackbird · 30/09/2024 23:12

anyolddinosaur · 30/09/2024 10:59

@DrBlackbird If someone suggested I was reinforcing gender stereotypes and I didnt intend that I would not claim their post was abusive. I might say read my other posts, I agreed that it's silly to label hobbies.

Why do you think OP started claiming "abuse" when it was not?

Yes as I mentioned, I’m often impressed how calm some FWR posters remain in light of emotional accusations. How they engage seriously and refute/discuss point by point. Other posters can be more reactive/sensitive/defensive when feeling under attack. For example, I think the OP was already feeling on the defensive and I’m not sure what the point in starting the thread was, but also there has been some criticism of the OP on this thread, which, in my opinion, was not wholly warranted. I get that others disagree and that the OP hasn’t come back to clarify.

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