Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 11

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.
You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:
AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)

To come?

Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, to continue on 25th May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge.
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing

He is coming across as a liar.

So basically he thinks anything that centres women and children - fighting for women's rights, for example, is 'anti-trans'. Also anything that centres gay people is 'anti-trans' too. It can LITERALLY not mention transpeople AT ALL and it can be 'anti-trans'.

I wish BC would ask if it's legitimate to exclude transpeople from anything? Can anyone organise about anything without transpeople being specifically included? I'm guessing not.

I'm guessing he'd consider our local speed-bump advocacy 'anti-trans' because we don't specifically centre transpeople.

I'm guessing safeguarding of children is definitely 'anti-trans' based on his answers so far.

I can't see the screen so feel free to ignore me and obviously scratching your arse support animal in public is unacceptable, but let's not fidget shame (only half joking as I'm a fidgeter and I know it annoys people but I can't help it)

Did he swear or affirm? I assume he's also heathen. I think he's the first male presenting witness (or WTF one can ID him as) not to wear a tie.

theemperorhasnoclothes · Today 12:04

Yes, The cotton ceiling workshop is all about the not accepting the 'no'. A clear no shouldn't be up for fucking debate and if it is that's rape culture right there. It's so bloody tiresome.

Obviously I agree completely, but I would go further. Not accepting the "no" is horrific. But in the case of a TWs and lesbians I would argue that even asking the question is horrific. If someone identifies as a lesbian and you are not a woman then they have clearly and unambiguously told you that they would never consent to sex with you. To even ask the question, let alone get disappointed with a "no", is coercive / rapey / conversion thereapy-y / rank / disgusting / homophobic / misogynstic etc etc etc.

We should sent a tweet with a massive trans banner at the top saying that we support trans rights.

TW agrees and says this is a neutral statement.

Pompous arse

Yes, they just have this unassailable certainty that they're superior to everyone else. It's odious.

This is an insight to what it must've been like in the Middle Ages if you believed in the wrong religion. Talking of heathens.

Making a long speech =/= answering the question

Pompous pinwormy arse!

I've just joined in my lunch break - TomW isn't coming across well I wonder how AH will attempt to reclaim ground in his cross?

After the designated time after doing your degree has elapsed, you can fill out the form and pay the fee. Even go to the bash. It seems to be a money making exercise on behalf of the colleges. You buy the MA. Trinity College Dublin have this too.

However, it does seem rather pretentious to use it professionally.

How does BC stay so calm!

Good grief, what an obnoxious man.

And reference to being on holiday - is that on the bingo card?

From what it sounds like reading this thread, his support animal lives up his arse, next to his head

Is it just me or is TW an unsufferably arrogant little shit?

I use mine professionally but I drop the Cantab 😉

I think he's the first male presenting witness (or WTF one can ID him as) not to wear a tie

Yes considering he's a barrister it's a bit casual isn't it?

TW really doesn't wasn't to say "we're not Ant-Trans"

Did anyone else notice how he bit his tongue?

What's the Mumsnet mention? I must have missed it (occasionally give work a glance :D)

MHL turned up in a T-shirt the first day but she's not a barrister, despite having the best name for it.

In defence of my alma mater there were men like this but even 40 years ago they were a small % and everybody saw what they were.

Twitter storm! House!

I think it's just because his physical squirming is representative of his verbal squirming and builds a picture of him not being straightforward or honest.