Janice Turner- the US left is harming the pro-choice cause

[DomesticatedZombie]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-us-left-is-harming-the-pro-choice-cause-8fv6pkzjm

An interesting and level-headed look at the issue in the US over abortion rights and 'progressive' politics.

This article was fantastic, really nails the important points 👏

The US is ten years behind the UK in understanding the consequences of what the gender identity religion actually intends to do. Most lefties are just trying to be kind, but feminist organisations have been taken over.

This is an opinion piece posted two days ago on NOW's website (an old and important organization for women historically speaking, the acronym standing for National Organization For Women).

Ahem Domesticated - it's the excellent Janice Turner who wrote this.

Womens right to abortion is being erroded to the point of non existence in 26 states. And you link to this nonsense right wing BS. You are no feminist. Aligning yourself with the Aunts. Shocking!

Ach, Jesus lord above, apologies! I'll report my post. My name-blindness is getting worse.

Don't worry I have reported your post already.

Was prepared to overlook the lie that states are banning teabswomen from sport- they've not, they are banning them from participating in opposite sex teams. Got as far as TWAW and couldn't take anymore.

I don't know if I would say ten years. I'm hoping that things in the US will move more swiftly than they have here. We have the UK, Sweden and other countries already hashing out the issues in courts, I'm sure these are noticed over the pond. And the WoLF and others are making good ground.

I think what makes a huge difference is the media, and I don't have a great awareness of the US media landscape.

Thank you MNHQ for changing Janice's name.

Wtaf. Abortion rights have zero to do with this. Unless you are with those who want all rights to be eroded. Again we see those who are supposedly feminist aligning with those who errode womens rights.

She's not wrong, not in terms of politics on the ground. If Democrats try to push for the kind of total deregulation which is the only approach the pro-choice lobby will accept now, they will create a significant backlash. The face of that is something like Dr Goswell which was completely horrifying for most people, even apart from the shitty medical practice element.

Politically it's foolish.

Had not heard of Dr Goswell, Mangy. Christ.

It strikes me that if abortion is banned and criminalized then even more girls are going to see their bodies as an enemy of their humanity and opt out of puberty and into mastectomies and sterilisation.

With the American TRA and left-liberal emphasis on changing the individual rather than changing the world, I can honestly see women who haven't adopted any form of trans identity becoming a kind of third class of women. First class will be trans women - all the benefits of male privilege + fun, sassy, feminine and up for it, and never going to piss off their employer/boyfriend/sports career by getting pregnant. Second class will be trans men, who no-one will genuinely think are men but they will be given some credit for showing iniative in attempting to prove they have brains, abilities and humanity by trying to become one. Third class will be plain, boring women, who didn't use their agency to opt out of becoming a plain, boring woman so they can't complain about becoming a breeder and carer and grunt-worker, and in fact (unlike the special people) they and their Mumsnetty brains probably identify with it.

I can honestly see women who haven't adopted any form of trans identity becoming a kind of third class of women.

I always thought there was scope for a version of the Handmaid’s Tale where the Wives were all trans, hence the demand for Handmaids.

Share token if anyone wants it

@Namechangedforgoodreason
What are you on about? I said I tried to read the article from NOW and couldn't finish it as soon as it started the TWAW line. How does that suddenly make me a right wing anti abortionist? I can see you are passionate about this but please stop misreading people's posts and going for the jugular. I spent years campaigning in Ireland to have the Eigth ammendment removed and to allow women to have autonomy over our own bodies. I know what it is like to live in a country that says a foetus has equal legal rights as an adult woman and all that tgat entails, including stopping a 13 year old rape victim from leaving the state to have a termination. I know what it us like to live in a country where one religious group assumes they have the right to police the morals and ethics of all, even those to don't proscribe to their misogynistic views. Please stop seeing enemies in everyone.

Thanks, NotBad, for the token, I've never quite worked out how to do those.

A situation like this, for example?

My favourite line
There is a bun in someone’s oven, and we own that bun,” said Brian cheerily.

www.irishexaminer.com/lifestyle/people/arid-40866722.html

At the top of the article click the little envelope to share via email. It should open up an email with the link in it. Carefully copy the link making sure your copying starts just at the https part (after the 2nd BR). Then paste the link here.

And I will also say that the single reason I subscribed to the Times in the first place is Janice Turner.

Christ. A baby is a ‘bun’ and a woman is an ‘oven’.
Is the all-hallowed sperm still sperm or is that called ‘icing’?

It was the air of 'my property' that got to me the most. I want something therefore I have a right to it and if you stop me then you are a bigot.

I knew this was around somewhere. Everyday Feminism is a misogynist site with a deceptive name. This article talks about ‘trans mothers’ becoming ‘pregnant with [their] viable sperm’ as if the woman who would provide the egg & carry the baby simply doesn’t exist. It’s chilling.
everydayfeminism.com/2015/11/trans-women-reproductive-justice/

Bloody hell. Just read about Dr Gosnell. Absolutely horrific and does not make for easy reading. Banning abortion though will lead to more women being harmed by backstreet abortionists as it did in the years before abortion was legal here.