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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Video: Benjamin Boyce talks to Helen Joyce and Stephanie Davies-Arai

24 replies

ScreamingMeMe · 30/04/2022 13:55

Enjoy 😀

OP posts:
MrsOvertonsWindow · 30/04/2022 15:57

Thank you Screaming. I've just spent an enjoyable hour sitting in the sun and listening to these two wonderful women talking. Benjamin Boyce is such a good interviewer (not that it was difficult with these two) and the conversation just flowed.
Highly recommended.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 30/04/2022 16:11

Excellent discussion. HJ is quite right that BB stepped aside to let the discussion happen for the most part and didn't intrude.

The latter part of the video was particularly striking for the conformity of what is happening with Lifton's 8 Criteria for Thought Reform. HJ made a very powerful point that one of the reasons that GI activists are so opposed to the gathering of evidence is because this is an ideology so this is the equivalent of a test of belongingness and faith. If you are inducted into a gang and tattoo your face or sever part of a finger, that's not something that can be recovered from.

It's worth watching for the fluency of the conversation.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 30/04/2022 16:30

I liked the way they discussed the relentless targeting of children and how important it is to adult activists to weaponise children and put them at the forefront of discussions.

nauticant · 30/04/2022 17:10

I'm not completely convinced by everything BB does but his series on detransitioners is a real pubic service and shows his style of interviewing at its best.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRdayXEOwuMFyH-mBwSdI3L2cu4VLznTf

nauticant · 30/04/2022 17:12

Annoyingly that produced a non-live link. Here's a live version:

www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRdayXEOwuMFyH-mBwSdI3L2cu4VLznTf

NancyDrawed · 30/04/2022 17:29

I'm only half way through, but so many good points have been made.

SD-A has just spoken about affirmation in a way I hadn't considered before - when you affirm a child's rejection of their sexed body, you are affirming their self hatred. Saying a child is 'trangender' appears to put a positive spin on a really negative self hatred/ self rejection situation.

nepeta · 30/04/2022 17:41

I'm not completely convinced by everything BB does but his series on detransitioners is a real pubic service and shows his style of interviewing at its best.

Another example of the strange bedfellows this topic has created. Most of his opinions are quite sexist, but both the sexists and the anti-sexists need to have a word for the female sex. For opposite reasons, though.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 30/04/2022 17:46

I was particularly pleased to hear Helen's appreciation of Stephanie's work and that she's dedicated Trans to her. She's been tirelessly raising issues about what's happening in schools and the Transgender Trend website is full of authoritative, child centred advice for both schools and parents. A quick link to just some of the informative articles on the TT website:

www.transgendertrend.com/articles-relating-to-rogd/#

WarriorNewAgain · 30/04/2022 18:45

nepeta · 30/04/2022 17:41

I'm not completely convinced by everything BB does but his series on detransitioners is a real pubic service and shows his style of interviewing at its best.

Another example of the strange bedfellows this topic has created. Most of his opinions are quite sexist, but both the sexists and the anti-sexists need to have a word for the female sex. For opposite reasons, though.

He's recently been saying that feminists are similarly "an issue" as TRAs (don't quote me as I can't remember how he put it) but I appreciate the platform he gives.

WarriorNewAgain · 30/04/2022 18:45

Thanks for this though, I'll look forward to watching

IcakethereforeIam · 30/04/2022 20:33

Those sculptures! Wow!

Sorry for abrupt change in tone, they really castrated an 8 yo!?

334bu · 30/04/2022 21:57

Thank you for link.

SignOnTheWindow · 30/04/2022 22:29

@nepeta, great typo - a pubic service it is indeed!

nepeta · 30/04/2022 22:46

@SignOnTheWindow, 😀

Time2Move · 01/05/2022 00:29

I thought it was brilliant, and have 'come out' on facebook by sharing it... nervously awaiting the response.

ThomasPenman · 01/05/2022 00:41

IcakethereforeIam · 30/04/2022 20:33

Those sculptures! Wow!

Sorry for abrupt change in tone, they really castrated an 8 yo!?

As in chemical castration, yes. Puberty blockers followed by cross-sex hormones will leave an individual infertile. So if you administer puberty blockers to an 8 year old then you have effectively use castrated them since 99%+ go onto the cross-sex hormones.

TheBiologyStupid · 01/05/2022 00:44

Excellent, thanks for the link @ScreamingMeMe .

BettyFilous · 01/05/2022 07:30

This is an interesting podcast. There are some fantastic points made, like the one about affirming self-hatred of the child’s sexed body noted above. I thought Helen’s point about NHS oversight was interesting too, especially how having a single system allowed rapid appraisal of the safety of emerging IVF technologies and good follow-up in the past, so it was mystifying how badly they’d dropped the ball on PBs and x-sex hormones.

I noticed that Helen is much better at providing context for listeners new to this area before making her points. I also liked that she explained that Keira and others initiating judicial reviews have not received any compensation, but instead brought their cases to benefit others. That will be interesting for a US audience where suing is much more about compensation.

FannyCann · 01/05/2022 10:12

Thanks for posting. I shall watch later.

Mollyollydolly · 01/05/2022 12:48

Just watch this. It's an absolute cracker. Make sure to watch or listen.

GettingMarriedAgain · 01/05/2022 14:40

They made an interesting point about how parents who have helped their child medically transition have to double down because it would be too horrific for them to accept that they might have been wrong or have caused harm to their child, so they will always promote the idea of trans children. As some of these parents have jobs working in organisations such as newsrooms and they are not able to accept any criticism or dissent from their colleagues, it means that news stories will be affected accordingly - ditto judges with trans children hearing cases that go against the ideology, etc. I hadn’t really thought of that before.

WarriorNewAgain · 02/05/2022 18:23

Just finished this and yes, wow an excellent watch. Well done both 👏

FannyCann · 02/05/2022 22:27

Just listened to it this evening, I was struck by that point too @GettingMarriedAgain

RogersOrganismicProcess · 03/05/2022 03:33

Brilliant. Very logical and well thought out

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