Where do cockapoo and labradoodle owners usually get their dogs from?

[sortaottery]

This post is motivated by curiousity and a slightly OTT enthusiasm for all things canine.

I was wondering where cockapoo and labradoodle owners acquire their dogs from?

The cockapoo/labradoodle owners I've met don't seem like the type to buy intentionally from puppy farms. (Though since I imagine that type to have fangs, horns and red eyes, my impression might be incorrect).

But a lot of traditional dog breeders seem very down on the new "designer" mixes.

There a loads of them about, and they must come from somewhere.

I'm agnostic about them myself. I can see how a cockerpoo might go wrong, ending up with the highly strung temperament from the poodle side and the craziness from the spaniel side. (Love spaniels, btw). Yet looking at the harm done to dogs by breeding for exaggerated looks over breeding for health and happiness, it's hard to imagine how they could be any worse.

dont be ridiculously naive. If the “breeders” had to destroy their unsold puppies / old breeding bitches instead of having a no-questions asked route to get rid of them then (a) that would put a lot of them off as there is a cost to that if you euthanise properly (b) it would raise questions in vets minds about what this breeding operation is all about and may well prompt investigations by TS/RSPCA (c) a proportion of those who would rather kill and dispose of the dogs outside a vet-led process would get caught and prosecuted (d) people would be horrified at the level of destruction

There is no doubt at all that many tears and their ilk enable puppy farming. No doubt at all

Agree that MT does not enable puppy farming and neither are they scum.
I think they are trying to do their best in extremely difficult circumstances.
I don't think they always make the best decisions but I don't think they should be criticised for ttrying.

I agree with a lot of what you say @pastadish
But you do know that @TheHungryHungryLandsharks is a breeder?
If what she says is true - and I have no reason to disbelieve her - then a good one.
But you did say: "I hate dog breeding of any kind." so I thought I'd point that out 😁

Are you going for most naive post ever on MN? If so, I'd say you are in with a very good chance of winning.

Yes, breeding farms kill the dogs when they’re no longer of any use.
Do people think these facilities will just stop breeding puppies if rescues and shelters didn’t take the dogs? And they certainly don’t euthanise them gently with a lovely peaceful injection they get a shovel to their heads.
What on earth do people think happens in these places they are hell on earth for the dogs and people who run them do not give one shit about any of the animals they are commodities to generate profit.

My first poodle cross was a French accident and I took on one of the puppies at no cost. The second, a cockerpoo is from a hobby breeder, a litter every few years. The old boy is 13 and only has a bit of arthritis in his hips now, other than that no other health issues over the years.
As my little French lady died, the old boy has a new buddy now.
She is from the hobby breeder again, great cockerpoo puppy, no issues. I expect she will grow old like the old boy.

Hobby breeder? Playing tennis is a hobby not breeding living creatures for profit

ME naive?
And yet you seriously think they euthanise at the VETS??? That anyone is officially even aware of the dogs existence?
you’ve either got an axe to grind regarding many tears so are deliberately being obtuse or are so spectacularly naive that it’s laughable

Of course the majority are from puppy farms.

Bought mine from a long established breeder. Parents pedigree, DNA tested etc. I looked online and it was a minefield so I decided to try to reduce the risk factor. The breeder said they bred for looks and temperament. My dog was a very confident puppy.

@Tel12 DNA tested? What about hips, elbows, heart and other eye tests (there are two types)? What type of experience did your seller have? How many dogs did they have? What did they do with the dogs when they had outlived their use? How many other types of dog did they breed?

And did the original owners of those pedigrees know what their dogs had been reduced to? Did the person you buy from have permission to breed? Because although we (as I am a breeder) cannot stop people breeding these animals from our pedigrees...a lot of us dread it happening because of how negligent these breeders are. A 'good' doodle breeder should at least inform the original breeder of the pedigree of their intentions.

One of my friends has just found out one of his dogs he bred is being used for Goldendoodle breeding and he's absolutely heartbroken. He breeds to make the Golden Retriever better, not for someone to cannibalize it for profit by producing doodles, without considering the wider factors about the risk of breeding. Not every bitch is suitable to be bred from, regardless of health tests or personality.

And no one should be factoring looks into their breeding. I certainly don't. A good breeder breeds for confirmation not for appearance (which I assume in the doodle world means colour).

@redboxer321 thank you 😊I disagree with you on Many Tears (mostly because morally I cannot bring myself to understand how anyone can not report dog abuse - the idea of saving a few to perpetuate the misery of many just doesn't sit right with me personally) but we can't agree on everything.

I do kinda agree with you on principle @TheHungryHungryLandsharks but the scum would just go underground elsewhere. It wouldn’t change anything to report it.
And having helped with a number of those rescued from that particular brand of hell and see them become happy and well adjusted,it’s hard not to feel it’s just about tolerable within the awful situation we have currently.
obviously a system where many tears and their ilk weren’t necessary would be better but that ain’t gonna happen unfortunately

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks But we don't know - or I don't know - that MT don't report the puppy farmers. If they did report them and they were shut down and properly punished and didn't start up somewhere new... then that would be their supply line cut off.
But they exist in such numbers that MT could report all day, every day and they'd still be plenty of dogs needing shelter places to keep their operation running.
My view is that until every puppy farm is shut down, then places like MT are needed.
MT don't need puppy farmers to exist in order to exist themselves. There are plenty of backyard breeders, hobby breeders, incidents of people buying dogs and breeding from them like your Goldendoodle example above to maintain the supply chain.
Also, I don't have much faith in the authorities to do anything about it. As with the RSPCA, they talk a good game...

I have no idea who that poster is. I reread the posts and I couldn’t see anything that suggests they are a breeder.
Although I have to say I DO NOT agree the many tears rescue are scum at all, I do t know why anyone would come to the conclusion that a dog rescue is scum because they perpetuate the cycle, that doesn’t make sense as if they did not exist then the breeding dogs would simply be killed after living a too short life of hell.

No I don’t like breeding. There are too many posts on here saying my breeder was fab because my dog didn’t have health issues, the hobby breeder gave me a great dog, my breeder told me they did all the checks and I saw the parents. It’s bonkers. The vast majority people just go online look at breeders and read whatever the have written about themselves on their webpage, decide to believe what they read and decide it’s a fabulous ethical breeder.

If I got a regular supply of puppies from a big puppy farm I wouldn’t make a website saying I have factory farmed puppies, no idea about health but probably has lots of issues as their parents were kept in hell and not given any vet treatment or checks.

I got my dog from a local rescue and with hindsight it was a poor choice. I suspect they were effectively importing rejects from Ireland.

I had started to wonder because they had a fast turnover. They had to move region and at their new base they ended up shut down by RSPCA in an enormous operation. They were importing dogs from places like Turkey and Romania. They were doing home style vet treatment. They went to prison.

I’m annoyed with myself for not realising sooner.

The thing is, there are very few dogs available for adoption in my area. Those that are bigger breeds or elderly. Plus a few from difficult backgrounds that we don’t feel able to take on at the moment. Dogs that are basically feral and starting from scratch- terrified of everything.

I will look at many tears and make my own judgement. I’d be hugely reassured if I knew they weren’t paying for the dogs, to be honest.

@redboxer321 they're pretty well known for not reporting puppy farmers, because they fear if they do then the farmers will not only get away with it (because the RSPCA are shit) but they will stop giving them the abused dogs to re-home and the dogs will be killed.

They were under investigation earlier this year for abusing dogs in their care and shipping them in from overseas as well. Even if you can support their attempts to try and help abused dogs (although I still think they are more hindrance than help) you have to admit it takes an awful lot for a dog charity (or breeder) to actually be investigated when it comes to claims of animal abuse. I mean, the authorities barely do anything about animal abuse when they get reports most of the time. Case in point being that on-going thread at the moment with that poor spaniel in awful conditions. I struggle to believe there wasn't something very valid in those complaints - even if no dogs were removed during the investigation.

Interestingly, just as I was typing the above PP about Many tears being investigated for importing from overseas ( @PrizedPickledPopcorn ) popped up saying they had a similar experience from a previous rescue.

And much of the social media commenting from people who have been involved in them is similarly poor - they have refused the help of our another GR Rescue organisations because 'they knew the breed better' (really, MT knew a Golden Retriever better than a rescue specifically designed for Golden Retrievers?) when the GR Rescue offered to take on one of their 'long-term' residents to find a suitable home and place the dog in foster. Many Tears preferred the dog remain in kennels. They have a policy of not engaging with breed specific rescues.

Lots of people have a very good view on them. But in my eyes, they only care about perception - they want people to think they're doing a good job, rather than actually doing a good job - and not about animal welfare.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks
If the only outcome of reporting puppy farmers is, as you suggest, that the dogs will lose out on a chance of a hopefully at least half decent home and will be killed (I imagine inhumanely), then I can understand why they don't report.

But it certainly sounds like they have questions to answer. Be interesting to see the outcome of the investigation. I may have to reconsider my position then. All I would say, is when a situation is so desperate, sometimes the solution is very far from perfect and this may be the case here. I'm not defending them, just acknowledging the dire situation in which they work.

As for the GR, I imagine it was a financial decision. They may have thought that dog would be an easy sell and while they are a charity, they are also a business. More money for them = more dogs saved. Whether that is the right approach I don't know. Almost certainly not for the GR but maybe overall taking into consideration other dogs. I don't think it means they don't care. But I'm open to the possibility that they don't.

I am now very sceptical of any organisation that imports pets to rescue. It seems it is possible to make a profit from it, and it doesn’t address the animal welfare issues in that country.
Spay and release programs would do that far more effectively than importing dogs.

Totally different of course from individuals trying to rescue an animal they have bonded with abroad.

Apparently I got lost in translation! Many Tears are not the scum I was referring to! I meant the repulsive ‘breeders’ in my post

many tears have definitely had issues recently but given the change in personnel since (inside info) I’m confident to recommend them personally. Even though I hate why they exist

I think it's difficult to get a decent dog in the UK. We all have standards, but many choose with their hearts not their heads when it comes to choosing a pet.

I think there are some half decent breeders of poo or doodle dogs. But they are frowned upon by MN and pedigree breeders.

There is so much wrong with UK dog breeding that I would not know where to start. There is puppy farming, as encouraged by the government through licensing laws. Then there are unscrupulous pedigree dog breeders that favour deformed mutants carefully choreographed under the Royal (no less) Kennel Club. And let's not forget the therapy, working and sports dog breeding that goes under the radar with their unethical practices and high inbreeding. Oh and don't forget the ridiculous prices for a dog with or without a fancy made up name.

I have 2 pedigree dogs (carefully selected from import lines) & 1 rescue but I would not get another one born & bred in the UK ... and if I would go down the rescue route again it would have to be like my current one. Straight from the failed home to me. Avoiding the high & mighty do-godders on the way. I'm in my early 50's, my youngest dog is 5 ... and when she goes, I probably won't get another!

From the cockadoodle zoo.

This was posted on ManyTears FB page on April 24

We wish to share that Sylvia, CEO of Many Tears Animal Rescue, and her husband Bill have stepped down from their roles at the charity.
We are deeply grateful for both of their unmatched dedication and commitment over more than two decades. Sylvia and Bill’s vision and care helped rescue and rehome thousands of dogs, leaving a lasting positive impact on animals and the families who have welcomed them into their homes.
Many Tears remains firmly committed to its mission, and our values and day-to-day work remain unchanged. The rescue continues to operate as usual, with the management team leading daily operations and trustees working closely alongside them to support the charity’s ongoing work and future direction.
Our current and future focus remains on rescuing and rehoming dogs in need, as well as a small number of cats. In addition, our equine programme which has rescued many horses, ponies and donkeys, will continue to welcome the community groups who benefit greatly from the education and well-being programmes we offer.
We extend our sincere thanks to Sylvia and Bill for everything they have given to Many Tears, and to our supporters, volunteers, and wider community for their continued compassion and support.
Many Tears Animal Rescue, board of trustees.

I'm not on FB so couldn't see the replies although I'm sure there's many.
I wonder if things just got too much for them.

Lots in rescues

The family have been breeding since the 70s. I was interviewed before I was even aware there were any puppies. They always take dogs back if there's an issue and had recently rehomed an 18 month old because of chronic illness. I did my due diligence.

Most people don’t realise that standard poodles are large hounds originally bred for hunting. Similar to a greyhound with a curly floofy coat, they even have the deep chest, snatched waist and long muzzle under all the fuzz. Sadly so many breeds have been ‘miniaturised’ that most people have no idea what the breed originally looked like.