SEN or not to SEN - School advice please?

[JDMummyBear]

After some advice, if you would be so kind, you fabulous people of Mumsnet!

My son is 5½ and has a diagnosis of very mild autism. We also strongly suspect ADHD, although this is not yet diagnosed.

He had a difficult time in nursery, where he could become aggressive towards children and staff, particularly during transitions or when situations escalated around favourite items such as a bike. Coming in from outside could also be a trigger, and he would lash out. We had significant support from various professionals and were very fortunate to have an EHCP in place before he started school.

We chose a mainstream primary and worked closely with them to prepare for his arrival. However, he was quickly placed on a reduced timetable, as the school felt he was constantly heightened and struggling to settle, which was disruptive to others. Despite additional support, including 2:1 support, he was suspended within four weeks. Eventually, both the school and I agreed they could not meet his needs, and another placement was needed.

He then moved to a temporary specialist setting where he absolutely thrived. They understood his behaviours, helped him self regulate, and he loved attending, even moaning at weekends he wanted to go. He made friends, enjoyed lessons, and flourished. Staff felt his difficulties were more SEMH-related than developmental, as academically and developmentally he is very capable. He became the little boy we see at home, and they all adored him.

When he's happy, he's funny, bright, independent, and full of character. He makes his own drinks and snacks, makes his bed, opens his curtains, and loves having responsibilities and jobs around the house.

We have since moved as it was only temporary and are now working with a new LA to find a long-term placement. We've visited several SEN schools, but they don't feel quite right for him. My concern is that he does not fit neatly into a traditional SEN setting, but equally mainstream hasn't worked either.

So I suppose my question is: what type of school or setting should we be looking at moving forward? Does anyone have any recommendations, experiences, or even definite "no's"? We're in the Fylde area (North West), and any guidance would be hugely appreciated.

We had very similar experiences and our child definitely settled much better in a specialist SEN school. It's given them the confidence to understand themselves and their emotions rather than a mainstream school making them conform all the time. I'd say the right SEN provision has been life changing for us all as a family. If he's been suspended once from a mainstream primary (and my feelings about that as a "punishment" for ASD kids is probably another thread...) I'd be inclined to suggest it may happen again elsewhere. If you find the right specialist setting please try for that. You could always re-evaluate for secondary.

I would continue looking at other special schools within travelling distance (usually the maximum recommended travel time for primary is considered to be 45mins) including those out of area and/or independent.

I would also look at your evidence. Reading the evidence should help you understand DS’s needs and what provision he requires. Your evidence will inform sections B&F. In turn, the placement named in section I will be the logical conclusion of B&F. B+F=I.

Is DS receiving education at the moment?

In case it is relevant in the future, part-time timetables should not be used to manage behaviour, and schools should not suspend just because they can’t meet needs.

Don't get me started on the suspension I'd totally be sharing the same views!! We were astounded when it happened and then was also told he wasn't to be seen in public spaces! We were like he's 4, the school said well it's usually for older children, my response was for those old enough to understand what suspension means and can grasp why? Honestly ridiculous and laughable, he's going to get into trouble being in lidl 🤣

Thank you for your post, really appreciate it! What kind of things did you have to go through with your DC and how long did it take? Did you take it in to your own hands or have LA support etc?

Good to know that about travel time, we've been offered 1hr 15 mins on a good day, we just can't do that to him!

We've been granted temporary home tutor from tomorrow, doing first meeting in the morning to see how they get along.

We've been lucky enough to have his EHCP rewritten so it's more accurate with the support of his school and the alternative provision. Got a meeting with them hopefully joining also with the new LA.

How can I address the timetable to manage behaviour if it happens in the future as it seemed as though everyone and their dog agreed with the timetable change. They mentioned reviewing to increase after a certain amount of time but it never was? It was tough to manage that whilst working full time. I was lucky work were flexible!
He's been through a lot of trauma with the nursery and school, he's a bright boy and we just want to get it right for him.

Really appreciate your response so thank you 😊

Have a read of the government’s suspension and exclusion guidance. In particular:

“Telling or forcing a pupil to leave school, or not allowing them to attend school, is a suspension (if temporary) or permanent exclusion (if permanent). Whenever a pupil is made to leave school, or forbidden from attending school, on disciplinary grounds, this must be done in accordance with the School Discipline (Pupil Exclusions and Reviews) (England) Regulations 2012 and with regard to relevant parts of this guidance.

19. Suspending a pupil for a short period of time, such as half a day, is permissible but the formal suspension process must still be followed. Each disciplinary suspension and permanent exclusion must be confirmed to the parents in writing with notice of the reasons for the suspension or permanent exclusion.

20.Any exclusion of a pupil, even for short periods, must be formally recorded. It would also be unlawful to exclude a pupil simply because they have SEN or a disability that the school feels it is unable to meet, or for a reason such as, academic attainment/ability; or the failure of a pupil to meet specific conditions before they are reinstated, such as to attend a reintegration meeting.

21.If any of these unlawful exclusions are carried out and lead to the deletion of a pupil’s name from the register, this is known as ‘off-rolling’. Further examples of off-rolling include:
•exercising undue influence over a parent to remove their child from the school under the threat of a permanent exclusion and encouraging them to choose Elective Home Education or another school place
•moving a pupil to off-site AP where that is not in the best interests of that pupil
•encouraging a post-16 student not to continue with their course of study when this is against the best interests of that pupil
•sending a pupil home without a formal suspension regardless of whether it occurs with the agreement of parents
•placing a pupil on a part-time timetable for behavioural reasons
•Intentionally removing a pupil from the school roll without correctly following regulations”

You can remind the school DS is entitled to attend full time unless formally suspended. If you want, you can inform the school DS will be attending full time and you will not be collecting early unless formally suspended.

How many hours of home tuition will you be having? And is home tuition suitable for DS? Is anything detailed, specified and quantified in F of the EHCP also being provided?

Amazing, thank you!! Didn't even think to research that, I just assumed it was the school policies.

He's getting 15hrs a week, which is great for him, obviously it's temporary but until we get a placement this will really help him. He got 20hrs at the alternative provision so not too bad in reality. The meet went well with his tutor, so looking forward to seeing how we move forward, also great contact as knows the area and had worked in lots of places so has insight!

I'll have to get his EHCP back out and read the specifics, thank you again for your reply 🙏

If DS manages 15hrs, I would request more or extra hours of something else. The LA is obliged to provide a suitable, full time education. The number of hours isn’t set out in law. The LGO suggests 22-25hrs depending on age. Although they and the government guidance acknowledge 1:1 could be fewer hours because of the intensity of 1:1. It should be a broad and balanced curriculum, equivalent to that experienced in maisntream as far as DS’s needs allow. However, 15hrs is on the cusp. For example, there are cases where the LGO considered 15hrs to not be sufficient and cases where they considered it to be sufficient. My personal opinion is unless the child cannot manage more hours in any form, it isn’t sufficient.

If there is anything in the EHCP that isn’t being provided, I would also raise that because it should be being provided.

I'm assuming you don't have autism bases or ARP's in your area. They vary in what they call them, but they're attached to a mainstream school and have smaller classes and extra provision with some integration where appropriate. The only thing to watch is often special schools are so full that they end up taking cohorts they weren't intended for who are less academically able and often non-verbal.

We are going through the process of rewriting his EHCP with the new LA and have a review in a couple of weeks, with all involved, so this will be good and we can address the allocation of 15hrs. Aware that this is temporary and that we could find a placement in the next few weeks also.
The tutor has been this week and they are lovely, my son has engaged well and is leading most of the play this week, with the view to more structure next. What is also good is that the tutor has experience and knowledge of the area, and schools, which is also super helpful.

If I am honest I think the 15hrs suits my son right now as he has been out of the routine for a while, and it may be able to build up to more hours.

Thank you again, really helpful advice

Thank you, yes there are a few that I am aware of in the area, and we have been on the list for a few, I know that we have received a fair few declines and that they would not be able to meet his need and still waiting for the outcome on others. We have also noticed that with the cohorts and have expressed concerns at a few that we have been too, which did demonstrate exactly that, they try to arrange the cohorts, but they did say sometimes they have more, and it would mean they would vary in skillsets and abilities.

Thank you for your input, really do appreciate it.