need some CC hand holding.

[BeebiesQueen]

I've had a thread in chat earlier incase any of this seems familiar to anyone!

dd2 is 12 months in 2 weeks. She cant fall asleep by herself. So I'm having to get tough, and its hard! I've decided after trying diffrent things that cc is the way to go, i'm not after a fight or a debate on teh rights and wrongs, I just need support from anyone who can offer.

So her first nap of the day she cried (its not sad, distressed crying its angry cry iykwim) for 2.5 hours before it was time for her bottle so I got her up, gave her bottle, gave lunch, had a little play then it was time for her afternoon nap. She cried for 2 hours 15 minutes until it was time for her afternoon bottle and if she had fallen asleep at that point she would have missed dinner and not been tired at bed time which would mess up dd1's routine.

now here we are, she was so tired at dinner, I decided to put her to bed at 5.30, getting her ready for bed she kept closing her eyes and trying to fall asleep.

I put her in her cot and here we are again big angry screams and lots of 'urgh, urgh, urgh' (up, up, up) I'm goin gin every 10-15 minutes depending on how much shes shouting. each time I lie her down, she settles, closes her eyes, I walk away and she screams again. (ive tried staying by herside and patting her, it was taking over an hour some nights to get her to sleep, which isnt practical with dd1 (who is only 15 months older) around

That was a long explanation if any one around is doing the same tonight or can hold my hand to get through this, please join me.

thankfully dh will be home at 6.30 to take over so I can go out and have a break (in other words go and do the weekly shop!) so I just have to survive another 45 minutes, then however long it takes to settle, but I really do think we are in for the long hall tonight

[BeebiesQueen]

I'm not doing cry it out, nor am I leaving her to cry for hours and hours!
I'm going in every 15 minutes so calm her down and lie her down again.

She is also not crying for hours and hours. she is not upset and not distressed. she is angry and shouting, but most of the time she is just sitting quietly in her cot.

Let me reiterate she is not crying, her shouts are just 'up, up, up' which means she wants to get up. she is not upset or distressed. If she was I couldn't and wouldn't be doing this.

I haven't been giving in each night breadandhoney, she fell asleep lying down which is a first. she actually led down and fell asleep, up until now she has been falling asleep sitting up and even when I lie her down in an asleep state she has instantly been sitting up again.

For all of those who suggest this is a cruel method what do you suggest? she is stubborn and determined, this is showing results, maybe not as quick as others have had results but still we are getting results. I have tried every thing else. Letting her fall asleep in her 0 stage car seat is not practical, she has almost grown out of it and she cant sleep in it all night, its not safe. Sitting next to her patting her and shushing was getting the same results, her crying for hours and hours, only worse because I was there and she wanted to get out.

Come on then if you are all such amazing parents why don't you come here and do it. You can come and tell me where I am going wrong and why she wont sleep EVER. This way dh, dd (who is only 2) and I have all had 6 hours sleep in a row, we haven't had that since she was born. she always woke up after 1.5-2 hours meaning we are always shattered, my 2 year old is always grumpy and tired. In the past few days I have seen my little girl turn into the child she was before she sister was born. I have also seen my baby improve as she is getting more sleep this way and is much happier for it. she is becoming more independent rather than clingy. she comes to me for a cuddle then goes off and plays rather than being constantly attached to my side all day long.

You may think is cruel but you are not here I am, you are living this life I am, you are not seeing what I am, just what I type here. Do not for a second think you have the full picture because I can assure you, you haven't.

I don't care how crap sleepers your children were, every child is different, every person feels things differently and every family make up is different. You don't have a clue what I am going through here. Don't pretend you do.

[BeebiesQueen]

Also I have had some lovely people holding my hand on this thread, and on my first thread which was in chat. I moved here as it was a more appropriate place.

To thoes that have been supportive and kind. Thank you.

[teacher123]

I don't think anyone goes into sleep training lightly, I am sure that beebiesqueen has thought long and hard about this. Everyone's approach to parenting is different, and there is a huge difference between just leaving a child in a room sobbing their heart out whilst parents are downstairs watching telly/getting wasted/neglecting them and parents who are desperate, whose children are unhappy, trying to help them.

Sleep deprivation is just horrendous, and for some people co sleeping is the answer. For others (like us) cosleeping just doesn't work and never did. Therefore you are stuck. In our case DS would cry whether we were there or not, but would settle much quicker when I wasn't in the room (ie 5 minutes of shouting/grizzling as opposed to 45 minutes). Should I stay with him so he's upset for longer? That would be ridiculous.

[BeebiesQueen]

Thanks teacher. We also have tried co-sleeping, but she just wont fall asleep and gets more and more upset.

[IHeartKingThistle]

Good for you beebies. Lovely to hear it's having an impact during the day as well.

[breadandhoney]

Beebies. Glad to hear things are coming along and that your eldest is benefitting from what you've been doing the past few days. I hope you didn't take my pp as a criticism. I was simply curious about how your dd had been falling asleep before. Admiring your determination. As the mother of a very stubborn 2.6yo who we sleep trained at 6 months I only mean to be here to support you.

Shut out the negative voices. You know this is the right way forward for you and your family. CC is not a way of life. Soon this will be a thing of the past and your family will benefit.

This is pretty much the least eloquent thing I've ever written. Basically...still hand holding

[MNPin2013]

Sounds like your both getting on with it as best as you can and it is for the positive.

[BeebiesQueen]

I put her to bed 5minutes and after the initial protests she hasn't made a noise since. She also didn't get up the second I put her down. After a crap day i could cry! Hopefully she's falling asleep up there rather than sitting staring.

[teacher123]

Did she go off to sleep ok? Hope you managed to get a bit of an evening! X

[breadandhoney]

Hope she was asleep soon after you posted.

[BeebiesQueen]

she woke up soon after I posted and was shouting till 9pm, but she fell asleep again in her cot by herself. I'm clinging on to any improvement!

and this morning there was hardly any fuss, less than a minute in fact and she is sleeping soundly. day 6 and I think we cracked it!

[teacher123]

How's it gone for the rest of today and for bedtime tonight?

[pacific407]

I haven't read all the posts so may be repeating, but have you considered her sleeping environment and anything that could change? I'm just wondering if there's a reassurance/comfort element to you being there and, if so, whether you could replicate that with a soft toy (I read on another thread about a microwaveable bean bag toy which I love the sound of), music, lighting etc?

[BeebiesQueen]

I put her to bed last night, she grumbled for around 2 minutes, she then fell asleep for 45 minutes, she woke up, cried for 2 minutes (I wanted her to know i was still there) re settled her she grumbled for another 5 and slept for 45 minutes cried for 2 i resettled her the she grumbled for 5 minutes. She cried out at midnight by the time i went on she was fast asleep again! She woke up at 4.45 for a bottle then slept till 6.

Today we had to go out this morning and she fell asleep in her car seat. This afternoon she slept for around 30 minutes and she's currently having dinner and then it will be bed time.

I'm also going to do something quite scary, I'm going to put both children to bed at the same time. Up until now dd1 has been waiting till dd2 was asleep before going to bed, and before that we would put 1 to bed before the other too. Quite nervous as its another big step, but a necessity and when its a solid routine I'll be glad I did it!

[teacher123]

Wow! Sounds like progress is definitely being made, when they both go to bed, make sure you have a very large glass of wine and a big bar of chocolate

[BeebiesQueen]

I put them to bed at 5.45 (figured they are both very tired and it will take a while for them to settle) and they are both quiet! no idea if actually asleep, but as there is no noise coming from their bedroom there is no way in hell anyone is going anywhere near those stairs!

chocolate sounds good, a big bar of choc. On day 7 both sleeping in the same room at the same time. HUGE progress

[knottyhair]

Just wanted to say well done, it's tough but real progress today by the sounds of it .

[teacher123]

Hahaha! Our stairs are dead creaky-when MIL or DM look after DS I have to tell them NOT to go and peep at him, as it wakes him up! I really hope you get at least some of an evening

[BeebiesQueen]

I'm not sure what happened. They were both fast asleep and happy then suddenly dd2 dtarts screaming hysterically, I ran upstairs and she is wild eyed and very upset. I picked her up and she held on tight and wouldnt let go. thankfully dd1 is still asleep but dd2 is not downstairs with me not sure I did the right thing, but I've never heard her make a noise like that before and she really was scared. we'll cuddle for a bit then back to bed I think.

[BeebiesQueen]

now not not!

[breadandhoney]

Fantastic progress! Hope dd2 settles for you shortly. You trusted your instincts on that one. Maybe a bad dream or a tummy pain?

[BeebiesQueen]

I really dont know what happened. dh got home from work and she happily went to him and tried to snuggle down, so he took her back to bed. I can still hear her every now and then, but shes trying to sleep. It must have been a bad dream

[teacher123]

Did she manage to settle back off? When they cry like that then you know that it's out of the ordinary and you have to cuddle them, don't you? Glad that she had a nice cuddle with DH when he got home.

[BeebiesQueen]

she went back off in about 10 minutes. she didnt cry, just shouting for me again.

I just put her down now as she missed this morning nap (I didnt notice the time) and shes up there shouting again. shes tired but has decided that today she just doesnt want to sleep!

[breadandhoney]

How have the last few days been?