Concerns about racism

[PandoraSocks]

Hi there Mumsnet HQ

Many of us are concerned about the uptick of hatred, xenophobia and racism on the site over the past couple of weeks. Most of the bigotry is focused on asylum seekers. MNHQ will of course delete racism etc. if reported, but this has gone way beyond a few hateful posts.

Links below to three examples of threads which have descended into real nastiness.

Cheers.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/in_the_news/5385273-civil-unrest-whats-really-going-on?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5385914-do-you-believe-there-will-be-a-civil-war?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5386073-to-be-so-fed-up-amd-disheartened-with-all-the-xenophobia?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

At the risk of incurring Godwin, your proposed approach did not work out well in 1930s Germany, did it?

I also agree that the use of sweeping generalisations is a tool used on MN to spread hate and sow division.

That’s your right but I disagree. I think our freedom of speech laws are about right as they are.

Absolutely.

Can generalisations be made there is evidence to suggest it is correct? Eg, ‘Brits in Spain act in X/Y way’.

That's as maybe but in the context of the thread topic she referred you to the 'experts' at MNHQ

You have since continued to pester them with the same question

I think I’ve asked twice max, and merely responded to other people tagging me. Unless you can prove that wrong?

Don't even bother, they clearly don't care.

See previous replies

See also the definition of 'sealioning' posted upthread

I bloody love flapjacks

@Efacsen I agree with freezedriedstrawberries

Indeed. Having just come back to look at this thread’s progression from yesterday I was just about to post this:

https://wondermark.com/c/1062/

Well I was relentlessly asked for evidence myself, posted it, and was asked again. Am I being sealioned myself?

It's the BBC good food one. I've tried several and this one comes out so nicely. I love a savoury biscuit so I often experiment. I especially love it if I can get something from my garden in the mix!
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/cheese-rosemary-biscuits
Let me know if you make them.

If we have moved on to Doe Snot I feel obliged to offer my standard use for any leftover Christmas Panettone. Its like bread and butter pudding but with more calories and was always popular in my house on miserable January days:

Panettone Pudding

50g butter, softened (optional)
250g panettone in medium thick slices
2 eggs
142ml carton double cream. (Christmas flavoured creams such as brandy or cointreau work well if you have leftovers)
225ml milk (or sub with more cream…)
1 tsp vanilla extract (extract, not flavouring)
2 tbsp caster sugar
icing sugar, for sprinkling
softly whipped cream, to serve

Optional - any preferred spice mixes or extra fruit, experimentation is good.

Heat the oven to 160C/ 140C fan, grease a 850ml shallow baking dish

Cut 250g panettone into slices or wedges as preferred

Butter the slices and cut into largish pieces then arrange them in the dish, buttered side up.

Whisk together eggs eggs, double cream, milk (or extra cream), 1vanilla extract and caster sugar. Add additional spices to this mix if you enjoy them. Pour evenly over the panettone.

Put the dish in a roasting tin and pour hot water around it to a depth of about 2.5cm. Bake for 35 minutes until the pudding is just set - it should be yellow inside and nicely browned on top.

Eat.

You write as if you've already decided the outcome of any stats.

Given I’ve posted about 5 times ‘we are awaiting proper data with definitive conclusions’ I find that hard to believe.

Thank you. I have some rosemary in the garden x

This

Have you seen what else you write? You make comments as if the outcome is decided eg accusing people of not caring about rape because they're not trying to deport Afghan men in general.

Loving the sealion info. I'd never heard of it but of course have seen a lot of it on MN.

It is all very subjective though.

If we challenge on thread and identify a PP is telling straight porkies or suggest they are posting in bad faith because of eg a series of posts all skirting around the border of the issue without blatant *isms but often with disinformation we can be deleted for troll hunting.

If we report we are told “challenge on thread”.

I get that human mods will always be subjective without very prescriptive rules but it often feels very inconsistent. Subjectivity back in ye olden days when most mods were clearly regulars on the forums was probably easier to accept than now when the site is huge and moderation often feels remote and less attached to the forum. Even in Site Stuff we need to report threads to ensure HQ see them.

It would be interesting to understand what proportion of the mods are current regulars on MN (in a private capacity) and what sort of diversity exists on the current mod team. (Not just racial diversity, I’m thinking across all the protected characteristics).

Wow! Thankfully the law makers of our country don't think like you.

Does hate speech and incitement to aggression not matter to you?

People accuse posters of not caring around rape because they dismiss 1 transwoman offender and say other trans people shouldn’t suffer because of the actions of 1 person. That doesn’t receive the uproar my responses do?

@PhilippaGeorgiou Unfortunately the left has increasingly become authoritarian and any dissent from some luxury beliefs has become unacceptable. The left no longer represents the working class. If you tell people - and you do - that they are hateful for wanting to expose the Rotherham grooming gangs or for believing that people cant change sex then you have lost any credibility. It is not hate to seek to protect women and girls and some of you need to take a good hard look at yourselves and your internalised misogyny.

I have reported posts suggesting that all men who want to be women are perverts but there is no recognition among some of those posting here that sexual offences are more common than for men generally. We are not even permitted to refer to a well known sexual fetish because some people would prefer to believe that is not a motivation for some men.

I havent read the threads that are being complained off here but I'd expect mumsnet to delete any posts promoting violence. If that is not happening then report them again. And if it's a series of posts I've reported half a dozen on occasion when it seemed necessary to show the context.

On the feminist board at least some of the more unpleasant posts are from activists who want to either get the boards shut down or use them to suggest mumsnet is something it isnt. It's possible some of the posts you object to are actually created by people like the OP who want to shut down debate. As I said in the first paragraph the left has lost credibility.

Whataboutery is also an interesting concept.

I'm not involved in any threads about trans stuff so can't really answer anything about responses there.