Narcissists and friends

[AugustMoon]

Not sure where to post this, spend most of my time lurking here and supposing others on this board will have the most experience borderline personality disorders.

I am trying to reconcile traits of a narcissist - my H is textbook and i return time and time again to reference material, really so i can think clearly and rationally, such are his powers of manipulation.

BUT, the only thing i've read that doesnt ring true, is that people with NPD only associate with high-achievers / high-status people.

Whilst my H does associate with these types, has some successful friends / family members, it is more common for him to mix with those who could only be classed as losers: bitter, sexist divorcees, pub drunks, bullshitters, down-and-outs. My H is none if these things (yet ) but he has always had these questionable friends.

My point really being to ask, what is this all about and does it mean he cant have NPD? I'm not the only one who's noticed this about him.

Not all people with narcissistic traits are the same.

But anyway - does it matter? If he's behaving in a way that you are uncomfortable with then that is what you need to focus on.

Are you still together? Do you want to separate?

Thanks. I've just LTB. Its very complicated.

It probably gives him an ego boost when he's around them thinking how better he his than them .

Yes I've thought that. Its just it never comes up and actually part of me thinks it might be a common thing. Its true he visibly relishes the superiority around these sorts of people.

They're complicated aren't they . I think that's the thing with them you can never pin them down .
I had a friend who is narrcistic and she would pretend to be friends with these people but would laugh and mock them behind their back . It almost gave her a high .
Another one that for her would of been lateness . When I googled it they say it is true but not much on it.

Not every person has to match every single trait of a diagnosable condition. People are different - you'll never find 2 exactly the same.

Sounds like you're clutching at a very minor straw to disprove something that otherwise seems self-evident?

An ex of mine (narc sociopath) had many friends who he considered very beneath him who he loved "lording" over. He would hold court when we were out, revelling in their adoration, then slag them off mercilessly when we got home. He considered himself a great intellect and everyone else his inferior. He always got such a kick out of these nights out, becoming so energized by how much cleverer, interesting, popular and more important (in his twisted mind) he was to everyone else.

He only had one friend who was his equal, a fellow narc who was incredibly successful and his superior intellectually, who he was unbelievably jealous of. Nights out involving this other guy involved them jostling for attention, trying to outdo each other on every level and always culminated with my ex being in the most appalling narcissistic rage back at home. It was quite terrifying to experience.

I always heard that they prefer to surround themselves with people they view as being less intelligent/less beautiful/inferior in some sort of way to themselves so they get endless ego boosts and don't feel insecure.

It could be that underneath all the narcissistic persona he has built, his core belief is that he really is a loser and he is more comfortable being around people he doesn't feel inferior to.

Being around high achievers probably makes him feel inferior.

www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/

Btw...I've known a few people about whom I've had a 'private working theory' were npds. In my experience they don't form 'real' relationships... Any they had performed a type of function for them.

My narc brother only hangs around with people less successful than him, he likes to collect " charity cases" he can feel superior to. He hates anyone else achieveing or having anything and will always try and find away to stop it or if he can't either ignore or denigrate anyone else's achievements.

Not all Narcs are the same. My ex was a low-achiever. Had admin jobs which he hated, but lost as he kept falling out with female staff (arrogant and talks down to women). Scathing about his siblings and his grown up children, except the boy. His children are successful in their careers. Talked about his (very few) friends behind their backs. All that had gone wrong with his life was other people's fault - he did a counselling certificate (God forbid!) at college but it was the lecturer's fault he didn't go on to Uni as lecturer should have given him more support, the women at work were bitchy, his children had good careers "yeah but the rest of their lives are shit because x y z", his friends are bigheaded according to him, 1 friend suffered loss of family member and he was almost gleeful at his friend's distress, I felt. He had a love/hate relationship with me, he couldn't belittle my self-employment as I rebuffed that, but made it a huge issue because "you're up too late, you are awake when you should be sleeping".

His hatred was for anyone he felt was a high achiever, and yet he never ever aimed to improve himself, just full of blame for others. & it was constant, not a day would go by when he didnt harp on about it and then he'd pick arguments so he could scorn me too All the other Narc traits ie gaslighting, over-concerned with public image, always had to be right, kept ex's around for ego boost and enjoyed involving them in our relationship business then getting them to play the "pick me" dance as he'd no doubt told them they had a chance with him etc were all there. He was so scornful of others behind their backs it became sickening to hear. He thought he was better than everybody but I think his self-esteem was very low, really.

I didn't do the psycho-analysing thing though, I got the hell out. It took me years to get over him but I don't actually give a shit why Narcs are as they are - they suck you dry, and self-preservation is important to me.

My ex has the capabiity of being a high achiever but doesn't see why he should put the work in to get there. People should just realise he's brilliant in his extremely niche field of choice and employ him.
Meanwhile he works sporadically in a field he's brilliant in and could, without question, rise through the ranks quickly, but chooses to stay in low paid relief work because a career in this field, he feels, is beneath his brilliance.

Just revisited this thread and wanted to say thanks. Most of this rings true. I suppose I'm hung up on convincing myself to justify my leaving him...? But really I don't need to justify anything. I know what he does to me and that it has caused a lot of pain, that I must just get out and stop thinking "maybe its me". I'm getting a lot of intimidating and patronising messages from him "you think life will be better without me, it may take a little while for you to realise it won't". It already is. For a start I have come off anti-depressants, have hope for the future and I'm home.

I read in Lundy Bancroft's Why Does He Do That? that narcs have two types of friends - those who are similar to themselves and also display narcissus behaviours, and those who allow them to continue with their behaviour and don't challenge them. So perhaps he sees these people as beneath him and therefore worse than him?

If you are wavering about why you left, can I recommend reading Should I Stay or Should I Go also by Lundy Bancroft. I found it very valuable to assess whether my relationship was worth saving (it wasn't), as by abuser had also convinced me it was the wrong decision.

This is the tough bit now you have left. Hang on in there.

Thank u Namechanger. There are added complications but I'm trying.

My experience with narcs is that they have "friends" who are lower status and higher status than them, but never anyone they would recognise as a peer. The low status ones allow them to feel better than someone, and the high status ones they try to get in with to be approved of.

You don't need to justify leaving. Leave and don't go back! The feeling of "maybe it's me" isn't coincidental - narcs spend most of their time and effort making you believe that any and all problems are your fault.

I get the impression that people with narcissistic traits are completely uninterested in anyone unless they meet a need. So they can enjoy being looked up to by people who don't matter. People who are cleverer or better can also be useful. Eg a promising employee will be praised as one of their 'proteges', a precocious younger relative will be said to 'take after me' or have had sage advice at a crucial moment.