when do you know to call it a day?

[headoverthere]

Just wondered at what point do people know its over?
If there he's been no trigger, like abuse or affairs.
My marriage is plodding along. We don't spend time together & seem to spend more time arguing about seperating than we spend planning our future.
We're not intimate or loving. He sleeps on the sofa. He doesnt help with the kids or housework very much. He's just kind of there. Sharing the house. We don't talk or have a laugh.
We've been together 18 years. Is it normal for a relationship to go so stale after that kind of time? Or do I call it a day now & start searching for someone who will great me affectionately each day & actually want to spend time with me ????

Do you still love him? Do you want a future together? If the answer to those questions is no, then it is time to call it a day.

For me it was when he went away for a week to shag someone else visit a friend, and I realised I'd had the most peaceful, least stressful, happiest week that I'd had in 5 years.

If your marriage isn't a happy one (marriage should be happy not just ok) and there's no chance of things changing so that you make each other happy then that's it.

If you don't then you are denying each other the chance to be happy be being monogamous to somebody who doesn't make you happy. What a wasted life that would be

This is the problem:

We're not intimate or loving. He sleeps on the sofa. He doesnt help with the kids or housework very much. He's just kind of there. Sharing the house. We don't talk or have a laugh.

That's not a marriage or a partnership. That shows a complete lack of interest and respect towards family life. Why isn't he contributing towards the DC or the housework?

Maybe you've got yourselves in a rut for various reasons, which you can get yourselves out of with a concerted effort, but you need to have that conversation about what you both want. And any goals you agree on (e.g. he spends time with the DC, he cooks three times a week, you have a date night, etc) have to be lived up to and with you each taking equal responsibility for organising them - not one person doing it all and the other just co-operating.

If this fails, you don't have a relationship to leave in the first place.

Joysmum i disagree, life isn't always plain sailing, there are stresses and strains that can take their toll on a relationship. I have been with my partner for 23 years and we love each other deeply, there have been times within our relationship that due to other stresses it has been like the OP's relationship, at other times, extremely volatile and shouty. Either one of us could have walked away during those times because i doubt either of us were "happy". At the moment, we are "happy" and thats great - but sometimes a relationship has to be worked at and you have to take the rough with the smooth in life, not just give up if you hit a bad patch.

There has been no sleeping on the sofa and DP has always engaged with DD. As have i - the not sleeping in the same bed would be a deal breaker for me i think.

I think you both need to have an honest and frank discussion about what you really want.

We go round in circles, saying we'll make an effort & change but nothing ever does.
We got a stalemate after arguements, stop speaking then a few days later fall back into living along side each other again.
Today I've just seen a photo of him with his daughter & ex partner in his Facebook page. His Daughter uploaded it.
Over the years they have both caused me so much shit & has never once took my side, same with his parents, they hate me but we won't speak to them about it. But this photo of the 3 of them together has really boiled my blood. I don't expect him to not have photos with his other daughter but I do expect him to draw the line at posing for "family" photos with his ex after all the shit she caused me.

Hi headoverthere.

My father's family have caused my mother so much grief over the years too, and even when my mother tries to talk to my father about how she feels, he pretends as if it isn't happening. My mother always feels as if he doesn't take her side when his family's behaviour is disgraceful. I look at my mother and wonder how she puts up with that stress on a day-to-day basis.

My response may not help you, but that would be enough to question my relationship with the other person, having seen what my mother has to put up with. In your case it's not the in-laws, but not getting on with any 'family' from the partner's part would be enough to make me reconsider what I want. They are always going to be there and always be a part of his life. Unfortunately that can't be changed, but you can change the type of life you'd like to live. I personally couldn't carry on in the relationship if that shit was coming to me constantly for no reason.

Nosirrah
Thank you for your insight into a different angle.
It is my inlaws too, because they have sided with this previous "family" over me. I use the term family poorly as they were together for 2 years aged 17/18 & had a child. So not exactly the romance of the century. We have been together 18 years but it's clear to me his. Parents prefer their firstborn grandchild (now age 23) & her mother, to me & our child.
To give a brief snapshot of the relationship of ex family & me, I had many many years of jelousy on their part & got constantly blamed for DH not seeing or supporting his 1st child (his choice, never mine) then when I became pregnant I got daily abusive messages from 151st daughter & her mother along the lines of "we hope you lose the baby" and even threats to batter me! After I got the police involved this all stopped & I said then the 1st daughter would never have a relationship with my child. This I have stuck to but every now & again he asks if she can meet her, which of course I refuse.
But his parents seen to think I am in the wrong for preventing my child from meeting the one who wished her dead! So now I have zero contact with any of them, I'm not even allowed in their house! Which is fine by me, however my DD, age 4, is now questioning why I never go to Nanas house with them.
My fear of us separating is alsI hinged on the fact that he will then no doubt introduce my DD to his 1st child, as he says she has changed now.
Its just a total mess ????

We don't spend time together & seem to spend more time arguing about seperating than we spend planning our future.
We're not intimate or loving. He sleeps on the sofa. He doesnt help with the kids or housework very much. He's just kind of there. Sharing the house. We don't talk or have a laugh.

Yet you don't think that there's a trigger?

The originalLEM

I can only assume you're reacting to the first half of a sentence without having read the second

If your marriage isn't a happy one (marriage should be happy not just ok) and there's no chance of things changing so that you make each other happy then that's it

What is the timeline in terms of relationships and children born?

Oh no, I totally feel for you and can't blame you for the way you're feeling. I think you've done exactly what I'm sure the majority of us would do in your situation out of principle (re not letting the 1st daughter see your child cause of wishing them dead).

I feel that, in the long run, you will continue to grow apart as individuals and the situation will not improve. The relationship could be salvaged if you both made a conscious effort to improve it. Have you maybe thought about seeing a marriage counsellor to get an outsider's view on your relationship (that's assuming you want to work at your relationship, which I think you do)? They've probably heard it all before, and could possibly offer solutions which you both may not have thought of?

Also, sometimes men think us women nag at them all the time, and having a counsellor point out your husband's behaviour might make him look at himself differently and give him the kick up the bum he needs.

Vivacia I guess I don't feel like there's a trigger because it's been like this for many many years now.
We've been together 18 years. 4 years ago we had our child. Since having our child We have very much grown apart. When she came home from hospital he moved into the sofa & hasn t moved back into my bed. He says I put him last, says it's child, pets then him, he's probably right too but I've told him that's because he put himself there. He removed himself from our relationship when he moved out of our bed. I've told him to go numerous times. Told him today I want a break from our relationship, but he never goes, just hangs about till my mood softens. He could go back to his parents but he won't. Says he has to save up & get somewhere else to live before he can move out.

If hed just go its be so much easier.

I done a live chat with a relate counsellor & it didn't really help apart from the last question she asked me which was "how bad does it have to get before you say goodbye?"
Reading between the lines I think after all I told her she probably thought it was a list cause too!
Just as an insight here's a message I sent him just yesterday when he asked if I was implying he was a bad dad:

I'm saying your behaviour, at times, is bad.
Do you think it's acceptable to shout & swear in front of her?
To say you are leaving in front of her?
To tell me to shut up & speak to me the way you do in front of her?
Put your hands over your ears when I'm talking to you in front of her?
Do you think it's acceptable to not want to do something with her because football is on ? or because you've been at work all day? or you're tired?
Being a good dad & a good husband is a full time job & you have to make an effort. If you put nothing in you get nothing out. Simple as that.

He never replied. This is also a huge issue, we communicate by text mostly, any important or difficult conversations are had by text, not face to face as inevitably he ends up shouting or just not listening to me & pulling faces like a child whilst I talk.

Was he still with her when you two got together?

No, they'd been split up years & her had 2 other relationships since. She's just hated me from the start & blamed me for him not wanting to play a big part in their childs life. Which isn't true as I never asked him to stop seeing her once, even when she was being vile with me.

Just wanted to share with you that my relationship of ten years very recently ended and some of your situation sounds familiar.Things had been stagnant for around five years, a year ago I started to make my OH aware that I was unhappy and needed more emotionally from him. Nothing changed, our physical relationship was non existent and he didnt really see a significant issue. I posted for advice on here at the beginning of last week and since then my relationship has finished. I am incredibly sad but know deep down in the long term it is for the best. We all deserve that chance at happiness.

One day I realised my heart sank when I heard the key in the lock when he came home.

I knew then.

Well done on being so brave hidingbehindsmile, I guess I'm just scared I'll do this & then regret it & when I do he'll have moved on already. I also have my DD to consider as obviously she doesn't want us to split up, but I also have to think of the image of "family life" that we are imprinting on her.
I really don't know what to do. Part of me thinks I won't meet someone else who likes the same stuff as me or who'll be affectionate every day & so then I think is it not just better to stick this one out as at least we have shared happy memories in the past & my DD has her M&D at home with her.

I know what you mean about stepping in to the unknown, when we were having the discussion to end the relationship my ex said he didnt think he could find anyone who is interested in the things he likes as we were quite similar on that level. Its probably one of the main reasons we stayed together so long. The truth is sometimes couples have very different interests and that can make for a good relationship too.

We have nothing in common really expect for our DD & we like our holidays.plus of course there's the past 18 years of memories. I guess what I mean is I could potentially end this & find the grass isn't greener, it's just another bloke but this one isn't my DD's daddy. I also worry about introducing anyone new to my DD. I would have serious trust issues about anyone new forming a relationship with her. I work with ex offenders & i'm all too aware appearances can be very deceptive.