worried about ds's relationship with my parents

[2and2makes5]

I've namechanged for this.
Since my 2 boys spent a week at my parents last summer, the eldest has seemed unsettled when they visit or we visit them and for the week or so before we go / they arrive. They had stayed there twice before with no problems but when we picked them up last time, they were like zombies, really exhausted. They were 6 and 3. On questioning Ds1 said it was just too long and he would be fine to go just for a couple of days, but when we came to take them at Christmas the behaviour was really bad until we said you don't have to stay, we can just visit and come back with us. Even then his favourite cuddly toy was much in evidence when we were there.

Next week we will be stopping at their house on our way to our holiday. They won't even be there but Ds1 seems anxious nevertheless.

I will say we put this down to them bickering amongst themselves, not keeping to the routine, doing too much and overtiring them. But surely not a year later, so now we are worried it may be something more sinister. Does anyone have any thoughts on this.

No, no thoughts really apart from why on earth you suspect your parents of something ' sinister' . I'm sure they'd be delighted to know this

Unless you're going to drip feed now

I would hazard a guess that your parents bickering drove him mad (I couldn't spend more than 48 hours with mine because of it). He felt a little abandoned, going off for a whole week. They probably don't do the modern thing of positive parenting (maybe he got old off a lot by people who aren't used to six year olds).

Going back there reminds him. He didn't have a nice time. So maybe don't repeat it. They can have a nice day out instead.

Just a guess though.

Six is really little, I did leave my six year old with their grandparents who only sees them once or twice a year for a few days, but she found it a long time and was pretty clingy on my return. It's got easier now she's 7/8 but even then they don't always want to go. Rowna is right, sometimes your parents don't quite parent in the way they are used to, mine got told off and it upset them much more than if I had told them off.

JC - I really don't want to think that, I just don't understand why its still affecting him 12 months on. At our house they are much more 'on their best behaviour' as I will pick them up on any side comments about each other.

Rowna -They've been pretty good with him and his little brother in the past and had stayed twice before quite happily. It was actually 5 days after staying with them there for 3 days.

Unfortunately due to the distance we visit them or they visit us, day trips are not practical.

Ds1 is having nightmares for a few days before they visit us/ we visit them.

Hi op

If you was to flip the reason for posting to my son playing up and having nightmares when going to my parents. I would say its maybe because he is having issues with leaving you, sometimes kids go through a really clingy stage, around this age my son developed a fear of death, and would t leave my side bade dreams the lot.

Maybe some bed time stories and some quite mummy son talks under the quilt, this sort of time when they are more relaxed allows them to articulate more how they are feeling. If you try and find a story about kids staying away from parents etc he could express maybe how the character in the story might be feeling, this would give you an insight in to his thoughts too.

I don't think you should overthink this. Small children are creatures of routine and love the familiar. A different house, different bed and so on is unsettling. That's probably all it is.

5 days is quite a long time for a 6 year old to be away from home in an unfamiliar place with relatively unfamiliar, older people. If I had a crappy 5 day holiday a year ago I would remember it - and I imagine a 6 year old would remember a crappy holiday far more vividly than I would.

I find it very odd that without any other background and without any suggestions to that effect from your kids that you would think there was anything sinister to this.

Thanks Guilty the book is a good idea.
Jennifer yes I probably am overthinking and we really try to get my parents to stick to the routine as we know it helps them feel secure but they think we are too strict and let bedtime slip etc.

When I was little I used to stay at my grandmothers'. Both of them (both single). I loved staying with one, although probably had a cry now and again missing "mummy". I don't remember it well but she looked after us a lot with working parents so her house was like a second home. Easy to adjust for overnight stays.

The other I hated. Eventually my dmum stopped sending my siblings and I went alone or with a cousin. She didn't do anything to us but she was very strict. She had a full itinerary (like your parents it sounds) and we did what she'd planned for "fun". And it should have been fun. But sometimes we didn't want to do something (say, go the park)...but we had to! Other little things included having to go to bed earlier than at my parents, sleeping in a strange house, new foods, being forced to finish dinner (clear your plate sort of mentality). I also used to enjoy "playing out" with friends and obviously couldn't do this whilst at my grandmothers.
Basically, how much do you think that plans are led by the grandparents rather than kids? Perhaps they just don't enjoy what they have to do.

Plus, a week is a really long time, IMO.

How often do you visit? I think unless you are there a lot (most weeks) the kids are likely to feel unsettled. It's just quite a strange place to them. Bickering will not help.

I see your point op - it's hard to say really isn't it.

But I'd think it's more to do with being away from you and home rather than anything sinister.

May be nothing, may be something. But I don't feel you should ignore a child's evident anxiety. Have you been able to talk to him, quietly and safely, about this? Has anything shown up in his drawings, play or stories?

If its really upsetting your children, don't make them go any more.

It might indeed be something sinister - but they'll be safe if they're with you.

Next time you're talking about a non-stay visit, mention casually that if there's anything at all they want to tell you, they can and you're always on their side. Don't push or suggest, just be willing to listen.

Ds1 is having nightmares for a few days before they visit us/ we visit them.

Don't know how I missed this. It sounds serious to me. What kind of 'serious', I've no idea. But I feel it's unwise to dismiss it.

A simple telling off, or a careless remark like "the wind might change and your face will stay that way" just as an example, can really upset a child in an unfamiliar place. I don't think you have to suspect anything "sinister" on that basis alone. What does your son say when you ask him about it?

When I was five, I stayed with my aunt for a few weeks when my parents were moving house (new house was semi derelict). She (and my cousin, who was 17) were really odd with me. They used to hit me for no reason, and then alternately bombard me with love, and really nice treats, like a riding lesson, a day at a safari park. My parents used to visit frequently, and my aunt made me tell them that I was having such a nice time that I didn't want to leave - they were happy with this, it gave them more time to get the house sorted out, and they finally picked me up the weekend before I started school. I cried all the way home in the car, and told my Mum I wanted to leave weeks ago, but they wouldn't let me. She had no idea - when they visited, I was always really full of what we had been doing, the things we had done, my cousin taking me shopping and buying me new clothes. So there may be more to your sons' anxiety than meets the eye. It wasn't the smacking so much that upset and confused me, it was the mind games. My Dad realised a few years later that his sister really was quite mad and cut all contact.

A week is a long time away from you to be honest if they are not with their GP all that often.

They so remember little things as pp says. I remember an auntie saying 'come on Make your mind up then' really sharply when I was about 5....remembered it always and was always wary of her.

I think your Op reads slightly as if you suspect something else though.

Jake - as I said he has nightmares when he knows they are going to visit or we are going to visit them, his behaviour deteriorates massively, he brings out cuddly toys that we haven't seen in months (comfort items). All seems a bit much for a bad holiday 12 months ago but I don't know how small minds work.
I certainly don't want to ignore his anxiety and say don't be silly you're going whether you want to or not. Nothing in drawings, does not draw really. When we ask him why he is worried / upset he makes up
nonsense about missing tv or something.

I think your son has explained it clearly to you "It was just too long and he would be fine to go just for a couple of days." 6 and 3 is very young to be away for a week.

It may not be 'nonsense' though. He was well out if his comfort zone (needed the familiarity of eg TV progs, routine he was used to) and it went on way too long, longer than he could cope with.

Could be something else, possibly, but he's already told you the key reasons it really unsettled him.

One of my brothers used to say he hated staying with the grandparents because it was boring. Turns out grandfather was secretly violent with him. I'm not leaping to any conclusions wrt to OP, just pointing out that children are easily scared into silence. I only found this out about my brother a couple of years ago.

daffs - I don't mean he said I don't like staying at grandma because she won't let me watch x programme. Rather if he is sleeping badly in the run up to a visit or behaving really badly and I've asked if he is worried about something he will complain about ME not letting him watch some programme. I don't think that's the real cause and I'm not sure if he can't or won't tell me.

Garlic - exactly my worry.
To whoever said before - yes we do say you can tell Mummy / Daddy anything, try to teach about right to say no if you don't want hug etc etc.