Feeling lost and lonely (ex had an affair and left us - WE ARE MOVING ON!)

[Dee34]

Hopefully, I have done this correctly?!

Old thread here Thread1

Hi All,

This is my first post on these boards, though I have posted my story elsewhere......I just cant seem to stop thinking and mulling over things and searching for answers

Bit of a long story, but to start from the beginning, on Tuesday 28th Dec my ex announced that he was not in love with me anymore (usual cliches about being best friends, love you but etc). This of course sent me into a tailspin as I had just endured an awful xmas at his parents in Scotland that he insisted we go to (dont get on with his folks as they have never helped us out with DS and ex always seemed to avoid confrontation and would never raise any issues directly with them which made for an increasingly tense atmosphere). For background, back in November when I knew I would not be able to hack another xmas there and so I suggested we stay here and have a little family xmas, he told me that I was playing with people emotions by changing my mind and that I could stay here at home if I wanted but he and DS (2.5 years old) were going to Scotland regardless!! I guess I should have sussed that something was a bit iffy but I just brushed it off at the time (by Nov, affair had been going on for a month and actually between Oct - start of affair - and the bombshell in Dec, there was a difference in ex's attitude which I only really pin-pointed in the last few weeks). Anyway, we had a terrible night on the 28th - lots of crying, very emotional etc. I asked him if he was seeing someone else and he said no. I asked him to swear on DS life (childish I know, but said this in the heat of the moment) to which he replied no, he won't swear on his life as he doesn't do that sort of stuff but he held his hands up and promised he was telling the truth. I of course believed him as for me this was all out of the blue..On the Weds, I was quite teary and by lunchtime ex was saying that he was confused, needed some space etc. I said how about he stay in a hotel nearby and come round every day to see DS, take him out etc. I even phoned up several hotels for him to check rates and availability! This was during DS nap and by the time I had gone upstairs to get him, ex had done a spreadsheet and had decided he wanted to go to San Francisco instead. Some fluff about always liking San Fran from work trips (he has been there several times in the past year for genuine work reasons). Again, naïve fool that I was I agreed to him going. We drew up a list of issues that we would both think and work through (usual - lack of sex, though we were trying for baby number 2, arguing, his parents etc) and agreed not to tell any friends or family about what was happening until we knew what was happening ourselves so no one could 'influence' us. So ex went to San Fran and DS and I stayed here (everyone assumed he was here with us during whole period). Anyway, as soon as he was in San Fran his tone and attititude completely changed and he became very distant (he was relaxing and not looking at the issues or given them any thought etc). I finally 'broke' on NYE and asked him what was going on etc and that's when he said he had met someone but that nothing had happened between them, which was actually a lie.

To cut a long story short, he came back on Weds 5th Jan, determined not to work things out. Over the weeks I have learnt that other woman lives and works in San Fran, they met on a work trip in mid Oct last year (in a bar - only kissed - met on the second to last day before he headed back to the UK), had DAILY contact from the time ex returned home, started sleeping together during his next work trip out there in early Dec (a 5 night work trip) and that he was with her all along when he abandoned us over NYE to go to San Fran - he was having a lovely holiday, planning his life with her, whilst I was here like a muppet, trying to get an appointment with a sex therapist (as I obviously had 'issues'!). She is 30 (7 years younger than us) and had moved to San Fran from Nashville in June last year, so seems to me like there were a couple of lonely fools that met over some cocktails? Ex keeps banging on about how she is leaving her life over there (not quite sure what she is giving up bar a job and accommodation compared to what he is gambling with) to be with him, how he loves her so much, never felt like this before about anyone including me - starting to make me a bit sick if I'm honest. If you added up all the days they had actually been together from mid Oct to just before that post xmas trip, it amounts to around 6-7 days actually physically together and they weren't even together 24/7 as he was actually working on these two work trips (have confirmed with a colleague). So it was just hooking up at night and having lots of fresh and exciting nookie? Rest has been built around a deep emotional attachement from their daily calls/text/emails/webcams etc (probaby worse than having random one night stands I think). I think that even now tally of days is around 16 or so when you add on the NYE trip. But that is enough for her to give up her life and job and move here to be with him and he reckons she will be here in 3 months time (until then they will be racking up airmiles). I just dont understand it at all......I guess they are soulmates or star-crossed lovers that were destined to meet?! Everyone keeps telling me that he will one day wake up and see what he has done or that they will break up as soon as she gets here, but the flipside is that they may be together for a long while and that is something that I am now trying to reconcile with - esp as she will effectively be playing stepmum to DS even though ex doesn't really know anything about her bar what she has told him and shown him during their limited time together (of course there is the very real possibility that he is even lying about dates and that this all started way before Oct. I don't know and to be honest, don't care now as all it would prove is that he is more selfish and a bigger cheat and liar than first thought)....

Throughout all of this, ex has been going on about he need to be happy and how he has acted out of self preservation. And he has variously been unhappy for the last few months, 6 months, 9 months, 15 months, 18 months depending on what mood you catch him in when you speak to him.....unhappy for so long that I didn't notice it and yet only gets the balls to leave once he meets someone else? I can accept that we didn't have a 100% perfect relationship, but we had been together for 11 years and of course share DS so am shocked and hurt that it ended in this way. For his part, ex varies between assuming no guilt and saying that the affair was symptomatic of our relationship to wanting to do 2010 over again and make different choices and regretting going to the US over NYE and for making us go to Scotland over Xmas (apparently, as I made the atmosphere so tense for everyone, this was the last push towards making him decide to leave us.....though he hasn't commented on how his dad did his usual show of drinking 2 bottles of wine on xmas eve and not bothering to get up until gone midday so we were all sat around waiting for him as usual...).

Anyway, since then things have lurched along. He has said some horrid things to me and treated me like a fool at the best of times. I think he is so deeply entrenched in his feelings for the other woman that he has forgotten I am DS mum (again, keep asking myself, how and why can he feel so deeply for someone he has spent barely any time with?). For me, the hardest part now is facing up to the reality that I will no longer see my son every day as we move towards shared access and custody. Also hard is the fact that this other woman will be interacting with DS as and when he is staying with them. I do secretly hope that they both go back to the US (surely to happen if and when they have kids and don't think she will wait around for long as she does seem besotted with ex for some bizzare reason - her FB profile is a pic of them in you guessed it an aiprort!...) and ex only comes back here on his tod to see DS for holidays (selfish I know, but I can indulge a fantasy I guess).

Is he deluded or am I???? He has been focused on work a lot and seems to have lost a lot of his friends and social life - which I had noticed and tried to encourage him to get back up again. I am just heartbroken that he could do this to us - esp the cold and calculating way he abandoned us to go to San Fran to be with her over NYE and the fact that in the last 7 weeks our house has now gone on the market (cant afford it myself) and I am now out looking for any old job to support myself (oh, forgot to say, that I had taken voluntary redundancy from a very well paid job last March with his encouragement! When I called him up on this he said, 'oh well, but you didn't like that job anyway!!!')......
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Inbetween all the crying and anger, I do feel like I am going crazy........This is playing on my mind a lot now as he has just flown out today to go and see her in San Fran (6 night holiday, so will take their tally up to 21-22 days or so). It pains me that he will be taking her out for meals, whereas I had to practically nag him to death to book a babysitter for our anniversary in Dec ('nagged' him, as I usually arranged everything and was in need of some attention after his work trip - of course, I now know why he wasn't that bothered...). He will be having cosy conversations and intimate chats planning their future for when she moves here and talking about our son.

Does it get better? Does anyone have a crystal ball and can tell me they wont last....??!!

And how can I move on? I have tried the whole no contact thing - which worked for a while, but then I broke and sent him a long message about how he had ruined my life.... . I have read a ton of post affair books (including not just friends) but still struggle to make sense of it all some days. I know that he will definitely not come back as he has said this several times as he no longer loves me and the deep feelings he has for the OW. Trying to be positive but it is so, so hard some days........

I think he has been listening to his new wife. In some areas in the US it is normal for summer born boys to start school a year later. With his loved up eyes, he will see whatever she says as gospel. I would gather info from the LA about starting later (ask the schools too if they can give you some) and send it to him.

To be honest I would stop trying to involve him in the decision and just apply for DS to go to the school you think is best. His school place will be choosen on your address not his father's, and no court would overturn you sending him to a good local school.
Actually even if the LA allowed your DS to be down a year, he would almost certainly have to skip a year at secondary (so go from year 5 into year 7; or more likely year 6 to year 8, both pretty disasterous).

In Scotland the cut of point is February/March I think not September.
Reception is a lovely gentle introduction to education. And I know plenty of summer born boys who are doing just fine (this is at 16).

Glad to hear from everyone else! Thought I'd kilt the thread...

Yes, it seems like your ex is probably listening to 'er indoors and getting his wires crossed Dee. My ex claimed though that I had to have his permission to apply for a school place for my ds here as the ex lived out of the borough (in another country in fact). Anyone know if there is any truth to that? He claimed to have phoned the school admissions board who told him, but I've never heard anything from them. He made a whole big song and dance about it actually and claimed in his affidavit that I had obtained a school place for ds FALSELY because I am such a DASTARDLY PERSON. Pot kettle frickin' black mister.

Welcome home Dolly! Isn't London wonderful at christmas? It's also wonderful in the summer (ice creams at the top of richmond hill is one of my faves). It's just wonderful full stop really isn't it. The whole richard-curtis-London-at-christmas thing was one of the things I really missed when I was away. Of course I know it's all chocolate box nonsense but I have a real soft spot for Love Actually and it used to make me very nostalgic at this time of year (not that I ever associated with the prime minister, or even colin firth - yum!). What will you be tucking into whilst you're here? Do they do 'proper' bacon in Australia? That seems to be top of the list for most expats. I'm still stuffing my face with 'proper' sausages, cream teas and the like (kidding myself I'm still in the settling in period). I'd probably have a bit of reverse culture shock were I not so steam rollered by everything else that's happened in the last six months - silver linings eh?!

My birthday is coming up soon and I'm afraid it's one of the Big Ones. I'm thinking about taking myself off for the day and night, with or without the kids, as ex was supposed to be taking me away for it (tickets booked and everything so I suppose he will be taking NW). Any ideas what I might do? Other than keep passing the open windows of course... What would you guys do?

Hello. It's almost like a Christmas Party with us all back isn't it (if it was a Christmas Party with a 'Fuck your ex wife/girlfriend/fiancee and bring your mistress theme').....

...Dee. As others have said, sounds like he has been talking to people from different countries. In Australia for example there is a huge trend for 'keeping boys back' until they are nearly 6 (and they don't go straight into year one they do the kindy/reception year too). You can also 'hold them back' at any point during their schooling....my DS will be just 5 when the oz term starts in Jan and I can't imagine not sending him then if he continues on the social/learning trajectory he is on but I do know lots of people who will. As others have said I would just carry on and if you get into conflict about it I can't imagine anyone would prevent you sending DS. It also sounds a little like your ex is flexing his 'caring father' muscles rather than genuinely not wanting him to go as if feedback from his childcare/kindy and others is that he is ready why would he want to prevent it?

Oh Well. Sounds like you are going through it at the moment, lots of kisses and hugs. It is shitty and holidays are shitty. Not to get pleasure from others misfortunes but remember all the happy families you see aren't all necessarily happy....bit bah humbug of me but still. I'm so enjoying being back although to your question on food lovely globalisation means you get pretty much everything over there. I will be having lovely Mum's turkey on Christmas Day (vs dry chicken at ex MILs) and have just snarfed a Terry's Chocolate Orange which you can't get in Oz (or at least I don't think so!!)

Now darling. In terms of your birthday I guess you need to decide do you want to spend it with kids, with friends or genuinely on your own? I think being on your own can be a nourishing and quite liberating experience but you have to really kind of know you want to rather than organising something and then being faintly/deeply depressed. I speak from experience as after a break up about 9 years ago (not ex H) I want to Paris for a few days and had an amazing time but about 9 months ago organised a w/end in the City to cheer myself up at reasonable expense and nearly paused at open windows. I think it may end up nicer to spend it with either friends or your children....or a random group of Mumsnetters ; ) but you know yourself best.

Not for your birthday but I also read this article in the ES magazine about a restaurant and thought 'oh if i were in London this is the type of place I may go to when I dont' have DS'. I haven't been there/eaten there so buyer beware but sounds nice.....

Dolly xxx

Simple pleasures
Ducksoup, 41 Dean Street, W1

Following in the footsteps of Polpo and Copita, Ducksoup is the latest super-trendy boutique wine bar to spring up around Soho. With stripped floors, whitewashed walls, hand-scrawled wine lists and a menu that changes daily, it's run by owner Clare Lattin and head chef Julian Biggs, who met while working together at Hix Oyster and Chop House. (Clare is also the publicity director at Quadrille, which published Hix's books, as well as being his ex-girlfriend.)

Clare saw a lack of affordable and unintimidating bars in London where you could pop in, even alone, to eat a quick dinner with a glass of extremely good and reasonably priced wine. 'In Paris you can go out and have one plate and a glass of wine and you've spent a tenner, but you just couldn't do that in London. I live on my own in De Beauvoir Town, so I don't always want to go home and cook. The idea of being able to pop into a place that isn't too formal where you can sit at the bar, have a glass of good wine and something to eat and be home by eight is very appealing. People do that here; we get a lot of women who come in by themselves. In fact, on Friday nights we normally have more people on their own than in pairs.

'Ducksoup is an amalgamation of all our memories and experiences,' she adds. 'It takes a bit of all the places where we've enjoyed eating and drinking on our travels. There is a tiny wine bar in Copenhagen that I stumbled across, just a table and lots of different wines. You could order as much or as little wine as you liked, and eat from a really simple menu. Then, on a wine trip to Burgundy, I went to Le Verre Volé; it's a natural wine bar with no list - they just recommended what to have - and the menu was chalked up on a board. Julian and I have always been great fans of Terroirs, too; we love the natural wine movement so our list nods to that.'

There are no plans to open any more branches at present. 'I only had one burning idea in my head, something timeless,' says Clare.
( 020 7287 4599 ; ducksoupsoho.co.uk)

ooh and one whinge. former husband (I like that better than ex husband - super posh mum's friend told me she prefered that term and currently I want to be her so I am going with it) emailed aforementioned catty email on Sunday about lack of contact and NOTHING since - no reply to my 'nice' email. This makes me think he is tropical holidaying with mistress turned girlfriend prob about to be wife somewhere with no email access. I know its none of my business (need a kick from Patience) but tres annoying given he made a fuss about me apparently being non contactable when he had the details. Despite the fact I obviously didn't know him that well, I know him enough to know he means how annoying you don't have mobile I can text you on as that is the only manner I can as I am swanning off with my big pots of cash and not on computer or mobile internet but I can't tell you that as it 'makes me look bad' so I'll just turn the tables and virtually shout at you instead. Fucker. Sorry. Have flu, paracetamol and now nearly 2 x gin and tonics. About to take 2 x temazapan as got sleeping tablets from dr for first time in year to deal with jet lag. bit like valley of the dolls round here without the hairspray xxx

Thanks everyone for the spot on advice (confirmed with a couple of friends who are primary school teachers - I thought I was going barmy on this as ex was insistent that DS be kept back). Laid out all the advice and above points to ex in a VERY CLEAR email. Got a surprisingly 'humble' response where he thanked me for laying things out very clearly for him (and spending the time to do this!) and that what I had written was the most compelling thing he had read in terms of position to take.....honestly, it is so bizarre it is bordering on bonkers. Happy to let it go now, suggested that he make himself an appointment or two at the schools in the new year (am betting that wont happen, but have said my piece now), but I dont want to discuss this again with him (definitely not this year).

I was also thinking that he had been 'influenced' by someone with a US background as thats what always happens in US TV dramas/films that involve teens. I got into a bit of panic as he was literally like a dog with a bone and would not let go of this point. Highly worrying that he can be like this and yet not even know the full facts of what he is spouting. Though like Springy suggested above, I would have laid bets that ex would never have taken this approach before (i.e. he would have been more reasonable, would have done his research etc). I do think its a bit of asserting his position as DS' dad (esp as he couldnt make it to the schools - again, bizarre that he was hell-bent that DS be kept back a year and yet he has not even stepped foot in one school to inform his decision) and maybe reminding me that he is in control here (could give you all a laugh by repeating his stunned response that maybe I could meet someone and move away from the area - as has been said, dont think that he planned for me to deviate from his well thought out script and my place - at the bottom of the heap, doing his bidding, weeping over him and how I have lost him). One good thing about this interaction - even though I got that pit of my stomach feeling in terms of bracing myself for another row, I also felt detached from ex on a huge level. I mean, I felt totally disengaged with him and felt like I was looking at this from the outside. My overriding feeling today has been one of 'thank goodness I dont have to live with a man that can act like this and come up with such nonsense from an ill-informed position'.

So, huge, huge thanks again. A slightly crap experience, but another good learning point and a leap of MY OWN emotional intelligence/development in the right direction away from ex.

Dolly - quick one about thinking about your ex....please dont think this! Easier said than done and I remember being haunted of images of ex and newgf/wife having cosy love-ins, whilst I was catching up on endless chores or soothing DS to sleep. Even happened recently when I mused about them and how he could spend xmas here with her now and couldn't for me. But even that now seems like water off a ducks back. I keep coming back to the fact that I would rather be here by myself/with DS than be with ex as the person he now is. New wife is very much welcome to the so-called new and improved version. Honestly, he looks so miserable some mornings when he comes round for DS, I am half tempted to give him an olive branch to get the gossip on what the latest is in paradise, but wont go there as not that interested and certainly dont want him to think I am interested in him (of course, he could be utterly miserable at the thought of having to see me, but them's the breaks for him! ). Someone once wrote on here that we have no idea of what is going on behind closed doors or even what is going on in our ex's minds and their own (possible) mental battles with their situations. Remind yourself of what your ex has done/is doing when those thoughts creep in and remind yourself that he is not the person you knew. Whilst he is taking romantic strolls (if he is indeed doing that), she will know deep down that he cheated on the mother of his child, his wife for her - who's to say he wont do it again? Keep thinking of the bright future that lies ahead for you and your DS - roll on 2012!

Dolly - how are you doing today? Hope you are busy having a fab time with friends/family/DS in the UK [fmsile]

Slight update - been on the phone to the local authority and they are sending some stuff in the post, so will be able to challenge (or at least profer some proper evidence to him, though doubt that he will come back on this again). Also forgot to say thanks for the words of reassurance from those that have summer borns and how your DCs have adapted, coped and thrived.....

Well - birthdays.....hmmm, I would definitely take myself off somewhere if possible day and night. Will you have your DCs? How about somewhere you have always fancied visiting? Or a pamper day (lots of deals seem to be on - at least in our area). Or try something random (those deal websites have a few experience type days on for reduced prices?). Or do something at home and treat yourself in some way? My bday is in Feb and a couple of friends insisted on dragging me out for a meal and drinks which was good medicine though so just wanted to stay at home and do nothing all day/evening (stupid ex sent me a card saying something like 'all the best for the future' - this was 5 weeks after his bombshell and in the week where he was 'playing' me with wanting to take me out for a meal to discuss our future etc and talking about dating again whilst then OW/new girlfriend/now wife was literally winging her way here - she was actually staying with him on my birthday and that meal he had planned for us was convenientley scheduled for the afternoon after ex would have dropped her off at the airport in the morning. Needless to say once I got wind of that (air-dryer/clothes horse gate!) the 'date' was called off and my eyes started opening a bit more to the reality of the situation..... BUT, I am rambling!). What do you feel like doing?

No time to respond properly but just wanted to wish you all a wonderful christmas and a new year with strength, solace and peace xxxxxxxxx

And a merry Christmas to you Well and indeed everyone else. Hope that the seasonal holidays have been good fun and better experiences for anyone that had a crappy time last year...

Things have been good here. Have my mum, aunt and sister over (they are off on Weds). Have troughed too much (good job bootcamp starts up again in Jan! May need to do a detox before then though...) and guzzled wine like its going out of fashion. DS has had/is having a good time (I think/hope). I have had him from Christmas Eve evening through to Thursday am when ex comes over and picks him up and...takes him to Scotland for belated celebrations there. Am 'okay' with the idea in that I knew it had to happen sooner rather than later. Am biting my tounge with the knowledge that this time last year, I was there with ex and DS (admitedly having a crap time, so I am not missing that aspect at all) and that ex was discussing his then OW with his Dad whilst I slept upstairs and that he was secretely testing and calling her from the bedroom we were sharing. And pushing down any thoughts of the glowing new ideal family unit having fun. Also, ex says he won't need DS' passport so even more relaxed now as still wouldn't put it past him to do a flit there...So, I have a few days of r&r (and missing DS) to fill in....Have thought long and hard about some of the positive words and advice on here and the mantra that 'this too will past'. I thought I would have a wobble and put on those rose tinted glasses and have a memory/cry about ex/us but (thankfully) it hasn't happened (yet). Course, may come later this week when DS is away...I had to dig deep to distill my anger when ex disclosed that he would be going away with new wife today and tomorrow. Only found out after I asked ex to bring something DS had left at his (thinking he was around the corner). No, they were away, but he could come back from wherever they were (alone) for a couple of hours and drop off stuff and also spend time with DS or perhaps me as well if I was free, so DS could see us together as his parents. Beyond bizzare and I turned down his offer (can't be having a rocking time if he wants to spend time with me of all people). He then asked if I was free on Thurs (handover day for DS) for a possible playdate with DS (again, said no. I felt bad in that I just don't feel like I could do it right now - even for DS' sake and I feel utterly selfish for that. But I think even though I am doing okay at the moment, coming up to the anniversary of when this all kicked off on NYE will mean that I may possibly lash out and even if I didn't, I don't think I could fake a friendly atmoshphere/attitude with ex for an hour plus and DS may pick up on it..). I have had a flurry of photos from him of DS (am guessing over the last few days when he has been at his dads). I begrudgingly* bought him a cheapo pressie from DS (a Lynx box-set on discount at Tescos), only as it was a pressie from DS and it is nice (I guess) for DS to give his dad a present and learn the whole giving gifts thing. And that's that.

I really need to start 2012 on a positive note and without any nonsense from ex. So am determined to follow that path (knowing that I can do a hell of a lot myself to limit my exposure to any crap, deflect any mini bombs etc). I feel like this past year has been an almighty steep learning curve and there are times when I feel like I cant wait for 2012 to come round to move on and get past the 'this time last year' pits....

Hope everyone is well and taking good care.

• Would have rather it wasn't done begrudgingly on my part as means I have a lot of work to do on mastering my zen like state of positivity and moving on from the past! But DS felt good I think handing the present over.

PS: Writing this whilst family have hogged the TV controls!

Dee, Hi

Sorry I have not been around, its just been busy and I would write and write if I could grab the time. I have followed your thread and its lovely to see you coming through this and having the guts to say 'no' to you Ex and his Ego.

I always knew that you had inner strength and that your love for your DS would pull you through all of this. Its more than a match for your Ex and his recently acquired wife.

The thing is that their break-neck speed romance and even speedier visa securing wedding means that all the things he could do to keep the momentum going have run out. He's down to the bare bones of himself now and he's actually married this time. He's invested a lot in this new relationship and the glow of his money only lasts a certain amount of time. There's noway that he will suddenly have become Mr Generous. Wonder if she's clocked that yet. Plus, he has a son and Ex. When you're in the heady romancing stage of a relationship, you promise the earth and say that nothing's a problem. Wonder if she feels the same now with a slimy git, stuck in the UK... has she met his family yet? Of course, that will be another joy for her to relish!

Dee, you are doing everything right. Don't ever feel sorry for him. He's a complete tosser and you are worth so much more. Keep being a step head of him... he'll soon work out that he'll never catch up with you and, despite him telling you he's happy, he'll always know that leaving his own child will give him nightmares for many years.

Hi Darl

Glad your Christmas was lovely and that you are managing to keep going with the detachment - it sounds like with his overtures about playdates etc etc he isn't making it easy but sounds like you are doing well! I shall take inspiration from you as having a bit of crash down to earth day today. Christmas Day and Boxing Day were OK and I was making a real effort to be cheery and fun and enjoyed seeing my nephews play with DS etc etc and was OK company I think but today I think the effort of that combined with a few other things that shoudn't matter so much have sent me on a bit of a spiral downwards. Essentially ex didn't reply to any emails about arranging time to speak to DS but did call him on Christmas Day - when they had finished I asked him why he hadn't responded to emails and he claimed he had not received them. I said that I found that hard to believe but resend to work address - he said that I had an amazing capacity to turn any conversation unpleasant and that he did not want to have any unpleasant conversations on Christmas Day. I said I can understand that so lets finish the conversation and (childishly I know) put the phone down. He then phoned back to say did you you put phone down and listen to me I did not receive emails etc and I said OK thanks and put phone down again. He then called back but this time DS was around and heard phone so I just handed phone to DS to say Daddy has called again because he didn't get enough kisses or something and then after they had spoken put the phone down and he didn't call back. I forwarded the emails (about arranging Skype contact) to his work email to get a response that he is away for a MONTH and one and offline etc....now I know he can do what he likes and it ISNT my business but I guess the thought of him having so much time with OW and the fact he is using NO holiday to spend with DS plus the fact he has so much $$ to spend on holidays is annoying. My ex FIL also emailed today to say thankyou for gifts etc and said that as he expects I know ex is on his way to New York.....again, he can do what he likes I get that but it just seems so odd that he keeps all this from his son (who I guess is so small it doesn't matter) so I guess what I mean is that I am pissed off by it but I also know I have no right to. Does this make any sense? I am trying to work out why I feel so awful today. I think I am jealous of his freedom to a degree (although of course he has the very thin end of the wedge as he does not get to see DS) and also I was in love with him for so long that it is hard to switch off emotions and hard to know he and OW are fricking trotting around Central Park in care free manor. God I'm divorced now, its been over a year but still it hurts so much and I feel I have very much slid down the ladder. It also isn't helping that he has not paid child support this month or some money he owes for an essential repair to house that he agreed to pay half of so have zero money and having to chase him for that. It all feels so very very far from what I wanted my life to be. Pity fest over. Kick me someone x

Hi McNaughty - how are things with you? Hope all is well and that you had a lovely Christmas.

Thanks hugely for the kind words - as always, means a lot.....I do need reminding at times that ex is not some dreamy Mr Darcy that I have lost out on (though think he has carved himself out as such).

Yes, she has met his family - once - way back in April when she was here for a flying in and 'meet the family' trip (which by then would have been the fifth chunk of time ex had spent with her since they met in Oct 2010. I still look back in wonder and am amazed that he/they had talked about getting married at this stage (or indeed earlier)). I have nothing against a good old romance but it sits at odds with ex as I knew him (of course, maybe I never really knew him!) and the fact that he entered into this not as a single man with no attachments, but with DS in the background. He still trots out the lines that new wife will never want to move back to the US as she knows that DS is ex's priority ('duh, Dee34, that's why she moved here in the first place')....of course they have that one and only crystal ball where they can forecast their future (once she has her own kids, she will never crave to raise them back in the US, where ex's £ will go further as a $ etc etc - and mine; ex thinks I should be able to find a new partner amongst the pool of available men in our town so I don't need to move elsewhere look elsewhere. Old convo I have already repeated on here, but now, I just shake my head and feel pity for the man (and her a bit). But, think I have stopped feeling sorry for him (though get the occasional stab of sentimental chords stuck in my head wrt DS).....Funnily enough, they (his family) did not attend the wedding (though not that much of a shocker as it was abroad) and have not been down since their visit here back in April (in the old days, they would have been down for August for DS' bday and again in Oct for ex's mum's bday - but I think its more to do with the fact that they no longer have access to that second large en-suite we had in old house and the large garden/rooms they could lounge around in all day. Also suspect that ex knows how much of an arse his Dad his and is maybe happy to keep everything separate for as long as poss. He already assured me back in Jan that he knew his Dad was a pain and that he would not let him pull any crap with new woman. Such a gent and such a catch ).

Am starting on a list of things I would like to do/achieve in 2012 - some highly ambitious, but hey, aim for the stars and all that....I feel like I am becoming the person I was back in the early days of being with ex. Slowly, slowly getting back to me again!

Dolly all completely normal,yep its none of your business but yep ur ex is an ARSEHOLE !!!!!Lets just leave it at that yeah ,the none of your business mantra is just that nothing good comes from going down that road ,your in a new chapter of your life yeah and its a better one.But feel ur anger ,work through it like any emotion then let it go .Just keep releasing the toxins and fling a few fucks about if you need to .THIS TOO SHALL PASS and you will come back stronger ,the wound from the split is still healing but dealing with a dickhead ex is very wearing ,big hugs and bring on 2012 xxxx

Loving your list Dee .....2012 with see us flourish !

Hello wise ladies - need your advice. Ex is just over a week late in paying his child support and half the home insurance (usually paid on 21st) plus half of a repair bill to longstanding issue on house which he agreed to pay in early December. He hasn't told me, but I know from FIL he is in New York. I have sent him 2 x emails, 1 x VM and have called him a couple of times but it rings out and can't leave a message. No 1. I really need money as in Oz you have to pay marketing costs for real estate agents upfront which has wiped me out and No 2. I am pissed off he has just swanned off on holiday and is seemingly uncontactable. It may well be his phone doesn't work in the US but as a father I would have thought you may have mentioned you were travelling and given contact details. Anyway oh MN jury. Should I a. continue emailing/calling him every few days until I get a response b. wait until he calls to speak to DS which I assume will be next week or so to ask him then c. ask his parents if they have any other contact details for him or d. contact lawyer. Don't really see the point of d. as it will cost me and I honestly assume the direct debit bounced back as he was OD or something rather than any malice in the non payment but royally fucked off as I'm not working/getting paid whilst I'm in the UK and have just had to pay a massive bill as a result of him banging his drum about selling house. Thoughts please (am attempting not to be too hair trigger going forward so really not sure of what is reasonable in this situation) - thank you xxx

Just so bloody controlling DD,he will know all this is happening and just remain passive ,try not to react to him because he will just give a patronising "calm down dear "
No advice on how to get paid unless it can be done legally ,sorry ,but empathise cos my ex pays £240 a year for 2 kids and i cant do anything about it x

Not sure if it helps as i'm more of a lurker then a poster but

Personnly I would contact your lawyer so a record is made of his non payments as if i remember correctly you have let other missed payments that he should have been making slide until you really need to use them . And I would also his parents and ask if they can pass on the message that he has not paid what he is due, and you have no option but to go to your lawyer.

He really is a B*D.

Yep many of them become bastards as soon as money is involved and they have a new partner .

Patience. I am truly shocked that the 'system' allows your ex to pay such a paltry amount for your two children. Even assuming he is on benefits, I am staggered that he is able to pay such an infintesimal amount. It makes me feel quite militant indeed. When I win the lottery I shall be setting up a grant type charity for single parents whose ex's turn out to be c*nts. Sorry darling. I am lucky by comparision financially. Thankfully your children have a tigress yet zenlike mother to make all well for them!! Where - thanks for your rallying words. I'm going to sit on it until Friday and then take action. It really isn't on and I really don't have any money. Fortunately I am in a position where I can easily borrow some from my parents (or come to that his parents) but I know that isn't the point and given he earns way in excess of £150K and has just jetted off to New York the least he could do is ensure that 5% of his fecking salary is transfered to his only son. And with that I shall aim to take Patience's lead and be calm (darling you should be a life coach ; ) x

Dolly - sorry, missed your last post before I uploaded mine! I dont have any other advice to add to the excellent advice offered already. I think wheredidiputits advice about contacting his folks first would be good. You have a good relationship with them, so you will have covered this base (if ex comes back saying you could have let my parents know etc. Not saying this is your responsibility at all, but then you will have done all that you can and may shame him into coughing up a bit quicker if he sees that his parents know what he is up to iyswim?). Second the legal route - esp of he has already missed payments........

Patience - will crack on with that list and totally agree about changes coming about with money and new partners at play. I wonder if ex would have been this much of a pain if he had gone off by himself and then maybe met a completely new/neutral person??!

Sorry - venting/offloading coming up.....

Right now, my heart is breaking as just had to wave off DS for his mini-holiday to Scotland. As he was going he mentioned new wife's name (had to bite my tongue at that. Definitely one of those moments when I could pull a 'rent-a-man' from my back pocket just so ex can hear DS mentioning another man's name. Bad I know!). Just before then, got into a mini argument with ex on the doorstep which was upsetting. I know that I wound myself up mostly here as started to mull over all the things that ex was now doing for new wife and DS (fair enough - know that for DS, these are things that he now has to step up to the plate to do, but still cheeses me off. E.g. he has a pile of presents for DS and yet, when we were together, he never once made an effort to get off his lazy backside and buy DS anything for his birthday or Christmas present. Fair enough, on the bigger purchases I made he would give me half the money, but he was never interested in suggesting what to buy or going round the shops/looking online, though think a fair few blokes/dads can be like this?! I have no idea....). His big reveal this time is that he will be taking DS into Glasgow to go and visit friends who also have children. Fair enough, they are/were ex's friends before I met him but the female half of this friendship - will call them A&B - used to email me and call me confiding in me that she thought her hubby was having an affair with his female boss. I used to poo-poo the idea, as did ex at the time, but it turns out that he was (only found this out in Jan when ex admitted it was true - when I compared our situation to theirs, he just said that their's was complicated!!! Which maybe means that the cheating man still loved his wife unlike my ex . Anyway, used to comfort her on that, and when she had a miscarriage a few years ago. When ex went to Scotland in Jan, I (to my shame) practically begged her to speak to ex and see what was happening. She said no, ex was her and hubby's friend first and foremost, wished me good luck in the future and then went on to upload photos of ex out on the lash with Scots friends on her FB page, whilst I was here in the UK, chewing my nails, dusting down my CV, looking after a bewildered DS and wondering what the f**k had happened in the last 2 weeks (this was two weeks after he got back from SF, dropped his bombshell etc. He had only gone to Scotland as I said to him I wanted him out of the house and he had nowhere to go in the UK/local area. This was also the trip where when ex phoned for DS, he passed the phone to his mum who was in the background who proceeded to babble to DS and not even say boo to me......those were the days). When we went to Scotland for xmas with DS last 2 years I always said lets go and see A&B, ex used to say, no, no time, want to spend time with my family. Now, he is going for 4 nights, which is a much shorter time than we ever went and, ah, oh yes, he can squeeze a visit in! I shouldn't ramble too much about him/them/situation as its in the past and I can see for myself the truth about the whole friendship thing with ex's friends (and to be honest, I have not missed them in the last year) but gets my goat at times......will let it out and move on and be thankful that I dont have to rely on ex or his friends for any emotional support.

And at today's pick-up, yet more suggestions of a playdate for all three of us. I think either ex is feeling sorry for me or he has been reading some parenting books or getting advice from other folk. This time, he says that he has clubcard vouchers that we can use to go on a day out, somewhere like Legoland. Have to admit, couldn't contain my contempt for this and curtly told him no thanks (hmmm, using vouchers from his shopping with new wife and then trundling up in a car for HOURS together?! And of course no empathy to think - hmmm, this time last year, I had just told Dee34 that I didnt love her and was secretly plotting to go to SF to visit my OW and pledge undying love to her.....maybe I should hold off on any silly suggestions for now....makes me feel like I am a tick in the box for him/them to be seen doing the right thing. Can imagine how keen he would be to shout that out from the rooftops if I had agreed or heaven forbid, there would be photos of all three of us plastered on his FB page !!! On Christmas Eve, he was banging on about watching some video clips from our last big family holiday to France and how he wanted to try and get copies done for me and how he was sad (and yet he was so, so miserable with me/family life), so think this is what is triggering all this playdate stuff and him going on about how he would like to do this for DS. Makes me feel guilty, as know DS would love it, but I just cant right now.......is this weird?

Phew long post, but that feels good. Head feels a bit lighter and feel ready to crack on with the list of things I have planned out to do whilst DS is away/before I head off for NYE....

PS: I have probably written complete rambling drivel above, but just needed the space to unload, else ex would be getting a very terse email. Feeling better already.

Hi Darling

I very much understand about the friend think rankling with you. I think it is human nature and however much you can 'understand' the position of the previously mutual but ultimately the 'other ones' friends, it does hurt when they continue to spend time with ex and OW. It IS understandable - and perhaps we would do similar in their position - but is also DOES hurt very much. When we were a couple a good friend of my DH split with his wife (her decision as he became a very highly paid functioning alcoholic and after rehab failed again she called time) and I continued to make overtures to be friendly to her whilst DH and me occassionally still seeing her DH but she eventually stopped returning my calls etc. At the time I was a bit hurt and in my married bubble a bit like 'gosh can't she understand I can be her friend and still see her ex' but now I TOTALLY understand that it was too much for her to deal with. It is also v. annoying that he is now finding the time to spend with them but I would also (I'm having to do this to myself) remind you that he was prob like that with you at first too until the mundane responsibilities of family life get in the way.

Playdate thing is weird given recent backdrop. Possibly a. parenting books b. wifey gets a bit bored doing these things c. he is in his own bubble and all along seems to want cake and eat it of which this is a good example (champagne and truffles with wifey and legoland and chips with Dee and DS)....as you say when and if you are in a place where you feel able to do this then it may be good for DS but not if you are going to be sitting there spitting bullets. You say that DS would love it and you feel guilty. He would feel worse if you want and he heard you arguing or picked up on the hostility so please don't feel bad about it. It may or may not come in time.

It seems we are on similar irritant paths. Having found out half of mortgage (for which he is legally obliged) not paid Nov and Dec as well as child support, kept calling ex mobile until he answered. As suspected 'oh thought i had, sorry will pay it - although slightly more irritated than that sounds and began with I have paid it, no you haven't, yes I have type conversation - anyway, that sorted called in DS to speak to ex.

Now given in Australia it would have been 4am in the morning he may have twigged that I knew he was overseas but no. DS says 'where are you Daddy'. ex says 'I'm in a big shopping mall'. DS says 'are you in Australia Daddy? Ex says 'I'm here there and everywhere DS' I'm too irritated at this point not to say 'its OK ex we know you're in NY, DS looked it up on the map and he thinks it sounds nice etc' as I couldn't face hearing him lie to him outright which I felt coming. DS then asks in manner of MI6 Al Queada operation being busted 'how do you know that'....I changed subject, DS got bored and left room. I told him his father had chattily mentioned it as he like most normal people would assume its not a state secret and that you would want to ensure I didn't call etc in middle of night/had contact numbers. He then said in very load patronising voice as OW was obviously glued to him 'You are being unecessarily unpleasant EW' I replied 'no I am pointing out that in my opinion being uncontactable re your son and not paying legally required bills is unacceptable but I will leave you now to enjoy your holiday'......honestly at the time shaking with anger but I need need need need need to try and switch off from this and just be transactional. I want to smash his stupid holidaying in expensive hotels, buying stupidly expensive gifts in shopping malls for adulterous girlfriend, being too lazy to pay bills properly, stupid fat head in. There. I feel better now too Dee after that vent....must be something in the air tonight....

on the upside, my parents are out at a party tonight so its me, a bottle of wine and the second series of Downtown Abbey to make a dent in....will finish the wine at least xx

Dee please don't feel guilty about saying no to ex.

Your ds does not need to see you doing things together.

He does need to see you both treating each other with respect. Speaking well of each other. Encouraging positive interaction with the other parent. Generally modelling responsible, respectful adult interaction.

That is how he will learn to be a kind, humane, respectful and responsible person himself. Not by playing happy families at Legoland!

You've come such a long way since you first started posting, you seem to have learned to detatch and see things objectively, putting ds and his needs first above your own inevitable feelings of hurt and rejection. That won't have gone unnoticed.

Tell ex simply that you think his suggestion of family play dates is inappropriate, and always will be, though you hope that you will always be able to communicate your mutual respect for each other to your ds.

bless u dolly re zen like tigress
re ex signing on {ran business into the ground after promising kids £400 a month}they have to pay £5 a week out of benefits regardless of how many kids,if he gets gf pg my kids money gets cut as i understand it.

think woman in the AB couple does whats shes told tbh x

shes def not a tigress with zen qualities

Still no time to reply properly but just wanted to give those who need it a big unmumsnetty super-hug. Ex has been here for 4 days seeing the children (goes home tonight thank god) and I am having the most awful time. He has now nobly and heroically told me that he has met someone else (but after we separated according to him and so therefore it was not cheating). Rather than rolling out the red carpet I seem to have surprised him by venting my spleen at him instead, which has been long overdue to be honest. Although I have always known realistically there was someone else, I am devastated all over again and really struggling. There is so much that I am sad and angry about (not just the breathtaking speed with which I have been replaced) but I think you have all been there and know the kind of man I am talking about - water off a duck's back and missing those qualities that are quintessentially human - and I know there is nothing I can do but avoid avoid avoid. I am so glad he lives in another country - every time he is here I am damaged by him.

He also expected to play happy families after his announcement which I was just not able to do, so I totally understand your feelings of conflict and guilt Dee. I am a human being with thoughts and feelings and needs, something which I feel has been denied to me for the last seven years living in his country, and I deserve to be treated like one and am doing the very best I can.

Roll on two thousand and fucking twelve. Just taking it a minute at a time at the moment. Each minute that passes is a minute further away from my ex and this pain.

Did you guys ever get to meet up by the way?

Dolly - please tell us more about the fabulous super posh lady with the former husband. We need some role models!

It will be the making of us it will be the making of us it will be the making of us (lather, rinse, repeat).

Kisses to all xx