Archers thread #184: It’s a shambles! And we don’t mean Casey Meats. Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you're looking forward to Morris dancing on the radio, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Right, to business. I can't say I'm delighted that the focus is on Rochelle and Casey Meats at the moment, because I'm not. All far too peripheral to Ambridge and too new. As I say ad nauseam, more farming storylines please, and where are all the long-standing members of the cast? The discussion about inheritance tax in The Bull the other night was a bit clunky, but what a refreshing change to hear two familiar voices, both farmers, talking about farming-related stuff, even if BBC balance meant they had to be challenged by two non-farmers, and even if it is months after the Budget introduced these changes. Ah well.

I was tempted to put one of my Dad's terrible jokes into the thread title as an oblique reference to George's coffin-making idea, but it wouldn't have made sense to anyone else. He loved referring to the cemetery as the Dead Centre of the island, so I was pondering something about Grange Farm becoming the Dead Centre of Ambridge. It could happen yet. Emma and Ed could provide willow branches and Clarrie could sit in the kitchen weaving them. Surely it must be similar to knitting?

Finally, if the SWs are lurking and looking for new storylines, it's been very dry recently and there have been lots of wildfires in rural areas. There was a bad one on Gaspmother Island a few days ago. Many farmers are very worried about this at the moment, as reported on Farming Today last week. But what am I thinking! This is a story that only works in a rural setting, so in the current incarnation of TA, it's not soapy enough.

Over to you!

Notice the long talk of Peggy 're VE Day? I think we are approaching the dad demise of true Archers royalty....I

Yes how exactly did Rochelle manage to escape the police when they came in response to Helen's silent call?? I thought she'd been bailed until rex started telling her to give herself in! He was absolutely right about her having traded on Job's good reputation in Ambridge.

And surely Vince would have been furious with Freddie, not all sympathetic?!

So we’ve had wall-to-wall Joy for months but when her daughter is finally publically unveiled as the village villain she’s nowhere to be seen? 🤷‍♀️

@EBearhug
This is a Bob Shop. They have a reputation for being dodgy - several have been raided by police for selling illegal cigarettes & vapes and temporarily close down but reopen again quite quickly. They're the place to go to if you need balloons & a nitrous oxide cannister - the current "high" of choice around where I live. The one in this picture is quite restrained, most of them are festooned with ropes of coloured, flashing LED lights.

Nah. Vince was the one discounted the camera. Being too taken up with his poorly mum.

My goodness you have just described my town center, it is exactly like this but with loads of nail bars.
Hope Rex doesn't fall for Rochelles crap. He should have just shut the cabin door in her face.As if you would listen to her story after what happened. Hope she is arrested and Joy moves away because she is ashamed of what her daughter did and Mucky Mick gives Joy the elbow because he didn't want to move and Helen buys Joy's house and we have no-more of any of them and we get back to farming and some Archer story line.
I hope we hear from Ruth soon but not the world's first lesbian.
At least we heard some goats and the little one was following Pat about which was cute.

Wasn't Freddie slightly sceptical about Rochelle when Vince first gave her the job without references etc? Of course, he then gave her full access.

Notice the long talk of Peggy 're VE Day? I think we are approaching the dad demise of true Archers royalty....

And they will probably balls that up as well.

Why was Pat slagging off bomber command?

All this talk about the Joy Rochelle show has me thinking back to when other new characters were introduced and then became very much key players in TA. It can and has been done really well.

Looking back to when Rob arrived and pursued a relationship with Helen. The natural, slow progression of real life panning out before us. We could all see the cracks and warnings signs long before the characters themselves could. It was a slow burn and we were all thoroughly invested. Meanwhile normal village/farming life and other shorter storylines went on around them. For some time TA was really the Helen and Rob show. But it worked. Even more recently, when Rob was dying, the writing stayed true to everything that had passed before and it felt believable. So the SW can do it, they CAN write (well, some of them). So why are we presented which such second rate tripe lately?

Details like Vince, the astute businessman, dismissing a hidden camera on his premises I just can't get past!

its odd isn’t it - eta I know there is a lot of controversy around their targets etc etc but I don’t understand why they make Pat bring it up all the time.

maybe on VE Day itself we’re going to get a little speech about war crimes and there being no winners in war and how we weren’t fighting the Germans but the Nazis (really annoys my german MIL!)

sadly the mentions of Peggy were to plug their little drama I would imagine

Probably because of Dresden. Seems to be a "woke" thing to do, conveniently forgetting that without bombing Germany we would have been unlikely to win the war.

I've got an awful feeling that Rex is going to Stand By His Woman.

I think three big reasons why so much of TA is so dreadful at the moment are:

1. Budget cuts appear to mean they can only use a few characters at a time so it is no longer possible for normal life (including farming) to go on alongside the main SL for all the other characters.

1. The SWs appear to believe that we all have the attention span of goldfish and that we can't cope with slow burn stories or remember anything that happened to characters in the past.

1. The SWs also appear to find TA (as it used to be) very boring and can't believe that listeners enjoyed it. As a result, they think they need to offer us a constant stream of short-term excitements in the style of East Enders however far fetched or out of character the SLs might be.

There's probably not much they can do about Reason 1 although I think they could manage it a lot better. But in my view 2 and 3 are the real problem - the SWs no longer understand or have any respect for their audience.

I believe WH Smith’s has vacated all its high street and mall premises now too - they’re focus is on fleecing transient shoppers at stations.

I agree with @BeatriceBatchelor. I also think Rex is going to stand by his woman and that we are never going to get rid of the ghastly Rochelle.

I'm a southerner, as are all my family, but I have loved the North-East accent since I watched The Likely Lads as a teenager and developed a crush on James Bolam (reinforced a few years later by When the Boat Comes In). One of Rochelle's major crimes as far as I am concerned is that her horrible whiny voice is absolutely ruining the accent for me.

It can’t be budget cuts though because they keep bringing in new characters, celebrity cameos etc

Local U3A speaker in June is a former producer of TA.

I used to work in manufacturing. We often had potential customers visiting to see the unique processes etc, and never would we have asked someone from the shop floor to show them round. It would usually be sales, often accompanied by the MD. If sales weren’t available it would be the MD and the factory manager.

A random newby from the packaging department is utterly unrealistic.

Also, Casey Meats is/was a big business, which was why David was so furious when Vince bought the small local abattoir - yet now it appears that’s where everything happens. All very weird.

I remember those days😂

I agree this is confusing, but what other reason could there be for concentrating on just a handful of characters at a time, while the others just stop existing? This is definitely a change in the way TA is written - although tbh I am struggling to remember when I first noticed it.

If it is budgetary constraints, the other thing that puzzles me is whether it is cheaper to employ the same 10 actors for a few weeks at a time rather than employing 10 different actors over the same period. If the cost is roughly the same, that suggests there has been a conscious decision to start writing in this way.

You would like to think all of the changes - small casts, short-term SLs, etc - were part of some well thought through approach by the creative team, but, if so, I wish someone would explain what they are thinking and what kind of audience they are aiming at as I can't work it out.

I agree, someone 'high up' and knowledgeable would have done the showing round, so production/operations director. At the very least someone who was knew the process well and able to answer questions. Never one of the operatives - although one or two of the more personable ones might have been included as a stop off for a bit of a chat.

They had to have some mechanism to get her a pass, but I've been watching Orphan Black on Netflix and it appears relatively easy just to pick a pocket and steal a pass and then wander around at will.

There were some nice bits last night - baby goat!!! And Rex rightly accusing Rochelle of trading off her mum’s good name locally.

Rex hasn’t had a shag since Theresa May was PM (approximately) so I expect he won’t hold out long and he and Rochelle are going to continue their Romeo and Juliet romance where instead of warring families it is the war over bacon.

I think the real problem is that the well established people in this story - are mostly fairly newish themselves. Yes in a normal series having been around for years like Joy and Vince and Rex would be enough but in Ambridge we’re a bit spoilt, we are used to caring about people we’ve known since birth or preferably before like Freddie, and he’s only a little bit involved in this shenanigan really

100% 🙄

@Godesstobe I think you've summed up perfectly what I think as well. Reasons 2 & 3 are what really grate on me as it feels as though they have completely forgotten who their audience are and why so many have listened for such a long time.

How interesting. Can you ask lots of questions and report back here please!